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Would you want to compete with about 2% chance of winning a championship?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by meh, Jul 15, 2010.

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At what point do you think a team should rebuild

  1. Where the Rockets are. Playoff team but not considered championship contender

    25 vote(s)
    9.5%
  2. When you believe you'll make a 1st round exit

    10 vote(s)
    3.8%
  3. When you're not sure you're even a playoff team

    90 vote(s)
    34.2%
  4. You should always try your best to put the best team together

    138 vote(s)
    52.5%
  1. meh

    meh Member

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    As I was working out at the gym today, I listened to Matt and Adam on the podcast. They and the callers were basically talking about how the Rockets have no chance, and we may be better off rebuilding. It got me thinking. As fans, at what point do you believe a team should should stop competing?

    Using just some simple math, suppose the Rockets at their best are in the 2nd tier in the west behind the Lakers. But due to Yao having to come back from injury, we don't get homecourt(5th seed or lower) due to inferior regular season record.

    Without homecourt, if the Rockets played a comparable team, I'd say the odds of winning the series at 40-50%. Yes, I know it can't be 50%, but I'm using it as the most optimistic projection. It's probably closer to 40% instead.

    Now, if the Rockets played a superior team, like the Lakers or the Heat, I give them maybe 30-40% chance of winning a series. Again, 40% IMO is reaching, but like I said, let's be optimistic. Again, probably closer to 30%.

    Given that the road to the finals go through the Lakers at some point, and using the above numbers, the Rockets have ~5-10% chance of reaching the finals. If they meet a superior team there, say a 60+ win Heat team, we're talking about 1-4% chance of winning the whole thing. Average it out, say 2% chance of winning the whole thing.

    I know this isn't a scientific guess, but my point is that we have a small, but not negligible chance of winning next year. Is that enough? Or should we like many Houston fans believe that we should trade Yao, etc. to rebuild?
     
  2. echu888

    echu888 Member

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    That was incredibly scientific, with many supporting facts and calculations. JCDenton would be proud.
     
    2 people like this.
  3. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    I'm not of the opinion that its championship or bust.

    If its a choice between us getting to the conference finals and the team being blown up -- who here would take the latter?

    I also think the Rockets plan is to stay competitive while also retaining the flexibility to upgrade talent and make significant roster changes. I like that approach.
     
  4. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Meh.



    And hell yes, you should compete. You compete every season, and if there is a player on the Rockets or a coach who doesn't want to win? Get rid of them. Compete with what you have, try to build a better team, and play to win, unless the playoffs are completely out of reach and a loss will move you up in the lottery.

    (I'm looking at you, Mr. Van Gundy!)
     
  5. meh

    meh Member

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    Thank you. I did indeed take many a minutes to come up with that number.

    Perhaps you'll enlighten me on how very off on that guess?
     
  6. meh

    meh Member

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    See, I'm of this thought too. I enjoyed the heck out of the 2009 playoffs. We lost in the 2nd round, but it was fun, it was competitive. This despite that Lakers team was even better than the Lakers team that likely will play next year.

    Yet it seems a lot of people just believe that if you're not the Lakers or the Heat, then you might as well rebuild until you have a bunch of superstars. The thought baffles me, which is why I made this thread.
     
  7. EffTheJazz!!!

    EffTheJazz!!! Member

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    During the season, you always play and compete to win.

    You can think about rebuilding in the offseason, after seeing how the season went. But no matter what, you never think of losing during the season.
     
  8. Juxtaposed Jolt

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    With the way the questions are worded, who wouldn't choose the fourth option?

    (Granted, two people who can't read chose something otherwise, but hey, its a free country!)
     
  9. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    It's really hard to say - if the Roster remains as it is, I don't think we have enough to get past the L.A., Miami's and Boston.

    In order to advance in the playoffs all the way, you need a perimeter guy or two who can get off a very high percentage shot in the closing minutes / seconds of a game. While there are exceptions - ala Detroit, that team was very sound in nearly every aspect of the game, and had quite a few legit all-stars as well despite no superstar per se.

