I am a little late with my analysis/opinion/comment/my damn opinion of this Hakeem situation. Maybe too late. But here goes. I don't see why alot of people on this board seem so surprised that Hakeem left. The minute he started to change his mind last year about retiring, you had to figure that Dream was going to cause some trouble. And he did. He started complaining about his role on the team. He started to complain during wins. He complained even more during losses. He complained and asked to be cut, traded, released, or whatever it took to go to another team. Many of us long time fans still remembered how Dream was way back when he was just Akeem. Basically the same person minus the temper. The fact is that most of us erased that image of Dream the minute John Starks ran out of bricks in game seven in 1994. And for those left behind, Dream finished the brainwashing job in 1995 while having David Robinson be his b**** for a week. The contract extension followed. But the rumblings were there. We just ignored it. Remember Barkley calling Dream a baby when he first arrived? Dream complained about not getting the ball then too. That was 5 years ago. The point is that the Dream we saw this past month is the Dream we all knew was here but was hidden by the ring, the WCF appearances, and the Scottie Twat fiasco. No one can blame Dream for being so prideful. No one can blame him for wanting more participation in game situations. But what I do blame him for is the ego that he hid for years making us think that he was the "different type of athlete" and that he wasn't like the selfish, money hungry, hype seeking players that were surfacing in the new NBA. We all loved how Dream stepped up during the lockout and started what many think was the domino effect to end the stalemate. Dream is like all athletes. Basically, he wants to feel wanted. He wants the money. He needs to be catered to or else. He wants the fame. He goes to Toronto seeking a championship but can you really say that if the Pacers offered 3 million more guaranteed dollars or 2 more guaranteed years, Dream wouldn't of went there? You don't think that he would of said things like "Leading the young stars on this team"? For all that Barkley was hated for when his mouth and his ego reared its ugly head, the man showed loyalty to a team that he was on for barely 4 years, never won anything with and he owed nothing to. He was willing to play for squat just to win a ring. Sure, Dream has two of them. But he says the same thing Barkley did. The difference is that Barkley showed with his actions what his mouth was spewing out. I remember Jordan saying he would "retire" before going to playing for another city or playing for another coach or playing for another city. Thats loyalty from a man who is arguably the biggest ego trip on the planet. Yet, when it came to basketball, his loyalty and appreciation still gave him 35 million per year and rings to boot. We compare Dream to Jordan but when it comes to that particular part of the business, there is no comparison. This is a young team who needed that type of leadership. No one on the Bulls could lead like Jordan. Look at Pippen. At I know for damn sure that nobody on the Rockets can lead like Olajuwon could of if he wanted to. Just him opening his mouth to a young player like Griffin would of gave the kid goosebumps on his goosebumps. What Dream could of taught would of been immesurable to someone destined to play the paint for the next 15 years. Dream could of stayed here and played for 1 mil. Whats the big deal when you have 70 mil in the bank? Dream spoke of loyalty when the Rockets first wanted to trade him. Rudy showed it to him then. This week, Dream showed he was the typical athlete and slapped Rudy smack dab in the face for his effort. Luv ya, Dream. But you disappointed me. I still wish you well. But, damn. I thought you were different.
No I don't, but I'd love to see some quotes. I never did think Dream liked Barkley, and I figured he somewhat gave up. I also recall Drexler retiring early, because he was sick of Barkley. How can you quit like that? Barkley's mouth is just that...a social mouth. On the court, he is the epitome of a workhorse competitor. Almu, nice post. I completely agree that Dream is not the off court person we saw on the court. He is not elegant and graceful with teammates. He publicly admonished Sleepy Floyd in not passing him the ball in a playoff game, and the next game, he and Floyd were only the second combo to score 40+ in a playoff game in NBA history. Then he says that's the Floyd I love. Dream also called his owner a "coward." I honestly believe many of the "injuries" were PR cover-ups by the Rockets to keep his image intact while Rudy had him in the doghouse or Hakeem was not wanting to play. No wonder Pippen left if Barkley and Hakeem were feuding.
btw: In all fairness to Dream, I think superstars can complain and get coaches fired. Magic Larry Isiah all did. I'll take the history making franchise player over a coach any day.
