You must be a Harden hater to say those guys are better than him. Luka and Kyrie both on the same team couldn't even get the Mavs to playoffs. Kyrie has never been better than Harden. Just cuz he's flashier and people like his game doesn't mean a thing. Harden can drag the worst teams to the playoffs by himself. He even flashed it in ecf. Yes he's declining and it's not a great fit. But he's still one of the top players in the league. If you are saying for the Rockets I can see Halliburton and Lamelo are better fits. Simply cuz of age. But neither one of them are close to Harden..., Lamelo can't even stay on the court.
If the Rockets trade a bunch of youth to appease Harden instead of adding other vets and letting these guys improve. I may get on A.S. Level with Mr Harden.
At this point it’s not clear if Harden is better than Jrue or FVV? Lol, seriously? Jrue Holiday in the playoffs this year: 18, 7, and 8 on 40/29/69 splits it’s crickets for him tho don’t even get me started on FVV
It is such a terrible idea to mortgage the future for such a short gain. Harden will give you about 2-3 years. That’s it.
You also have all the Nets assets you got for him and cap space. Use that if if you have to. With natural improvement from players a better coach and you know Harden as well you should be able to do something. Practically nothing you can do will give a real possibility to win it all. So take what I said above and improve otherwise winning less than 70 games in 3 years will be a giant waste.
sooooo.... Harden left bc the rox 'werent good enough' and he wanted to be in a better position to win a championship.... and now he's considering returning after we've had one of the worst records for the last 3 straight years... if that doesnt provide u enough to question either a) his toughness or b) his desire to win... then idk what to tell yall edit misspellings - lol
Personally I think the rebuild is not in the best shape and I would be okay with a Harden return. My main concern is that we end up kicking the can down the road for too long and end up sucking for another 4-5 years. If we continue to just throw these kids out there and hope they one day wake up and learn how to play winning basketball we aren’t going to get very far, we need vets that can come in and elevate the floor of this team. I would like to see Jalen Green in a playoff game before I sign him to a max extension and commit to him as the future of the team. The goal isn’t to necessarily win a title in the next few years with Harden but to get the young guys we do have to grow up and find out who’s worth keeping. Then hopefully they can take over and lead us to the next level. We’ve had 6 first round picks in the past 2 years and are going into year 4 of a rebuild, it’s time to find out what we got.
Harden expects the Rockets to love him unconditionally and he is not wrong. Part of the franchise still would give him a big contract.........but I take solace that a guy like you thinks otherwise, that is the smart choice. 2 year contract at best for me. Take it or leave it. The best for him is to chase the title and just fade out.
Yeah…. all those “easy shots” translated to 4.2 PPG for Paul Reed and 3.5 PPG for PJ Tucker. Really killing it there Sammie Harden for his career has a LESS than 2:1 assist to turnover ratio at 1.89. That is absolutely fooking pathetic for a point guard and you’re trying to claim he’s “one of the best humans when it comes to vision and passing”? Lol seriously? The audacity and delusion of you Harden fanbois is unreal. The only thing he’s the best at is being a turnover merchant. He has 6 turnover titles. The most in NBA HISTORY and a record that likely won’t ever be broken. Pretty impressive for a sorry ass bum that didn’t even start his first 3 years in the league. To put things into perspective even Westbrick has an above 2:1 assist to turnover ratio.
You can also flip the coin and look at it from when he actually started being a PG when Mike D put him in that position but when they got CP3/Westbrook he went more into scoring guard natural position or you could use the combo G title, then he went back to being PG with Nets/Sixers stint, which his assist to turnover ratio still could be what you posted but those are the seasons I would use for claiming him to be the actual PG The turnovers are just what it is, from high usage ball in hands which will lead to that, but can't defend it, no diff than Kidd/Bron etc having lot of turnovers for their career because they had/have the ball and are assist hunting The audacity of Harden dislikers to say the only thing he did well was turn the ball over is clearly one track mind / sided plastic counterfeit 3$ bill buffoonery You mention his turnover titles but gloss over his multi scoring and assist titles which is also pretty impressive not starting first few seasons of career At least bring both to the table so you won't look like such a natural born hater, but if you can't help it, then so be it and do you, props
Luka, Steph, Dame, SGA, Kyrie, Trae, Ja, Jamal Murray, DeAaron Fox, LaMelo, Haliburton are all better - and with the exception of Steph are all younger. None have showed the steep decline in athleticism like Harden who will continue to age poorly. At this point it's not clear he's any better than Jrue or FVV. That's not a max player - particularly from age 34 thru 37... Not necessarily a 'cool story' but clearly it shows he's not 'a top 3 PG in the league'. 5 of the guys I mentioned are all-NBA (first, second or third team). Harden was not even 3rd team all-NBA. Harden didn't get selected to the all-star game this year as a starter, reserve or injury replacement. He's still a very good player, but he's not worth anything near a 4-year max deal - particularly from age 34-37. Here's more evidence of his NOT max status: https://bleacherreport.com/articles...-as-a-max-alpha-player-is-over-amid-fa-rumors All that being said, we've got money to spend, and I believe that Tillman Fertitta will likely blow his payroll on Harden at whatever it takes. If the deal is 2 years plus team options, it won't kill us, but if it's 4-years guaranteed it will be the NBA's worst contract. I also don't think Harden takes anything less than a 4-year deal, with at least 3 fully guaranteed. Morey is under pressure and so is Fertitta. Those two also don't like each other. That works in Harden's favor. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
The thing is Jason Kidd and LeBron have lots of turnovers cause of the sheer number of seasons played not because they’re turnover machines with terrible ratios like Harden. Kidd and LeBron also started from day 1. It’s just an overall stupid comparison to bring those guys up as examples to try and deflect on Harden or sneak him into their level of efficiency. Jason Kidd 19 NBA seasons. 3:1 Assist to Turnover ratio. 2nd all time in assists. 12,091 assists and 4,003 turnovers. LeBron James 20 NBA seasons. Also, not even a point guard. Still greater than 2:1 assist to turnover ratio. He was even better when he was the primary ball handler and played majority at PG for a couple of seasons. James Harden 14 NBA seasons. You can try to argue whatever point you were trying to prove in your first paragraph. Either way 14 seasons is a large ass sample. He’s got less than 2:1 assist to turnover ratio. It’s terrible for a point guard/primary ball handler. Harden only has ohhh 5,076 more assists to tie Kidd’s assist totals yet he’s only 269 turnover away from tying Kidds total turnovers. Again, dumb to bring up Kidd as a comparison. Why would I mention his scoring titles when I was responding to Sammie when he called Harden “one of the best humans when it comes to ball handling/play making vision and passing? Seems like something a Harden fan club member feeling inadequate would bring up. Harden fanbois main premise of bringing Harden back is because they think we lack a playmaker and point guard. That is true. I disagree that Harden is that guy. Of course his assists were going to be inflated and turnovers lower when playing with KD/Irving and Joel Embiid. The first year he won the assist title with us back in 2016-2017 was with a less than 2:1 ratio. Of course YOU would crown him for that. If you understood hoops you’d realize that’s not impressive…. At all. I’m sure there’s posters like you on ThunderFans.com that crown Westbrick for his 2 scoring titles and 3 assist titles. It is what it is.
