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Why do non-wealthy people believe in the "free market"?

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by thadeus, Apr 6, 2011.

  1. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Member

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  2. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    what's your point, what else is he supposed say. he's the president of the biggest promoter of capitalism in the world
     
  3. langal

    langal Member

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    I think the people raised under Communism fear Communism a lot more than us.
     
  4. langal

    langal Member

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    Sounds to me that you are sort of implying that only successful entrepreneurs
    can support the free-market.

    I support the free-market system and am middle class. I don't think that makes me stupid or hypocritical.

    A lot of us are aware of the risks that entrepreneurs undertake and are unwilling to take them. That does not mean we do not appreciate entrepreneurship.

    Heck - the poor people in this country have a much better standard of living than the rich in Cuba.
     
  5. Bandwagoner

    Bandwagoner Member

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    So you are saying he actually hates america but has to say he doesn't because he is president?
     
  6. langal

    langal Member

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    I don't want to pull the old "if you hate America, then get the hell out thing" but do you really hate our mostly free-market system that much?

    If you look at migration numbers, the number of people that fled from Communist to non-Communist states far outnumbers those that actually decided to move into Cuba, USSR, etc.

    My father and a lot of his immigrant friends came to this country as students and have been successful in business. I respect them for that. I don't think that constitutes "ball-licking".
     
  7. langal

    langal Member

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    Conversely, there's also a large section of this country that believe the free-market is to blame for our our woes. I do admit that the "right-wing" groups are louder now. It seems that the "opposition" (to the White House) is usually more vocal.

    I personally think the GOP-base is loyal because of Christianity than economic policy. There are sheep on both sides. If anything, I've come to learn that many people smarter than me have different political views. A lot of them are posters on this very forum.
     
  8. Dubious

    Dubious Member

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    The USA is not a free market system, it is not a capitalist system.
    It is a regulated market (and that's what you want unless you like pollution, unhealthy foods, questionable drugs, unsafe trucks etc.) and it is a socialized system ( Social Security, food stamps, medicare) because that's what people want.

    All we ever argue about is the degree to which we want to be regulated and the degree of wealth redistribution our collective conscience prescribes.
     
  9. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    A cage made of gold. . . is still a Cage.

    Rocket River
     
  10. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    Do you think the embargo/boycott we have against Cuba . . . play a part in that? Maybe moreso than its government?

    Rocket River
     
  11. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member
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    Why do sheep follow the Shepard to slaughter?
     
  12. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    Perhaps because they like and appreciate the concept of transactions without force. Apple can charge whatever they want for an iPad, and the individual consumer is free to buy or not buy it. When everyone is free to choose what they are willing to exchange for what they want, everyone wins. If you are willing to work for twenty dollars per hour and not a penny less, then no one is forcing you to work for less than that amount. If Greg the homeowner is willing to pay no more than 20 dollars per hour to have his windows replaced, he can talk to all the glaziers and they are free to work for that price or pass. Compared to a system where the government is telling you what to pay or how much you can make at the point of a gun, who would not like the free market?
     
  13. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Member

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    A rich man is nothing but a poor man with money.

    W.C. Fields
     
  14. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Member

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    Yes, in capitalism you are free to starve.
     
  15. bingsha10

    bingsha10 Member

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    we've had a centrally planned economy since 1913.

    Sorry that people are naive and like to pretend we have a free market. But that is more or less what is taught in schools, and people tend to believe everything they are taught in school.
     
  16. bingsha10

    bingsha10 Member

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    what an ignorant statement.
     
  17. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    Is it not Accurate?
    Explain please.

    Rocket River
     
  18. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Member

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    A brilliant refutation.
     
  19. dmc89

    dmc89 Member

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    This is just anecdotal, but I think it's a combination of what they've been raised to believe, or the commentary they may see in the media (you have a Ford Focus only because of the free markets), and/or a fear of death so they cling to materialism.

    Greed is just a greater degree of desire for earthly delights and possessions that most human beings have. Capitalism seems to work best to me because people can't stand being equal. They have a need to plant their flag, to assert proof of their existence on this planet which gives their life some meaning, and this need drives the system.

    I can see it in the eyes of some people when my associates and I go out to lunch. They might casually ask what we do for a living while bringing our checks. Or it might be the shoeshiner, the valet, the hotel porter, and so on. They hope that one day they will be in your shoes. This is why the 'poor' believe in free markets.

    I don't blame them. While America's economic and social mobility has been decreasing every decade since the late 1970s, our current system is the best there is for jumping to a higher income quintile if you learn how it works imo. Education, connections, luck, and determination.

    But America's current problems of extreme inequality of income and wealth distribution is the real issue here, not free markets (even though there never has been or will be a such thing - just chunks of it blended in with other ideologies).

    No one has responded to thumb's post on what defines rich. For me, the superficial definition (different from 'success) off the top of my head: invested assets of at least $1 million with an income of ~$500k, zero debt, etc.

    Anyway, sorry for the rambling post, I just got back from work. I want to make a separate thread about issues this thread touches on, something that's been on my mind for a while now.
     
  20. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    You certainly are, though it is unlikely to come to that in the modern United States.
     

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