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Will U.S.A. and China become good partners in future?

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by ashinningpig, Oct 12, 2003.

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Will U.S.A and China become good partner in future?

  1. Of course, I think.

    18 vote(s)
    46.2%

  2. I am not sure.

    10 vote(s)
    25.6%

  3. No

    11 vote(s)
    28.2%
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  1. ashinningpig

    ashinningpig Member

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    We are in a complicated international environment. There are too much conflict
    and poverty.

    In fact, Chinese have a complicated
    emotion to U.S.A. In my childhood, the
    education that I accepted was America was an imperialism country. But now I know your
    country is a democratic state. Tough our
    goverment always emphasizes friendship between
    U.S.A and China in the public occasion, I know
    there are a lot of potential contradictions between
    us. Such as TaiWan and Northeast Asia.

    But I think if we can strengthen exchange
    and understand, we can become the good partner.
    The world in the future is one world won altogether after all.
     
    #1 ashinningpig, Oct 12, 2003
  2. BBnP4l

    BBnP4l Member

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    Will the West and East become good partners? History can answer that.
     
    #2 BBnP4l, Oct 13, 2003
  3. TECH

    TECH Member

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    China does a good job of keeping Wal-Mart stocked up.
    What kind of partnerships are you referring to?
     
    #3 TECH, Oct 13, 2003
  4. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

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    What's your opinion on Taiwan?
     
    #4 Batman Jones, Oct 13, 2003
  5. Cohen

    Cohen Member

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    China and the US will become closer through significant busniess ties.


    BTW, whats the deal with 'pig' in monikers?
     
    #5 Cohen, Oct 13, 2003
  6. ashinningpig

    ashinningpig Member

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    Tell the truth, I object to Taiwan
    independence firmly. But I think TaiWan
    and Mainland is equal, Both TaiWan and
    Mainland belong to China.
     
    #6 ashinningpig, Oct 13, 2003
  7. AntiSonic

    AntiSonic Member

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    Yao needs to dominate Shaq in the WCF so there'll be a Rocky IV moment that makes us all understand one another and become friends.
     
    #7 AntiSonic, Oct 13, 2003
  8. FKUS

    FKUS Member

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    If they can not get on well with each other, it will be the disaster of the whole world.

    Chinese people can not forget their history, the history she was invaded, ruled and robbed.

    As far as I am concerned, one mountain does not contain two tigers, conflict will occur, sooner or later.
     
    #8 FKUS, Oct 13, 2003
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2003
  9. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

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    We have funny ways in America. When it is convenient for our leaders, we pretend we care about human rights. When it isn't, we grant "Most Favored Nation" trade status to countries who are known to seriously violate human rights. If we actually cared about human rights, we would have a much worse relationship with China since they violate them so badly in the case of Taiwan. But as it stands, our leaders don't really care about human rights so our relationship ought to work out just fine.

    Why do you object to Taiwan independence?
     
    #9 Batman Jones, Oct 13, 2003
  10. FKUS

    FKUS Member

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    Give me the proof man, compared with the US-led occupation of an independence country-Iraq, which is the worst?
     
    #10 FKUS, Oct 13, 2003
  11. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

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    I don't know exactly what you mean. I was very opposed to the invasion of Iraq, though Saddam is also known to be guilty of heinous human rights violations. I opposed Saddam as well as opposing human rights violations in Taiwan. But I don't believe the US should go to war every time we become aware of human rights violations. I also don't think we should be favored trading partners with nations that commit such violations. We haven't traded with Iraq for a long time, though. We continue to enjoy MFN trading status with China. Again though, I don't get your point. If you are saying that the US led occupation of Iraq is bad, I agree. If you're not, I disagree. If you are saying that Chinese human rights violations are no big deal though, I disagree with that too. And I strongly oppose the trading relationship between the US and China until a time comes when China stops oppressing Taiwan.
     
    #11 Batman Jones, Oct 13, 2003
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2003
  12. ashinningpig

    ashinningpig Member

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    I understand your doubt. In fact, this is the
    difference of our culture and yours. In China,
    we think that the interests of the collective are higher than the individual's interests. The country
    is exactly the greatest collective. So as a Chinese
    , I can give up myself benefit to obey country's
    arrangement.