Barkley destroyed the Rockets. Trading for him was one of the worst things the Rockets could have done. He managed to piss off Clyde, Mario, and Hakeem. Dream was still averaging 26 points before Barkley came along. I don't know why all of you LOVE Barkley, and HATE Hakeem so much. Barkley managed to drive off half the Rockets team, but no one would dare to insult him. No, the real jerk is the guy that gave Houston it's only major sports titles.
How do you read this as anyone "HATING" Hakeem? you drama queen. Almu ans I (and likely others) are merely saying that we have more respect for Barkley as an off-court star than Drexler and Hakeem combined. Saying Barkley pissed them off is foolish. They pissed themselves off. Further, if they allowed a vocal but truthful man upset them to the point of not performing at top levels, then they quit on us. Is that what you are saying happened?? Saying Barkley ruined us when we went 22-1 out of the gate until Dream got "injured" is not fair. Saying Barkley ruined us because Malone bear-hugged Drexler to cheat us out of a long-awaited confrontation with the Bulls is not fair.
And Barkley wasn't injured half of that year? See what I mean? Everyone loves to defend Barkley, but he did NOTHING for the Rockets. Saying that Hakeem is a sellout for going to a team that WANTED him is not fair.
Why are people trying to stir up a non-existant feud between Barkley and Olajuwon? I remember Rudy saying one of the reasons they went after Barkley was because Olajuwon was really impressed with him after they played on the Olympic team together. So it was partially because of Olajuwon that Barkley was here to begin with. Another Sir Charles fact that I think ZRB pointed out in previous posts, is that the year after Charles played for 1 mil. He played for 9 mil, and played in less than 20 games. That was Charlie Thomas and he was a coward. Anyone remember when Hakeem had his nose broken and was taken to the locker room, but still wanted to play that same game? Hakeem often came back from injuries earlier than predicted. Then later Charlie Thomas accused Olajuwon of faking injuries. I don't blame Hakeem for calling him a Coward at all. This is the same Charlie Thomas that ordered the team to play Sampson while he was injured so that he would look worse, and the Rockets fans wouldn't be so mad when they traded him. Anyway despite these problems Hakeem and Charlie worked their problems out. That's great, why bring up an old settled argument again. I don't think anyone believes that the Dream was flawless. The guy was human, and made mistakes both on and off the court. But at the same time he did some really classy things above and beyond the call of duty as well. Dream exhibited class few atheletes in history have done. This doesn't mean that he was a saint, or never made mistakes, or didn't have an ego, or go about things the wrong way at times. I think it would be good if everyone who only 'hates' on Hakeem would recognize some of the good things he has done, and that those that can 'see no wrong or flaw' in Hakeem, recognize that he, too has made mistakes like anyone.
Don't forget about MJ getting Doug Collins fired from Chicago. How Ironic is it that he hire him in Washington.
Let's compare the star "off-court" Drexler- ran 6 miles every day, lifted weights, solid citizen. Hakeem- worked with UH track coach, no alcohol, lifted weights, solid citizen. Barkley- would not work out, was an alcoholic much of his career, frequented strip clubs, threw people through windows, did not maintain his weight. Barkley's Rocket stint was ruined because he did not dedicate himself to his job, and he became injury prone. I agree with Z, Barkey's injuries were a result of a complete lack of dedication to the Rockets and the Rocket's fans. Remember the Utah playoff series that the Rockets lost after Barkley got injured? Remember Barkley's last year? Barkley's own trainer said on the radio the other day that Barkley could not make the come back this year because he was not use to working out, and he was lazy. "Warriors" are not lazy, they get in the weight room in the offseason and earn their money. Barkley was not a warrior- he was an under achieving loud mouth drunk that did not earn the money he made as a Rocket.
