How come Duke never has sufficient depth? Is it because of the academics? Is it because so many people and players resent their success? What gives?
Does any team in college basketball have depth? It's pretty simple, all the good players go pro in a couple of years.
Some show I was watching was talking about the wave of big guys that UConn could/would throw at Shelden Willliams... While Duke has had an incredible run for 20 years, depth has always been an issue with them, it seems.
I have a friend that is one of the most knowledgable basketball fans I know. He argues that Coach K is a tremendously overrated coach as far as Xs and Os go, but is the greatest recruiter of all time. I don't know anything about college basketball, but I think the argument holds water. The guy gets more McDonald's All Americans than any other program in the nation, yet he never has a bench.
The reason that they have little depth is twofold: 1) Duke has a rigorous academic program. If you are the type of athlete that is going to play professionally why go to a school where you will have to work much harder? Notre Dame and Stanford have similar problems. 2) Despite #1, Duke does get atleast a couple of top ten players every year. They lack depth because nobody of any quality is going to go be a backup when you could go to another school and be the man.
They had no depth last night because most of them were already in the lockeroom before the end of the game. http://sports.myway.com/news/03012006/v3658.html Florida St. 79, No. 1 Duke 74 Mar 1, 11:50 PM (ET) By BILL KACZOR TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) - Alexander Johnson wasn't around for the finish of Florida State's one-point overtime loss to Duke earlier this season. On Wednesday night, most of the Duke players weren't near the court when the Seminoles beat the top-ranked Blue Devils 79-74. Florida State fans prematurely stormed the court with 1.7 seconds left to play, but that only delayed the final buzzer that signaled the Seminoles' second win over No. 1 Duke in three years. Duke coach Mike Krzyzweski had his team - except the five in the game - taken to the locker room before Al Thornton took the final free throws although 1.7 seconds remained on the clock. He said he feared for his players safety. "I would think that security is not ready for that type of thing," Krzyzewski said. "We weren't going to win the basketball game, the game was basically over, so why put those kids in harm's way?" He said that saying anything more about it would be misinterpreted. "It's an unfortunate situation and let the powers to be handle it ... in front of everybody, though, not behind closed doors," he said. J.J. Redick was 10-for-28 from the field and had 30 points for Duke (27-2, 14-1 Atlantic Coast Conference), while Shelden Williams had 20 points. Johnson, who broke the game's final tie on Wednesday, said he wasn't thinking about what happened when Florida State (18-8, 8-7) played at Duke on Feb. 4. In that game he was sent to the bench with his fifth foul, a technical, in the second half. The ACC later determined the technical against Johnson, called after he was bumped by Williams, who also got a technical, was a mistake and suspended the three-man officiating crew for one game. "I just played ball because I didn't want to think about that," Alexander said. "I kind of let that stay in the past, never looked back at it." His basket, over Williams, with 1:06 left gave the Seminoles a 74-72 lead. Johnson said he was afraid that if he did dwell on the last game, he would have gotten too physical. "I would have got some cheap fouls trying to aggressive against Shelden Williams so I kind of relaxed and let my game come to me," said Johnson, who finished with 22 points. It was Williams who was in foul trouble Wednesday night. He fouled out with 27 seconds left to send Johnson to the line where he made two free throws to put the Seminoles up 76-72. Fans came onto the floor with Florida State ahead 77-72. The floor was cleared and Duke was awarded two free throws on a technical foul against Florida State for its players leaving the bench area. Redick made the foul shots to make it a three-point game, but Thornton, who was fouled as the premature celebration began, made two free throws for the final margin. The loss ended the run at an unbeaten ACC season for Duke (27-2, 14-1), which finishes the regular season Saturday night at home against North Carolina. Thornton had 26 points for Florida State, which beat top-ranked Duke 77-76 on Jan. 6, 2003, also in Tallahassee. Florida State coach Leonard Hamilton said Duke brings the kind of excitement that causes fans to rush the court after a victory. "This is uncharted waters for us," Hamilton said. "I'm sure that in the future we'll try to win games by a little larger margin." The score was tied five times and there were four lead changes. Duke took its first lead in the second half at 43-42 on a dunk by Williams and built the lead to seven points. Duke went on an 11-5 run at the end of the first half to cut its deficit to 36-33. Redick accounted for eight points in the run with his first two 3-pointers of the game and two free throws.
That makes no sense at all. Some argue that he might be the best college coach ever. Everybody knows that this players haven't excatly torn it up in the pros. If anything I would figure that he is more of an X's and O's coach and doens't do anything to prepare his players to advance to the next level. The is no doubt that he get's a lot of McDonalds All-Americans, but he does what he is paid to do...win NCAA championships and get as far into the NCAA tournament as possible.