    It's no coincidence that the big name stars are the one who win the championships. Kobe, Wade, Pierce of late.

    You look at a team like San Antonio and there championships - and they didn't have a big name perimeter star but Tony Parker and Many Ginobli and Robert Horry for some.

    Look at how these teams are built - all with Clutch performers. L.A. has Kobe, but it also has Fischer who is really underrated in the clutch. Boston had Paul Pierce - he could get a shot of at anytime and in the closing minutes of their championship run the ball went into his hands often with success.

    The Rockets are a bit shaky in that department. You are going to have trouble getting the ball into Yao with 10 seconds remaining - not enough time. and the refs allow for more contact in those situations.

    So really it comes down to Brooks, Chase, Lowry, Ariza, and Martin. Brooks is clearly clutch, but teams can contain him and we've seen that at times.

    Lowry and Ariza aren't great outside shooters (I know some may disagree). Chase has the potential - but he's still developing so it's unclear when he can take on that burden.

    So that leaves us with Martin. And I just don't see him as that sort of guy. He's very efficient, and he gets to the line, but can you put the ball in his hands with 2 seconds and have him get a shot that's 35-40% accurate? I don't think so.

    So that's my key thing with us and our team (beyond staying healthy). Brooks is good, and he provides hope, but against the Lakers - they will make sure they put someone who will bother his jump shot. You need another person. Maybe even a third who can hit that big shot considering that L.A. is going to throw Kobe, Artest, and Fischer at the perimeter - all very excellent defenders.

    I know people may say - hey - why does the end of the 4th quarter really matter that much? I think because at least 1 game in a series is going to come down to the closing minutes and the ability to execute in the clutch - and against evenly matched teams, that may very well be the difference in advancing or staying home.

    My 403 cents.
     
  10. ILoveTheRockets

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    one flaw...

    Now, if the Rockets played a superior team, like the Lakers or the Heat, I give them maybe 30-40% chance of winning a series. Again, 40% IMO is reaching, but like I said, let's be optimistic. Again, probably closer to 30%.

    If we play the heat then we make it to the NBA Finals. Anything can happen in a 7 game series.

    and forget those stats. there is no stat for hustle,grit, and determination.

    Rockets gonads > Heat gonads
     
  11. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Ah, then I'll step off my indignant high horse and give a hearty, "I agree!!" :cool:
     
  12. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    I believe the best most teams can do is be one of the players, and hope things break your way.

    Especially without a superstar that a team gets lucky to draft.

    Injuries play a role, chemistry and sometimes matchups.

    The Rox were not the favorites their two championship years, and still we won em.

    I would be happy signing Scola and hoping this team is good enough.

    If not you use some of those assets at the trade deadline to take advantage of teams with buyers remorse.

    DD
     
  13. Htown's2kFinest

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    rebuilding isn't fun and it's no guarantee for anything.
     
  14. ILoveTheRockets

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    why is everyone counting Miami and Boston as teams the rockets need to get past in the playoffs? Cause they are not. If we make the playoffs we won't be a 8 seed, we'll be a 4-6 seed in the WEST. A lot can happen until the WCF.
     
  15. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Hey, maybe we should just ask the Clippers how they feel about prepetually rebuilding.

    DD
     
  16. napalm06

    napalm06 Huge Flopping Fan

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    Aye. I think people forget the latter.
     
  17. rocketschamp3

    rocketschamp3 Member

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    the Rockets dont need to rebuild we got young guys who have lots of potential.
    We need a second superstar thats it.
     
  18. Pest_Ctrl

    Pest_Ctrl Member

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    If winning the Championship was completely random, then each team had slightly more than 3% chance at the ring. If we realistically only have 2%, that's not too bad, not too far off the completely random case.
     
  19. meh

    meh Member

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    Just realized I didn't give my viewpoint. Sorry if it gave you a wrong impression.
     
  20. meh

    meh Member

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    You have to win 4 series to win the championship. If the odds of winning each series is 50% exactly, it would be 6.25%.
     

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