    But I also firmly object to autocrats use
    the emotion to seek the interests for themselves.
     
    #12 ashinningpig, Oct 13, 2003
  13. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

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    This is a primary difference between the US and China. In the US we value the individual very highly. The only thing that we sometimes value more highly is financial gain. That is why we continue to employ MFN trade status with China. Our leaders complain a great deal about crimes against individuals, but if there is money to be made they no longer care very much about that stuff. I personally believe in human rights above any national interest though -- that is what this country is supposed to represent. As such, I oppose the trading relationship between our countries. But you needn't worry. Our leaders value money more than human rights, so the relationship between our countries will remain strong.
     
    #13 Batman Jones, Oct 13, 2003
  14. ashinningpig

    ashinningpig Member

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    well, we respect your culture. but Why don't
    you respect our culture too? However, in space
    age, Collectivism spirit is more favorable to human development.

    But We must go out to hide the devil behind collectivism first now. The devil's name is
    dictatorship.
     
    #14 ashinningpig, Oct 13, 2003
  15. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

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    No fair, ashinningpig. I do respect Chinese culture. But I also respect Taiwan's culture and their right to independence. Can't I respect both? Also, while I respect American culture also, I do not respect the policy of forgiving violence when we profit and punishing it when we don't. In this way I am opposed to my own government. Is there any way you are opposed to your government or is that idea taboo in your country? These days, in America, opposition to the government is met with harsh resistance even though the idea of questioning one's government was the basis for founding our country. I, and many other Americans, think this is wrong. We value the freedom to criticize our government, maybe even above all other freedoms. How is China different?
     
    #15 Batman Jones, Oct 13, 2003
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2003
  16. Panda

    Panda Member

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    #16 Panda, Oct 13, 2003
  17. ashinningpig

    ashinningpig Member

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    Yeah, Idea taboo really exist in our state. But
    current situation and history of our country
    determine we can't use too irritable means to
    solve the defect. If you are a Chinese, you
    will understand it.

    Some countries are in order to weaken the strength of China, so in the leading independence of Taiwan of backstage, especially
    Japan.
    I think that the idea of the people of Taiwan
    is only that the life is rich and safe. They will not have only inner feelings to the independent feeling definitely. In fact, unified China will contribute to TaiWan's development in future.
    Do you think, Batman Jones?
     
    #17 ashinningpig, Oct 13, 2003
  18. bamaslammer

    bamaslammer Member

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    We will never have a good relationship with China despite our buisness connections because of their totalitarian govt. Democracies and dictatorships will always come into conflict because dictatorships can not coexists with them. Until China gets a new govt, the tension will continue.
     
    #18 bamaslammer, Oct 13, 2003
  19. Cohen

    Cohen Member

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    ashinningpug,

    What if Taiwanese value individuality more than collectivism?
     
    #19 Cohen, Oct 13, 2003
  20. Cohen

    Cohen Member

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    Originally posted by Batman Jones
    This is a primary difference between the US and China. In the US we value the individual very highly. The only thing that we sometimes value more highly is financial gain. That is why we continue to employ MFN trade status with China. Our leaders complain a great deal about crimes against individuals, but if there is money to be made they no longer care very much about that stuff.


    President Clinton severed the link between China’s human rights practices and MFN renewal in 1994 declaring that "we are far more likely to have human rights advances when it is not under the cloud of the annual question of review of MFN. This is not about forgetting about human rights. This is about which is the better way to pursue the human rights agenda". This reflects the conviction that while it is appropriate to discuss human right, MFN is neither appropriate nor effective as the tool for enforcement. In fact, Chinese dissidents, Taiwan and Hong Kong support equal trading status for China.

    http://www.wcit.org/resources/publications/issue_briefs/ib_china_mfn_status.htm



    I personally believe in human rights above any national interest though -- ...

    Except sovereignty issues, right?
     
    #20 Cohen, Oct 13, 2003
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