But other top schools seem to have better depth. Maybe every school could say this, but it seems to me that a lack of depth is an obvious and direct cause of their elimination from the NCAAs year-in and year-out (when they don't win it all!). Other top teams seem to have better depth than they do... and this is going on decades.
coach k does recruit well, but how soon we forget some of the teams this guy beat on his way to a couple of duke's titles. he beat a unlv that is considered one of the greatest ever. he also beat a kansas teams in the finals that year that was loaded. he beat the fab five in another title run. this is funny, I was listening to guy on espn radio this morning talking about coach wooden. He said people always say look at who wooden had, but not every coach wins with talent. not every coach can adapt to his players. coach k's teams played a different style with grant hill and hurley and laettner than with brand and william avery, then with jay williams and now with reddick and williams. the guy can flat out coach. what he's done at a school like duke with higher standards is flat out amazing. he's bob knight's protege' without the baggage.
Do you remember the 1998-1999 team with Elton Brand, William Avery, Langdon, Battier, where Corey Maggette was the 6th man, that went something like 39-2? Tell that team they didn't have depth; unfortunately they lost to UConn in the championship, and along with the previous year 17 points second half collapse against Kentucky, it kind of started this "Coach K is an overated tournament coach" talk. I agree Duke hasn't performed up to their tournament seedings lately (8 out of last 9 years, they have been a No. 1 seed), but except for 1999, Duke was never a prohibitive favorite going in. The year they won the championship, many picked Arizona to win the final game. If they can win one again this year or in the next few years, the average will be right around 20-25% again, which is pretty hard to acheive in one-game-and-done March Madness. Coach K likes to recruit in spurts. It seems every other year he gets a 5-person or 4-person class, and then rest a year and go back again.
I agree with those who suggested that depth is a rarity with most teams in the nation today due to early NBA draft entry. In particular, teams that recruit tons of McDonald's All-Americans lack depth because those players always leaves. The only fortunate enough to have depth this year is UConn, and that's because Calhoun recruited a lot of raw athletes in the past few years that weren't on people's radars (in addition to the Rudy Gay types). Those unknowns take longer to develop, so they stick around for all four years and are a valuable part of teams. Their big men (Josh Boone and Hilton Armstrong) were unheralded prior to college, and are now considered 1st round locks in the 06 draft for example. So, yes, Duke lacks depth, but they're definitely not alone. Only Uconn truly has that luxury this year (and won't next year).
That's the year that the slide started. They lost four underclassmen to the First Round of the NBA draft and they have never again approached the strength of that roster.
Some of you are confusing Duke's academic standards for "regular" students with the requirements for basketball players (the football team has more restrictions). I thought this was rendered moot in the early 90's when it was reported that the Christian Laetner's of the world had 820ish SAT scores. Sean Dockery had a 2.5 GPA and 17 ACT coming out of high school -- that was the NCAA minimum at the time. The only scholarship awarding DI school that even attempts to have some semblance of "high" standards for athletes is Stanford where you need a min of 1100. The Notre Dames and Dukes get the media to rap about how their kids with 900 SATs are Rhodes scholars and how it's so difficult to recruit there. It's all crap. Duke always has a short bench because Coach K likes to play 7 or 8 players. I think that's because come tourney time that's all he's going to play anyway so they might as well get use to it from day one.
What is depth anyways? Being 7-8 deep? I think now days it's almost impossible to build depth in college, with so many players leaving early. I don't think Duke has had any more depth problems than anyone else, they're at least 7 deep this year. The only person they lost last year was the white stiff, and he probably wouldn't even count as depth even if he stayed McRoberts, Paulus, Redick, Melchionni, Dockery, Nelson, Williams
If Duke has to rely on Redick to score 30 + then they have no shot at winning this thing. Teams that are hot can go all the way, because they will have different players contributed at different times....Duke doesnt seem to have that capability. VILLANOVA WINS IT.
Felton, McCants, May, M. Williams, Jackie, Scott, Noel, J. Williams 3 guards (Felton, McCants, Scott) 3 wing guys (Noel, Jawad, Marvin) 1 center (May) Last year's national champions. And Duke has 2 downlow, McRoberts and Sheldon. 3 guards (Paulus, Dockery, Nelson) 2 wings (JJ and Melchionni) 2 big men (McRob and Sheldon) Duke may have had a problem last year with depth, but they've added 2 starters and lost 1 back-up (Shavlik). Depth isn't the reason they're not #1 right now.
