B-Bob, They very well may, I'll probably look into it, but I would say that it would have as much to do with sample size as anything else. I did a similar comparison with Pettitte in that huge thread that had similar results. The more data that is accumulated, the more a player's stats will converge towards his career regular season numbers.
Last year DJ hit .324 while Arod hit .298, Tejada .278 and Nomar hit .301 I realize that DJ doesnt have the power of the other 3 but the BA is better. I guess I will agree to disagree. Besides, you are never going to convince me that DJ is worse then anyone {even if your right } peace man
I hear you, and I respect that, mathematically speaking. It may just come down to an ineffible line between statistical fluctuation and the subjective notion of 'being clutch.' From my vantage point, I've been cheering against that smug MF'er for years, and he always seems to get a hit when they need it, and he always seems to pull some ugly-looking backhand, pogo-jumping play from shallow left-field to throw out somebody at first, when they need it. Bastid.
That pretty much sums up your argument: Better BA = Better Hitter. Nothing could be farther from the truth.
I`m not sure you can really tell a "Clutch" player based on stats. Look at what DJ has done in such dramatic fashion in the big games, he`s hit HR`s to ice games, he has made fantastic plays in the field. I`m not sure stats will show you these things and thats what he has above the other SS in the league. Nomar, A*-Rod and Miguel maybe better then DJ but lets see them do it with the game on the line in the WS as DJ had done time and time again
Hey Hammer, Since you are like stat man and everything, can you tell me what Nomar Garciaparra's batting average was when J-Ho (I mean J-Lo) was in attendance at Red Sox games? Any chance of you being able to tell me what Manny's BA was when he wore his hair in corn rows compared to straight?? Thanks.
I'm right there with you. I cheer against the guy, but when the moment counts he always seems to be there. That's probably why he gets the rep as being clutch. You never remember when he strikes out in a crucial situation, but you'll always remember when he delivers in the same situation. I think it's the way our mind works more than anything else.
I think your off base with that statement but respect your opinion. I didnt say it makes them a better hitter although it is a large piece of the pie along with OPS, SLG, OPS. Normally when someone tries to discredit another player with a better average they say it doesnt matter, which in truth it does.
B-Bob, I'm having a difficult time finding career post-season splits, so I'll address regular season for now. From the years 2001-2003, here are some cumulative numbers for Jeter. BA = 0.309 OPS = 0.830 Runners on BA = 0.329 Runners on OPS = 0.845 Runners in Scoring Position BA = 0.325 Runners in Scoring Position OPS = 0.838 Bases Loaded BA = 0.355 Bases Loaded OPS = 0.742 Runners on, 2 Out BA = 0.319 Runners on, 2 Out OPS = 0.742 Scoring Position, 2 Out BA = 0.333 Scoring Position, 2 Out OPS = 0.907 Close & Late BA = 0.236 Close & Late OPS = 0.681 You can see that these numbers are very good, but are still very much in line with his overall totals, pointing back to the fact that good players perform well in most circumstances. That's what makes them good players. Nomar, I'm working on those numbers for you.
I never said that batting average doesn't matter, I just said those other numbers are more important. OPS is a better number because it takes batting average into consideration, as well as a couple of other abilities, ie drawing walks and hitting for power.
Edit - Sorry, obviously I meant Manny in my earlier post. I'm always getting my soon-to-be former RedSox superstars confused.
Sorry for disappointing. Here's some more advanced stuff for you to determine which SS had the best 2003. 2003 Offensive Win Shares A-Rod - 26 Nomah - 19 Tejada - 18 Jeter - 16 2003 VORP A-Rod - 86.3 Nomah - 58.3 Tejada - 50.4 Jeter - 48
Let's just give Houston and Boston the NLCS and ALCS titles right now then. Would anyone in their right mind argue that Jeter is a better overall player than A-Rod or Nomar? Tejada....maybe. Both players have had recent injuries, but I wouldn't be upset to have any of those guys as my shortstop.
Well, things just got worse for the Yankees. Red Sox sign Keith Foulke, baby!!! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
Awesome. Red Sox fans can feel 1000 times worse next year for making all of these moves and STILL not winning it all. THE CURSE LIVES!!!
No such thing as a curse. But by all means, continue to comfort yourself about Theo Epstein running circles around Boy George and Cashman.
BTW - Sons of Sam Horn have some hilarious nicknames for both Red Sox and Yankees: Yankees MFYs - MotherF*ckingYankees (my personal favorite!) Fruit Bat - Mariano Rivera (don't understand that one) Shemp - Hideki Matsui (LOL!) SiaS - Steinbrenner (means **** in a Suit) Captain Intangibles - Derek Jeter (LMAO on that one) Beetlejuice (also Mushmouth) - Alfonso Soriano Red Sox Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer - Johnny Damon The Loaded Right Arm of God - Pedro Martinez Flo, Florida - David Ortiz (don't understand that one unless they are saying he looks like Flo Evans from "Good Times") Cabin Mirror - Kevin Millar (that came from a Japanese paper that translated Millar's name wrong to "Cabin Mirror").
