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Why is everyone so high on Golden State's players?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Hydra, May 21, 2001.

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  1. Hydra

    Hydra Member

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    I have seen people on this board who were enthusiastic about Antawn Jamison, Marc Jackson, and Larry Hughes. Golden State has all of these players and they were nearly the worst team in the league. Why is everyone so high on them. Of the bunch, the only one I would want is Jamison, and he is not leaving Oakland, if the team can help it. If they are as good as opinions around here would lead me to believe, that would be the biggest waste of talent I have seen. Do they suffer from the Vancouver complex, being able to do nothing with the likes of Bibby, Abdur-Rahim, Dickerson, and Swift?

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    You can't stick a porcupine in a barn, light it on fire, and expect to get licorice.
     
    #1 Hydra, May 21, 2001
  2. Big Haas 66

    Big Haas 66 Member

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    One thing you have to remember about Jackson is that he's very young, and even though Golden State was mediocre at best, he still had an impact on the court. Jamison has established himself as a very good player...as for Hughes, who knows, the jury still may be out on him, though I thought he'd be further along than he is at this point. Let's not forget this team was struck by the cancer that is Mookie Blaylock who skipped practices to play golf, while he was holding the title of "team captain."

    Jackson is young but showed he can be a solid presence defensively and on the boards. I think he'd be a good addition if we lose Hakeem.

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    #2 Big Haas 66, May 21, 2001
  3. Joe Joe

    Joe Joe Go Stros!
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    Jamison good. Jackson young with potential. I'm not a fan of Hughes.

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    #3 Joe Joe, May 21, 2001
  4. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    Jackson is 26. That is old for a rookie.

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    #4 bobrek, May 21, 2001
  5. Achebe

    Achebe Member

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    I always wonder about this too Hydra. Larry Hughes sucks, he shoots like 4% and yet we constantly have to read through prepubescent glory rock tributes to the guy. Just tape the ****ing photo of him and Joe Forte to your locker, write a bunch of stuff on it in lipstick and get it over with.

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    #5 Achebe, May 21, 2001
  6. Lil Francis

    Lil Francis Member

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    This Hughes bashing must stop [​IMG]

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    President of the Steve Francis, Jamal Crawford,Larry Hughes, and Charles Woodson fan club.
     
    #6 Lil Francis, May 21, 2001
  7. Band Geek Mobster

    Band Geek Mobster Member

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    Hmmm I wonder who you're talking about... don't forget Jamal Crawford.

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    I refuse to use smiley's in my posts, you'll just have to figure out how serious I am on your own...

    [This message has been edited by Band Geek Mobster (edited May 21, 2001).]
     
    #7 Band Geek Mobster, May 21, 2001
  8. oeilpere

    oeilpere Member

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    Now THAT is funny!



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    #8 oeilpere, May 21, 2001
  9. haven

    haven Member

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    I'm telling you, it's the Clipper-effect. Decent players rack up great stats on bad teams.

    Jamison is a good (15/9, maybe) Pf who happens to be the only good player on his team.

    Hughes is AI without a brain, shot, instincts or quite the speed. Jackson is a servicable center.

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    A few years back on the Senate floor...
    Phil Gramm: "If Democrats could, they'd tax the air we breathe."
    Ted Kennedy (jumping up): "By God, why didn't I think of that sooner!"

    Boston College - NCAA Hockey National Champions 2001
     
    #9 haven, May 21, 2001
  10. NIKEstrad

    NIKEstrad Member

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    well put HEB. Hughes is Cuttino without any jumper, and an even worse conscience. Nasty combination.

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    "That's been a lifelong dream of mine." -Vince Carter, after laying it in on a breakaway, much to the Vancouver crowd's displeasure.
     
    #10 NIKEstrad, May 21, 2001
  11. TheFreak

    TheFreak Member

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    Donyell Marshall seemed to play pretty well this year...

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    Rock Rock Til You Drop
     
    #11 TheFreak, May 21, 2001
  12. TexasG

    TexasG Member

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    As far as Hughs goes I am definately not a fan. He has to be one of the most overrated players in the League. He does not seem to work on his game enough. His shot looks worse than Shaq's at the free throw line, and he's been injury prone the past 2 years. As for Jackson, I think the jury is still out. Sure he had one good year but so has Matt Geiger in Charlotte. I'll give him one more year to prove himself. I don't even have to mention Jamison, he's a stud. He seems to be in the same situation that Finley was in when he first joined the MAVS. Good player bad team.

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    #12 TexasG, May 21, 2001
  13. Dr of Dunk

    Dr of Dunk Clutch Crew

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    You guys are saying that we shouldn't want Golden State players because they collectively suck? Come on guys. Collectively yes, but individually they could do well on other teams.

    (A healthy) Tim Hardaway and Chris Webber are examples. I don't much care for jackup artists like Larry Hughes, but Jackson and Jamison are good players.