Wow! Dream leaves.....and all of a sudden....he is the devil Wonder what the reaction would've been if he stayed. Don't be fickle y'all....its a business. It is tradition that things must and always will change......Dream is in Toronto, MJ is in D.C. its a business...LIVE WITH IT!
While Barkley certainly had his faults, the fact of the matter was that he was the most efficient offensive player we had during his tenure here. When he had the ball, he either scored or was fouled. Why do you think the league instituted the time limit on backing down a player??? More than anything else, Rudy designs his offense around the most consistent players. You can't blame Barkley for Rudy's coaching decisions. Furthermore, Barkley was an excellent clubhouse influence on the younger players. While he was tough with them, he also was very generous in sharing his knowledge (something Hakeem has never been good about). I can tell you with almost 100% certainty that Matt Maloney wouldn't have even been a passable player in 96-97 if it weren't for the support and education he received from Barkley. As for Hakeem, Mario and Clyde not liking Barkley, none of these players (as much as I loved them during their time with the team) ever had a reputation for being easy to get along with. Mario has b****ed on every team he's ever played for, and Clyde was known around the league as being an outright a$$hole. And Hakeem basically got annoyed any time the offense didn't run through him. That doesn't discount from their talents, but there are two sides to every story. Finally, while it might have been nice for Charles to take better care of himself, you have to remember that his greatest talents were his mental understanding for the game and his mental toughness. Barkley was a 6'4 PF who DOMINATED for most of his career and it wasn't because he was the most athletic - it was because he understood the game so well. And while his body may have broken down on him in the end, it's not like his emotions ever got the better of him (unlike gym rats like Pipper and D.Robinson, who are essentially pumped-up sissies) in a game. And personally, if some 5-foot intoxicated punk with a Napolean complex came up to me and insisted on picking a fight, I'd probably throw him through a window too.
ZRB, here you go again! How did Barkley destroy the Rockets when he helped them win 57 games in his first season? Yes, he got hurt but 1 of his 2 injuries was a freak injury when he collided with Shawn Bradley (I could say something mean here about Bradley, but I will resist). I think the Rockets had a 26-5 record when Barkley, Drexler, and Olajuwon all started. If they had the homecourt advantage, there's no doubt in my mind that they would have beaten the Jazz and made it to the finals. Yes, Olajuwon's points per game went down, but Barkley was pretty much instrumental in us beating the Sonics, who we beat 3-1 in the regular season and then 4-3 in the playoffs. Hey Z, you remember all the times that the Sonics beat us before Barkley don't you? It was only like 80 straight times. Olajuwon's production went down when he had knee surgery in the '97-98 season. He has never been the same player since, imo. Barkley came back from a devastating leg injury that would have made most people just to give up, but not him. Yes, he doesn't have the greatest off-season workout program, but I wouldn't tell him that he couldn't do something because he would go out and make you look stupid. At least with CB, what you see is what you get and he tells it like he sees it, he doesn't mince words. Not like Olajuwon who presents this fake image and plays on people's sympathies who are patsies, like you. Do you think he cares what ZRB of Clutchcity or anyone else on this board feels about him? So, get over it and don't blame other people like Barkley...although therapy might be your only help, ZRB
I don't know how the hell ZRB sees my post as hating Hakeem. I guess he is reading it backwards with dark sunglasses. My point is for those who are a little slow is that Dream cried about loyalty from athletes when in the end, he is just like all the other athletes. If you actually think that he went to Toronto ony for a chance to win you are diluting yourself. He had a chance to win here AND be the one and sole leader/mentor/big brother AND he had a chance to be part of the next great team AND he had the chance to make money and keep everything intact. As for Barkley and the trade, heck, I never liked it. Look at my posts in 1996 and you will see that I was completely against it. But you can't deny that the minute management went to Barkley and asked him to take a pay cut or to do ANYTHING for the team, he did it. He took a paycut. He took less shots. He CAME OFF THE FREAKIN BENCH just for the damn team. This is a guy who is 50 best of all time and arguably top 3 PF's of all time and when the going got really tough pounded out 30 pts and 20 rebounds during the final playoff games for this organization. Don't think I hate Dream because you are reading what your head is telling you. I don't hate him. I love him. But I am disappointed in his decision to leave the city when we gave him so much support for his efforts AND showed him the loyalty that he consistantly b****ed about there being a lack of.
