i saw this thread on spurs talk Duncan>Hakeem. it was one sided. i wanted to see the other side to the argument, and i figured no better place than clutch. who's better? why?
I am biased, certainly, but it's a tough comparison for a lot of reasons. Duncan operates in an NBA that is much weaker in the paint than when Hakeem went against Kareem (early career), Parish, Ewing, a young Shaq, and a prime-version of Robinson. As pure athletes, I'd have to take Hakeem pretty easily. In terms of pure fundamental training, you could probably take Duncan. In terms of footwork and agility, you'd have to take Hakeem. I don't want to take anything away from Duncan, but I'd argue Hakeem had a more devastating offensive arsenal and had the career stats to prove that. Then I'd argue that Hakeem could do more defensively as well. Perhaps I'm emphasizing the career blocks too much. Duncan may well be a better passer than Hakeem ever was. And he may have a different level of b-ball IQ. Duncan seems to have that knack for doing just the perfect little thing at the perfect time to tip a key game his way (albeit in a zombie-like, boring fashion). Hakeem could take over games in a much more obvious way. If there was a key game, you'd count on 35-20 from the Dream, while Duncan's 22-11 might actually more often result in a win. That launches arguments of supporting cast though. I mean, Kenny Smith or Parker? Sheesh.
A stupid question. If you ask this question on a Rockets board. Hands down it's Hakeem. If you ask this question on a Spurs board, hands down it's Duncan. Interesting debate though if you could actually get Spurs and Rockets fans to go head to head on it.
at their PEAKS, hakeem is easily better. hakeem at his best was a much more dominant offensive player than duncan. also, at his best, hakeem was a much better defensive INDIVIDUAL player (hence his 2 DPOY). however, i think duncan has had a better overall career b/c of his 4 championships. duncan will probably have 10+ all-nba first team, 10+ all-nba defense, maybe another championship... duncan is not a very exciting player so we disregard how good he is. though hakeem is a post player also, he was a magnificent and beautiful player to watch.
Hakeem was better on offense by far and defense by far. What does Duncan do better? Not steal, block, or score. He doesn't have as good of post moves and can not hit freethrows. Hakeems career rebounding average is slightly below Duncans. If you compare their first 10 years(damn...has Duncan been around that long?) Hakeem averaged 12.52 to Duncans 11.9.(I think) Duncan has slightly better assist numbers. They both average 21.8 scoring for their careers but you have Hakeem's grey beard years averaged in. All career numbers are skewed because Olajuwan has his declining years averaged in. Duncan's rebounding numbers will go down with age as well.Does he have a midrange jumper? Duncan does everything great. Hakeem did everything dominantly.
Damn...that was much better than my post. I agree with everything. Wish I had seen yours so I wouldn't have posted.
At his peak Hakeem was at a whole level higher than Duncan has ever approached. Hakeem was far better defensively (since Hakeem and Russell really have the only arguments of the most dominant defensive forces of all time). Hakeem was better offfensively too, though much less difference here. Hakeem was a couple of points per game higher scoring at their peaks and a tad higher in FG & FT. (Though Duncan was a little ahead in assists, like 3.8 per game to 3.6 for Hakeem at their peaks).
hakeem!!!!!!!!!!!!! unless Mr Fundamentals get a better nickname, just by the name itself, the Dream is better.
It's so hard to compare two players in such different eras, imo. But I strongly believe Hakeem did more for the game than Duncan has. Duncan does have more championships than the Dream, and you can't take that away from him...but I'd like to see Duncan go against teams like Malone's Jazz, Payton's Sonics, Barkley's Suns and then have to face Jordan's Bulls in the championship. Obviously this can't happen, but the league is so different today that it's tough to measure. One on one...prime Hakeem would destroy Duncan. I honestly can't see anyone arguing that point. Hakeem had more weapons in his arsenal, as someone else mentioned, and has a much better highlight reel. You put Duncan in place of Robinson on those early Spurs teams...and he has zero championships too.
What's to explain Duncan's championships vs Hakeem's? 1. Hakeem had to battle Magic's Lakers and Bird's Celtics early in his career, then Stockton and Malone, Barkley, and GP/Shawn Kemp late. Duncan had three years of Shaq-Kobe and a three-round playoff in all his championships (the Eastern conference was/is nonexistent. they gave the Detroit series away as charity). No question which player had the more difficult competition. 2. Hakeem was virtually alone on many of his best years. 93-94 he was MVP, 86 he had Sampson, and 94-95 he had Drexler. Duncan had David Robinson his first championship and Tony Parker/Manu his next two, not to mention the slew of former stars (Barry, Finley for example) that took on less money to play with him. Which leads to 3. Duncan had a much better administration at his back. CD's flaws I think we all realize now that Morey has taken the helm, and the extent of Rudy T's coaching was "getting the f@#king ball to Hakeem!". As much as people might nostalgiacize the championship years, it's time to come to grips with the fact that Rudy was not a very good coach. At least nothing like Popovich.
This has been beaten to death.... Duncan has one thing on Hakeem and that's more rings. Come on..........This dude is in the top ten in all-time steals.........AT FREAKING CENTER!!
Hakeem was a better "player" Duncan is on a better team with more opprutunity to win. As history looks back on these players most people will probably say Duncan with more titles.
I believe there is a clear-cut top tier of all-time. Here it is: 1. Jordan 2. Chamberlain 3. Russell 4. Kareem 5. Magic or Bird 6. Bird or Magic 7. Hakeem 8. Duncan 9. Shaq I believe that this is the top-tier of all-time in the NBA. After this the 2nd tier is a step below. You could debate 10-30 probably. That top 9 I believe is pretty concrete though. I also believe that to anyone that is fair and objective and uses a complete criteria which considers all aspects that the order I listed is also correct. Many here would argue Hakeem is #1 center or even #1 overall, but an objective analysis I think clearly shows that order 1-9 and that after that is what should be termed a 2nd tier. I feel pretty good in saying that after objective analysis Duncan is ahead of Shaq though. Granted, Duncan may have another 2 to 3 years at his current level, so unlike the others on the list he may move up, I won't rule that out. He may still challenge Hakeem, Bird, and Magic, although my money would bet against him moving up from where he is.
Thats only if you are a biased homer. Which alot of clutchfans are not. Clearly you are not capable of taking anything objectivly. Their have been very few people to say it is Hakeem hands down. It is quite clear that for an overall career Duncan has been much more effective. But if you were to match up Duncan and Hakeem in their primes no question Hakeem would come up on top.