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    #13 Dr of Dunk, May 21, 2001
  14. haven

    haven Member

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    DoD:

    I'm not saying they individually suck. I'm saying their numbers have to be taken with a grain of salt.

    Sometimes a player will actually play worse on a bad team than he would on a good team - he suffers from being not getting easy baskets, etc... but other times the stats are misleading.


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    A few years back on the Senate floor...
    Phil Gramm: "If Democrats could, they'd tax the air we breathe."
    Ted Kennedy (jumping up): "By God, why didn't I think of that sooner!"

    Boston College - NCAA Hockey National Champions 2001
     
    #14 haven, May 21, 2001
  15. Swopa

    Swopa Member

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    As someone who watched them all season, let me first say that Hughes is a better player than Jackson is.

    The difference is that Hughes contributes not only in stats other than scoring (compare his rebounding/assist numbers to other SGs) but in ways that don't show up in the boxscore. For Jackson (and Bob Sura, just to toss out another example), everything he contributes shows up in the boxscore -- and if he isn't putting up at least 16 and 9 on 50% shooting, he's a liability on the floor.

    The main problems with Hughes' shooting are (1) he needs to get stronger, which will happen over time, and (2) he needs a more structured offense and/or better coaching to help him get better shots on a consistent basis.

    You guys didn't have to suffer through watching it all year, but the Warriors' offense under Cowens was a very rudimentary affair that consisted of about four set plays: post-up left, post-up right, pick-and-roll left, and pick-and-roll right. The basic "role" for the SGs was to be thrown the ball on the wing and have everyone else watch to see what they did with it.

    I suppose that if you have an experienced team that's gained chemistry, they can make an offense like this work by making reads and knowing what their teammates are going to do. For a team using revolving-door lineups (and rarely even able to field 10 healthy bodies to scrimmage in practice) due to injuries & relying on mostly under-25 players, it just made a challenging season even more difficult. (I've referred to it as Cowens' "Bermuda triangle" offense, where the games of Hughes, Sura and Vonteego Cummings all vanished without a trace. [​IMG] )

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    #15 Swopa, May 21, 2001
  16. haven

    haven Member

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    swopa:

    I believe that Hughes has more TALENT than Jackson...

    but Hughes sucked in Philly, too. And Larry Brown doesn't run a "rudimentary" offense. part of it can be attributed to his age, but he was certainly selfish and one dimensional - even in comparison to AI.

    ------------------
    A few years back on the Senate floor...
    Phil Gramm: "If Democrats could, they'd tax the air we breathe."
    Ted Kennedy (jumping up): "By God, why didn't I think of that sooner!"

    Boston College - NCAA Hockey National Champions 2001
     
    #16 haven, May 21, 2001
  17. Lil Francis

    Lil Francis Member

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    Somebody stop the madness [​IMG] If this is a huge joke being played on me then ok you got me [​IMG]

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    President of the Steve Francis, Jamal Crawford,Larry Hughes, and Charles Woodson fan club.
     
    #17 Lil Francis, May 21, 2001
  18. CriscoKidd

    CriscoKidd Member

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    I can't believe no one has mentioned Sam Mack.

    He is the reason all the Golden State Players are high.

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    #18 CriscoKidd, May 21, 2001
  19. RocksMillenium

    RocksMillenium Member

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    I've seen Larry Hughes play since he was in Saint Louis and this guy is a going to be a star. He need to stop shooting so much, but then he is in Golden State and is one of the only options with all of the bad luck they've had. He played PG in college, and I think he would make a pretty decent one now, but I think he would be a very good SG. He would be perfect in Toronto. Golden State was a Clippers clone. Notice how all of those player bail out of LA, and start play serious ball? Golden State was that way. But that was because Don Nelson is an idiot and it was a different group. Marc Jackson is a good player, I've seen him play since he was at Temple, and Antwan Jamison speaks for himself. This isn't the case of players racking up great number on a bad team, this is a case of good players racking up big numbers DESPITE being on a bad team. Hughes definitely isn't Mobley without a jump shot, he is just a misused player. If the Rocks could get him he would be a star. Golden States problem is injuries, therefore lack of depth, inexperience and inconsistent shooting, and a lazy Mookie Blaylock. If they could get a PG to run the show, find a way to dump Dampier's contract to make deals, and gets some shooters they could win 35 to 40 games.

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    See the three, be the three.

    [This message has been edited by RocksMillenium (edited May 21, 2001).]

    [This message has been edited by RocksMillenium (edited May 21, 2001).]
     
    #19 RocksMillenium, May 21, 2001
  20. Swopa

    Swopa Member

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    He didn't suck last year with St. Jean as coach. In fact, he had everyone looking at him as a surefire future All-Star.



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    #20 Swopa, May 22, 2001
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