Got this idea from Realgm. It's been a decade since Jordan's 2nd retirement. It's a decent time to poll this up. Was thinking about having Nash, Nowitzki, Iverson, McGrady in this poll. But let's not front like we'd give a vote to any of them over the big 3(Maybe Garnett but nix'd him). Decided against Lebron and Wade because they've only been in the nba for 5 years. I wanted someone that spanned the decade so far. Kobe Bryant Career: 25.0 ppg, .453 FG%, .340 3pt%, .839 FT%, 1.3 3pters, 5.3 rpg, 4.6 apg, 1.5 spg, 0.6 bpg, 2.9 TOpg, .557 TS%, 23.6 PER Best Year '06: 35.4 ppg, .450 FG%, .347 3pt%, .850 FT%, 2.3 3pters, 5.3 rpg, 4.5 apg, 1.8 spg, 0.4 bpg, 3.1 TOpg, .559 TS%, 28.0 PER 1 MVP 3 NBA Championships 6 All NBA 1st Teams 6 All Defensive 1st Team Tim Duncan Career: 21.6 ppg, .508 FG%, .190 3pt%, .684 FT%, 0.0 3pters, 11.8 rpg, 3.1 apg, 0.8 spg, 2.4 bpg, 2.8 TOpg, .553 TS%, 25.1 PER Best Year '02: 25.5 ppg, .508 FG%, .100 3pt%, .799 FT%, 0.0 3pter, 12.7 rpg, 3.7 apg, 0.7 spg, 2.5 bpg, 3.2 TOpg, .576 TS%, 27.0 PER 2 MVPs 4 NBA Championships 9 All NBA First Teams 8 All Defensive 1st Teams Shaquille O'Neal Career: 25.2 ppg, .581 FG%, .050 3pt%, .524 FT%, 0.0 3pters, 11.5 rpg, 2.7 apg, 0.6 spg, 2.4 bpg, 2.9 TOpg, .584 TS%, 27.1 PER Best Year '00: 29.7 ppg, .574 FG%, .000 3pt%, .524 FT%, 0.0 3pters, 13.6 rpg, 3.8 apg, 0.5 spg, 3.0 bpg, 2.8 TOpg, .578 TS%, 30.6 PER 1 MVP 4 NBA Championships 8 All NBA 1st Teams
Kobe hands down. It's hard to say it now, it blasphemous to the church of jordan (because their skillset and build are so comparable) but in retrospect, 10 years from now, you all will agree...
Duncan, in the SG position Kobe, but overall Duncan hands down. 11 straight playoff appearances since he was drafted 4 titles
Since MJ retired, two players in particular have dominated the NBA landscape: Shaq and Duncan. There really isn't anyone else worth of being mentioned in the discussion. It's an easy question, the difficult part is picking which one of those two is the best since Jordan. I still say Shaq in his prime >>>>> Duncan in his prime, but I know others might disagree. Ask the same question in 5 years, and Kobe may have something to say about that. Thus far, however, his repertoire is lacking in terms of team success, but he will get there eventually.
I voted Kobe. I'm not particularly afraid when Duncan touches the ball, but I know his team is just as deadly if you collapse on him. The damn zone defense ruins this question.
Agreed, I am leaning towards Shaq as well. He's certainly been the most dominant force in the league since Jordan, and he happens to have 4 championship rings to bolster his side of the argument. To me, Duncan is great, the most consistent force in the league since Jordan, but his 'best' was still short of Shaq's best. Oh, and I hardly take MVP's into consideration any more, the fact that Steven Nash has two and Dirk has as many MVP awards as Shaq pretty much nullifies the award as something meaningful to take into consideration when evaluating the 'worthiness' of a player over his career.
This is ridiculous, who are all these people voting for Kobe? The guy does not even have a finals MVP. Even Billups and Tony Parker was able to get one.
Maybe if you only got 1. But consider the guys who have 2+ Finals MVP's. Jordan (6) Magic (3) Kareem (2) Bird (2) Hakeem (2) Shaq (3) Duncan (3) All top notch and top 10 players all time. That is no coincedence my friend.
Teamwork is so much more important in basketball than say baseball. To diminish Kobe's obvious superior talent because he just happened to be on a team with Shaq in his prime based on these "Finals MVPs" would be ignoring the other circumstances that the NBA players' legacy is very dependent on. Since you started the thread, the onus is on you to better define what you mean by greatest. Right now, I say Kobe is the best based on his individual talents. Lebron could have something to say about that soon though. An NBA players legacy is so subject to the hands they're dealt and how the media covers it. Winning is obviously the most important thing, but anybody would take Kobe or Duncan over whatever possibly lesser player happen to have won Finals MVP because of their contribution to team success. I'm not even really disagreeing with your distaste for Kobe. I hate him too but he's probably the best basketball player since Jordan.
It certainly has to be one of those top 3... Shaq, Kobe, or Duncan. Honestly, I just can't choose. I could probably narrow it to Kobe or Duncan, since Shaq's impact on defense was overrated, while Duncan and Kobe are both all-world defenders. I suppose I'll vote for Duncan, because I'm all about defensive impact... but it's really a toss-up.
It's good that WE don't have to deal with him. As a fan, I'd take a Dennis Rodman if it makes me a "dynasty". We'd have to have a discussion about the ends and the means. But if we cared so much about the players being good guys, we'd be closely following the community service superlatives each year. It's a cherry on top, but most people just want the sundae.