Barkley had 33 rebounds in his first game against Phoenix. He would have been in the top 5 in rebounding in his first season and last if he made enough games. Rockets could never beat Sonics until he came and that all changed. He took a pay cut, something your hero would never think of doing, so the team could get Quitten. I could go on and on if I wanted to, but something tells me that I would be talking to a wall. And what about the last 2 years with your hero, Olajuwon, Z? Playing 102 games out of a possible 164 looks like to me that he was injured for half of those years. And when he was healthy, he was pitiful except for about maybe 20 games. I guess you think that Drexler and Moses Malone never did anything for the Rockets, either.
Thanks. We were all sitting here waiting for your analysis. Carroll Dawson seemed surprised, and he's probably more "in the know" than the posters on this board, no? I seem to remember him speaking out once. Perhaps you can provide some quotes to the contrary? So basically you were setting him up to fail due to your out-of-whack expectations? What was he "making you think" when he repeatedly signed shoe deals for less money? That Hakeem really knows how to pull the wool over everyone's eyes by turning down big money to help kids afford his merchandise. And what's selfish about asking his teammates to share in his MVP ceremony? Was he just trying to fool you then, too? Great actor, that Hakeem. You know so much about the man, it's scary. Rarely do people so reclusive their entire lives actually secretly want fame, but apparently Hakeem is that way, according to Almu. I guess I should've known by the way he was always jumping in front of the cameras, that he wants the spotlight so bad. Dangit, Almu, I wish I had your powers of perception. Loyalty? LOL. Good one. He showed so much loyalty to Phoenix. "Just to win a ring"? LOL. The guy needed to repair his image. He saw an opportunity, he took it. Bottom line. He made as much off endorsements as anyone save Jordan. There was no "sacrifice". He was paid handsomely the following year, after he shopped himself around to every contender in the league. My, how are memories fade (or are selective). Just a brief sidebar here, but are we talking about the same Jordan poised to come back and play for the Wizards? If there's some other Jordan you're referring to, I apologize. That would seem to make more sense, after all. As a matter of fact, forget I even said anything. That would be so ridiculous for you to have brought up that Jordan, that I feel stupid for even suggesting it. Please forgive me. "Rudy showed it to him"? Cmon. How loyal is it to entertain trade offers for someone who is responsible for everything you have? I'm not even convinced it was Rudy who did that. Do you have any idea what Charles Barkley, the man you praise in this little editorial, did when he found out that Phoenix was "shopping him around"? He trashed the entire organization. And you compare Hakeem to that? Selective memory. Not on the practice "court". And not on the defensive "court" either. Are all the entries for "dumbest quote of the year" in yet? If not, I've got a last-minute choice. I've yet to hear anyone blame the Pippen fiasco on Hakeem. That has to be an all-time low. I think RodneyMcCray covered this. Sad. So sad. Welcome to the BBS.
The Sun coming up. War in the Middle East. My 6month daughter puking on my best tie. Freak being himself as usual. Ah, the sure things in life. I just wonder sometimes when Freak starts a topic, does he come back and break everything he wrote down to the most minute, anal proton or does he log on as someone else, posts, then comes back as the Freak to rip it? Ah, the sure things in life.
RodneyMcCray, Dude, I purposely said "off court star" to consider ONLY what he did as a player off the court. Your concept of citizen morality has no place here...take that to the Hangout, unless you are prepared to include the morality of Babe Ruth, Pete Rose, and Mickey Mantle. ZRB, How can you say Barkley did NOTHING for Houston. If you were at the Summit the night he body-slammed Shaq, you wouldn't be saying that!!!!!!!!