@Asian Sensation The thing is Jason Kidd and LeBron have lots of turnovers cause of the sheer number of seasons played not because they’re turnover machines with terrible ratios like Harden. Kidd and LeBron also started from day 1. It’s just an overall stupid comparison to bring those guys up as examples to try and deflect on Harden or sneak him into their level of efficiency. Jason Kidd 19 NBA seasons. 3:1 Assist to Turnover ratio. 2nd all time in assists. 12,091 assists and 4,003 turnovers. LeBron James 20 NBA seasons. Also, not even a point guard. Still greater than 2:1 assist to turnover ratio. He was even better when he was the primary ball handler and played majority at PG for a couple of seasons. James Harden 14 NBA seasons. You can try to argue whatever point you were trying to prove in your first paragraph. Either way 14 seasons is a large ass sample. He’s got less than 2:1 assist to turnover ratio. It’s terrible for a point guard/primary ball handler. Harden only has ohhh 5,076 more assists to tie Kidd’s assist totals yet he’s only 269 turnover away from tying Kidds total turnovers. Again, dumb to bring up Kidd as a comparison. Why would I mention his scoring titles when I was responding to Sammie when he called Harden “one of the best humans when it comes to ball handling/play making vision and passing? Seems like something a Harden fan club member feeling inadequate would bring up. Harden fanbois main premise of bringing Harden back is because they think we lack a playmaker and point guard. That is true. I disagree that Harden is that guy. Of course his assists were going to be inflated and turnovers lower when playing with KD/Irving and Joel Embiid. The first year he won the assist title with us back in 2016-2017 was with a less than 2:1 ratio. Of course YOU would crown him for that. If you understood hoops you’d realize that’s not impressive…. At all. I’m sure there’s posters like you on ThunderFans.com that crown Westbrick for his 2 scoring titles and 3 assist titles. It is what it is.[/QUOTE] _---_-------------------+++-++ If you can follow basic words I mentioned there is no way to defend his turnover titles but you are so caught up in your Harden melting pot that I guess you glossed over that, plus I Am pretty sure Kidd had a lot more turnovers in his prime than he did as he aged since he didn't play the volume minutes as he aged, and Bron has many turnovers just being the focal point as which happens of course when you play a lot with ball in your hands, which I would imagine you have never been in a actual bball situation to experience that I just said you don't mention the scoring and assist titles while just focusing on turnovers because of your personal hatred you have for the player Just because somebody brings other side of the coin doesn't make a fanboy, its pros n cons, you just focus on the cons which is your style, I just add the pros version, nothing more nor less What inflated his assists with Houston since he didn't have KD/Irving/Embiid? You mentioned Tucker and his 4/5ppg, but when was Tucker ever known for scoring outside of hitting corner 3's? Is that Harden fault that he has aged and not as capable of hitting wide open 3's? You mention Jake Reed, but what about Harden getting Capela almost 100$ mill on a offense game based on lob dunks? Actually I never been on Thunderfans.com, but Westbrook doing that is on his resume, so if you were to bash him you would also have to mention that as well It works like that for all players, every (great) player has flaws and strengths Pretty sure we could break down your game strength and flaws, that is if you have actually ever played
i'll tell ya up front - i dont like the man - i think he's a narcissistic asshat... but there's no denying the talent... i'll grant u he was a top 3 pg in the league last year... will he be a top 3 pg next year? howabout the year after? year after that? howabout at 38 years old? thats the issue... imo... 1 year max contract - sure what the hell... 2 years... mmmm.... yeh.... i suppose for that level of talent... not giving up any assets... just cap... gotta do it... 3rd year... now i think we're looking at at least a year or two of negative value... 4 yr max/near contract? imo thats at least 2 years of negative value contract on the books... and thats all assuming he stays engaged... there's always the possibility (i think highly likely) that he garners that final 4 year fat contract (fully guaranteed) - and pulls the ripcord and starts enjoying retirement early...
The Rockets ought to be the team he offers a steep discount to given his history in Houston. Having more money to spend surrounds him with a better team if he is really about winning.
