I hope this isn't too jumbled. I'm genuinely curious and also ranting. I began this in another thread and was afraid I would derail it and/or not get any responses. Some of these points will never be addressed in American politics in my lifetime, and some are relevant to today. Again, I'm ranting a lot, here. I REALLY hate politics and politicians as well. I don't like big government. Or huge social programs. Some are necessary (IMO), but some (IMO) are just silly. Some places (San Francisco, for example) seem to reward laziness. My heart goes out to a lot of disadvantaged people, but there has to be a line drawn somewhere so that people can't abuse the system and/or the generosity of the American people. I don't like censorship. TV, movies, video games, and music. Leave it the hell alone. Don't like it? Don't watch it/play it/listen to it. Smoking bans. Don't like those, either. I do believe business ought to be regulated by the govt so it doesn't get out of control (monopolies and what have you), but a private business owner ought to be able to allow whatever legal activity he or she so chooses within the confines of their establishment. Legalization of vices such as drugs and prostitution I am for. We need to learn from prohibition: the only way to control it is to legalize it, tax it, and regulate it. My body is not your business. Socialized medicine sounds great in theory, but I'd rather have the world's greatest healthcare that private insurance allows. After all, more money to be made means more and better doctors. I'm all for immigration, so long as it is done legally, and we aren't giving blanket amnesty and privileges to those who don't go about it the right way. Becoming a US citizen should not be a walk in the park. My great-grandfather immigrated from Wales in 1906 and became a US citizen shortly thereafter. He did it right. Why can't everyone else? I support the 2nd amendment and don't particularly like the death penalty. I could care less about global warming; all I want is a cleaner planet with all the tree-hugging, save the whales, recycling goodness that comes with it. The whole argument about melting ice caps and whether we're at fault is futile. Just clean up the damn place and keep it that way. Certainly we can all agree on that point. I support gay marriage. Can't we all just be happy for christ's sake? I support a woman's right to choose. Again: not my body = not my business. I'm a spiritual agnostic who recognizes the Christian tradition of this country. I'm not a religious man. I don't go to church. But I hate Christian bashing and I hate all the damn Grinchy far-lefties that want to cancel Christmas and tell little kids they can't have Easter decorations at school. Taxes. Admittedly, I don't know much about them. I don't think you should pay more just because you're poor. I don't think you should pay more just because you're rich, either. Simple solution: everyone pays the same ******* percentage. Flat tax, right? What's so difficult and/or controversial about that? For the war, against the war, whatever. We're IN THE DAMN WAR. Now what? The NY Times and London Times are both reporting good things after the surge. There's a thread about it here in this forum. War is scary. Its probably supposed to be. I'm sure I read that somewhere. My opinion is that we've got to stick with what we've started, and do our damnedest to make the best of it. Us pulling out if Iraq and leaving that country in shambles is about the worst thing we could do, imo. Right now, Rudy has my vote. You can call him either a liberal republican or a conservative democrat. Either way, it works for me. Again, sorry if this is a convoluted mess. [/rant]
You're pretty much a libertarian. And, as you're currently supporting Rudy, you apparently don't have a problem with crazy people. Sounds like Ron Paul's your man.
Not much. In brief, you sound like a Libertarian so I think you should vote for the Libertarian candidate. That's Ron Paul. He's also nuts, but anyone who would be dissuaded by that certainly wouldn't ever vote for that nutjob Rudy. So I say, Paul 08 is the way for you. By the way, national health care is not socialized medicine. Socialized medicine might actually threaten the current level of care. No plan from any Democrat does that. They all leave the current system in place for those that want to use it but they add an option for those who are currently not covered. Are you really against that?
Thank you. I appreciate your input. And no, that doesn't sound like a bad idea. I'm sure there's a counter point, and I wouldn't mind hearing it, otherwise it wouldn't be an issue at all. I also wouldn't mind hearing why you think Rudy is crazy. Or Ron Paul, for that matter.
I don't think any candidate is a direct hit with your views, but Rudy and possibly Romney/Huckabee are the closest, depending on which issues you prioritize. You are a moderate conservative, basically.
You don't like big governments but most of the things your ranting about should be states rights. The biggest elections in our lives should be our governor, not our president. Give me a canidite who supports shoving a lot of this BS back where it belongs ... in the states. Give me a canidite who will call for tax accountability, not tax cuts.
I'd say your views track closely with Ron Paul and Rudy Giuliani. Ron Paul is pro life, and Rudy is not for legalization though. On the Dem side you would probably be reasonably happy with Clinton (except for the whole socialized medicine thing).
