Georgetown students vote overwhelming in favor of $27 fee for slavery reparations

Soldiers who got drafted bro... that's a form of slavery. One can't put a price on a human life taken. Reparations! Let's correct the misdeeds of a broken system boys.

Obviously I am not serious.

So on a serious note, really, how do we decide the amount to be given and for how long? And who? Will this have repaired the damage done?

 

The statement is true, but you really need to stop attributing naturalistic fallacies to others because you're incapable of not making a moralistic fallacy.

 

Will it? The vast majority of people attending the university do not agree.

I am not in favor of slavery reparations. In many cases, people that did not even have family in the USA during slavery would be held responsible. Further where does it stop.

However in this case the student body voted for it and the University has been very active in taking accountability for it’s past actions.

 

Typical left wing ideology.

Go after the innocent to pay for the debts of the guilty.

Someone illegally uses a gun to commit murder? Go after the rights of law abiding citizens by restricting (or removing all together) their 2nd amendment rights.

Someone says something that offends you? Fine restrict 1st amendment rights.

The left is so desperate to find a living villain to blame for slavery? Go after people that were not alive and had nothing to do with slavery, and in fact very likely did not even have ancestors that owned slaves.

On a side note, I wonder how many of you Ilhan Omar defenders would be as quick to dismiss the comments of a white male conservatives congress person if they referred to slavery as “Some people that did some thing?”

 

Did you even read the article? How does the students electing to help the descendants of slaves the UNIVERSITY SOLD have anything to do with what you are talking about????

 

Which statement is true?

 

Yeah I thought you really did not agree with what I posted.

You really have no clue.

 

Intelligent African Americans agree with me
College professors, researchers, those who go to places you don't want to and survey a broad range of issues
None of them have rap albums out, so as I have learnt from other posters they are not worthy of listening to or sell outs, but that only reflects their own lack of reasoning ability

Those are people you want to avoid

Reparations create a false sense of "victory" when the issue is much deeper. A few dollars won't change anything except add to the smugness of people thinking well, I've done all I can, good luck!! Ultimately, you want a society where people are held to the same standard regardless of race and this doesn't do that.

 

You are trying to hard so troll my man that it becomes a little too obvious and thus boring.

 

Sooo how is the money going to be spent?

 

That some groups (races, ethnicities, etc) have a higher average intelligence than others. The methodology for the credible IQ tests are quite robust, being both predictive and repeatable, making them somewhat uniquely scientifically valid within the psych field.

It in no way implies there's anything good or "should be" about it, it's just what is, like pretty much everything in nature, but for society it's important to acknowledge it as we've morphed into one where IQ is the strongest correlating factor to success (higher than what was traditionally true for most of our society's history, work ethic and those two are far ahead of anything else), so its highly consequential, and because like any average, half the population are less than that.

And if half a group or more all get disenfranchised by our "intelligent' economy, and upward mobility is essentially killed off, well, the problems there are fairly profound (which is one of the main reasons i like Yang, without moving in that direction at some point soon, it's going to end very badly)

 

Get ready to be told IQ tests are racist.

 

You're going to have to take that up with the psych field as there's always tons of discussion about IQ in general and if it is representative of intelligence in general. You speak as if there is a consensus agreement that IQ represents all of intelligence?

So...the problem with your argument here in several points then.

First of all, to say that one group is less intelligent than another assumes some kind of inherent ability that just has yet to be proven. If Group A has an average IQ of 100 and Group B has an average IQ of 85 what explains the difference? This is an unknown, while part of IQ is genetic, part of it isn't. Even the biggest proponent of this theory (Charles Murray) would tell you this himself. This would have to be a pretty extensive study to get it done right, so much so that I wonder if it would really be worth it because...

You can take any group of people and find similarities and differences. You can take 100 people of all races in one state and compare them to another 100 and you'd find similarities and differences. If you have a twin, you are not even genetically perfectly similar. Most geneticists when asked about race, at least those I've read about and such, will tell you that there's a greater variety within any group than outside of that group. This makes sense, as, if you're an astrophysicist and your wife is a mathematician and you have 6 kids, there's a good chance one of them will probably be dumb as rocks, maybe more than one...

The fact that one group of people then would have a lower average IQ than another is a pointless statistic, in reality, especially considering that the groups that usually tend to be 'low IQ' are ones that have been disenfranchised and quite frankly historically abused. That's just the reality of history. To just ignore that reality and go "Well, it surely has nothing to do with nurture or environment," then yes, I will question your intentions when it come to this discussion, with good reason, this discussion has a very bloody past.

It is more like a PPG statistic. It really doesn't mean anything because it doesn't take into account context. A player can average a high PPG average and it doesn't really mean they are a good player. There is a greater chance that it means that, sure, but it's not set in stone that if you average over 20ppg in the NBA that you are indeed a good player. So, if you have high IQ, it's not set in stone that you are a useful contributor to society. It's all averages and in a country that stresses the individual (as genetics do) it makes no sense then to group people up by IQ...It's odd to me that conservatives (and some that claim to be libertarians) usually so against identity politics play it here.

I always find this argument from Race/IQ people dishonest as all hell to be honest.

You want to talk about nature, let's talk about it.