It's not socialized medicine, with all due respect. As has been pointed out here many, many times, it's about insuring all Americans (45 million+ have no coverage, many of them middle class) have access to affordable health care and affordable health insurance through private industry. I'm not a big Hillary Clinton fan, but at least attempt to get your facts straight. D&D. Attempt to be civil! Impeach Bush.
That is good to know. My question then is this: why is it an issue at all? As it has been presented in this thread at least, Hillary-care doesn't sound like a bad thing. What does the other side say? I do pretty much feel like I would be okay with Clinton. I liked Bill well enough. She doesn't seem very personable, but that's hardly a requirement, I suppose. Re: Ron Paul, I have a really hard time voting for a pro-lifer, even with so many other issues on the table.
I'm sorry, but you cannot insure all Americans without some form of socialized medicine. Saying it doesn't make it so. The people that are not paying for health insurance now can't really be forced to pay for it, so the only other option to insure them is to give it to them for "free", which means the taxes are paying for it. Once the options become free insurance or paid insurance, how many people are going to choose to pay? That road leads to socialized medicine. It isn't only about what people say, you have to use some reasoning. The people that say they want to reduce the number of abortions, but don't want to criminalize it are actually for abortion on demand. The people that say they want to target tax cuts to the middle class are actually for raising taxes on the rich. The people that say they don't want to leave Iraq before the job is done are for a permanent presence. So, Hillary can say whatever she wants about her health care system. Any system that requires coverage for everyone and pays for the people that don't pay for themselves is socialized medicine, like it or not.
I'm embarrassed to say that after reading more about Ron Paul and not focusing on what his mostly idiotic supporters say about him, he's not that bad. I have a an issue with him on abortion and foreign policy, and believe he's too much of a moralist. But overall he passes McCain as my number 3 candidate behind Rudy and Mitt. Especially after Mccain criticized Rudy's support on waterboarding. Ron Paul, #3!
SM, you would be amazed at the number of middle-class Americans without health insurance. It is staggering. I'm surprised you don't know any, personally. There is a myth that it is the poor that need a national health insurance plan. The fact is that the poor constitute just part of the 45 million+ in America without health insurance. My middle-class brother-in-law didn't have it, because he was unable to get steady work as a constuction supervisor due to his health. He couldn't be a construction worker, because he could barely use his hands. Poor circulation from his illness made them partially numb. Being proud, and formally making over $100K wearing a gold hard hat for that huge construction company everyone has heard about, he refused to apply for disability from the government. His former employer didn't give a good god damn what happened to him. My sister is a retired school teacher, who also works, and they simply couldn't afford to add him to her health insurance. He died suddenly last Spring from his illness. I have a friend who moved back to Texas from Boston, where Romney pushed through a state health insurance plan, with the help of Senator Kennedy, that covers everyone. It goes through the private insurance industry and is almost exactly what Clinton wants to do nationally. He's self employed, makes an excellent income, has some health problems treated with meds without a problem. To his astonishment, he can't get health insurance except through a "pool" that the state has with selected insurance companies. They have told him that he only qualifies for the highest priced coverage, an HMO type of policy. The cost? Over $2500 a month. Even he can't afford that. Romney, the coward, isn't running on it because he's afraid he would be a pinata for attacks like you are making. I could give many more examples. I wonder if you would consider changing your views on this subject. You might consider reading more about it. D&D. Attempt to be Civil! Impeach Bush for Promoting Torture.
Who should eat me, the great white shark or the killer whale? Hmmmm. I'm dead in the water either way. Lynus302, outline what is most important to you in order; clarify the candidates' waffling positions as best you can; pull the lever for the one that best fits the profile you prefer; and walk away knowing you've done all you can do.
if one uses generic phrases like socialized medicine to make superficial points we can all look nice and stupid. This is a fun little exercise, minus the fun, where one takes an all encompassing label and apply it to everyithing - it of course works many ways. President Bush's Prescription drug plan = communist medicine, Structured Investment Vehicle bailout = marxist welfare for structured finance Basically if we abuse a generic term like "socialized" enough we can make it so that anybody besides a caveman who kills a mammoth with a rock he found on the ground and eats it with his bare hands can be painted as a collectivist Trotskyite insurgent. A convenient tool to dismiss things in a superficial way, otherwise, a distraction at best and more likely dishonest.
While the whole post was awesome, I thought this bit was particularly good! You should post more here if you have the stomach for it.