What put humans at the top of the food chain? It is intelligence. Not speed, not strength, nothing else but the ability to manipulate tools and outsmart bigger, faster, and stronger animals. When you say one group of humans is thus dumber you are in fact saying that group of humans is inferior. I dare you, since it's not 'Good or bad' to get in front of that group of humans and tell them that they are on average just dumber than another group of humans, tell me how that goes. Tell a mother that her son is dumb as rocks but hey, he's strong, and see how she takes it. Intelligence is prized among people, for good reason, it's what put humans on top. No one (decent at least) wants to raise dumb children.

I don't think it is at all important to acknowledge and it has no use and I'll explain why in a following post...

 

IQ tests aren't racist but statistics such as these have always been used to excuse crimes against humanity. If you look back through history, this very argument has been used to abuse native people and africans, almost without fail, this very same argument has been used. Like, not even a modified version of this argument, it is this actual very same argument. Then, they used skulls (but eventually found out that made no sense) so now we're using IQ. A big issue with it is that it encourages negative stereotypes about a group of people. I know you care little about stereotypes and racism dachuda, but some of us don't like being judged for our race and would like to be instead judged individually...

Now, @Aleron (or anyone really) can you really tell me what this information is good for?

You said that it was important to acknowledge it but I really can't see what good it would be used for other than more discrimination and hate.

You quoted me and said that "you really need to stop attributing naturalistic fallacies to others because you're incapable of not making a moralistic fallacy."

I'd argue the exact opposite, you have put forth the example of a naturalistic fallacy while not even once thinking of the moral implications.

Now, I could argue for days about 'Race Realism' from a more data/scientific point of view, I've given you an example of what that argument would be. Simply put, there is no evidence that any gap between any set of groups is nature or nurture. Even a lot of its proponents will tell you the same, they may fall one way or the other but they know it really can't be proved either way at this point.

But, I'm honestly not interested in that particular debate or discussion. I'm a lot more curious about what use could it really have, because I don't see it.

I've been told that it would be good because then low IQ people would get jobs more suited for their IQ...really? Do we really think we have low IQ people becoming doctors or lawyers at some epidemic rate?

I've been told it would be good to know because we could then understand more about what makes smart people smart...fine, good argument...but why would you exclude other races of people from such a study?

But most amusing to me, and one I've heard a lot, the most honestly....is that it explains most of the racism of this country and disenfranchisement away. Like one big excuse "Well, ignore housing discrimination and education discrimination, because that group is just dumber on average..."

But hey, I'm opening the floor to you and anyone else that can explain to me the uses of this information and what kind of social policy it would drive.

 

I don't have much to say on it personally since such info matters little for making group or policy decisions. I do think it funny that people care so much to a point where it makes them look stupid. Honestly I just think everyone should be given equal opportunities and let them sort out who is more intelligent and hard-working on an individual level. No policy regarding race is ideal. IQ is also largely not important, rather results in real life.

 

I see. Georgetown will go broke. Realistically, when high school students are looking at colleges, there are a lot of things to consider, and a small fee for reparations probably doesn't get included in the consideration set, frankly. Maybe if Georgetown starts to get a reputation at 'that sort of school' because of many little actions like this one, some students might start avoiding it. Of course, others might be more attracted. I guess like any competitor, you pick your strategy and see if you can win.

I did some quick math on the money they raised from the slave sale. Assuming a 6% annual return (a rule of thumb for the long-term returns from the stock market net of inflation), it comes up to about $610 million today. I saw an article saying there may be 1000 present-day descendants. So, roughly $6 million each? Sounds alright. And Georgetown's conscience is washed clean (... for this transaction. Of course, they've also benefited from students and donors who made their money in slaves. We can't ever really be clean).

Of course, the fund the students are proposing doesn't begin to compare in scope to the total I calculated. It's a symbolic gesture and maybe a catalyst, but they probably can't even keep up with the compounding interest on the debt at this rate. Their endowment can cover it, but they're only at ~$1.5 billion. It would actually hurt the school pretty significantly to pay meaningful compensation.

I think I'd completely disagree with that. As the word implies, 'reparations' are specifically for paying for the wrongs you've committed. Which is why I think talking about reparations for slavery now is so problematic because we've let so much time pass. But, for a particular instance like Georgetown where you know about a specific slave sale with individual people, you've got some data to work from. I wouldn't use that word (though it seems like it's going to be used this way in the democratic primary) to talk more generally about racial equity.

 

I figured you'd take this stance since it is actually consistent with other stances but there is basically agreement here.

Only thing I'd say is that people care because this kind of science has a really bad history. There is also this trick of feedback loops.

If you get people thinking one group on average is dumber that means things will continue as they are. If you set low expectations for a child then that's what they'll be. We've had several studies showing this exact thing too.

 

I am a intelligent Agri an American I have a Masters and several certifications in education.

if you feel this way why did you agree with my post?

Not intelligent enough to understand the nuance of my post?

 

I have zero issues with members of Georgetown's student body supporting reparations for the exploitation of blacks by the university. Honestly, I think it should come out of the school's endowment instead of student fees......but I don't see it happening anyway. Reparations for black people seems to be the "last straw" for many White Americans. Benefits have been provided to Amerindians and Japanese populations but zero has been provided for Afro-descendants. We haven't been compensated for the decades of racist "Jim Crow" policies that stagnated the development of our communities.......I don't see this happening either.

For the record, I support reparations for Afro-descendant people in the Western hemisphere. We were royally screwed by the economic agendas of European and America powers. This set the stage for many of the issues that we still face today as a community.

*Flame suit on*