1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

White folks' greed runs a world in need

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by basso, Mar 28, 2008.

  1. basso

    basso Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2002
    Messages:
    33,363
    Likes Received:
    9,291
    Obama’s Former Pastor Getting $1.6M home in Retirement

    [rquoter][​IMG]

    This was supposed to be the week that the Rev. Jeremiah Wright Jr. returned to the pulpit to preach for the first time since his anti-American sermons generated nationwide outrage and drew condemnation from his longtime parishioner, Barack Obama.

    But, citing security concerns, Wright canceled his speaking engagements in Florida and Texas. A spokeswoman at his former church in Chicago said his schedule is pending.

    A two-week FOX News investigation, however, has uncovered where Wright will be spending a good deal of his time in retirement, and it is a far cry from the impoverished Chicago streets where the preacher led his ministry for 36 years.

    FOX News has uncovered documents that indicate Wright is about to move to a 10,340-square-foot, four-bedroom home in suburban Chicago, currently under construction in a gated community.

    While it is not uncommon for an accomplished clergyman to live in luxury, Wright’s retirement residence is raising some questions.

    “Some people think deals like this are hypocritical. Jeremiah Wright himself criticizes people from the pulpit for middle classism, for too much materialism,” said Andrew Walsh, Associate Director of the Leonard E. Greenberg Center for the Study of Religion in Public Life with Trinity College in Hartford, Conn.

    “So he’s entitled to be tweaked here. So the question really is, how unusual is this? Somewhat unusual,” he said.

    According to documents obtained from the Cook County Register of Deeds, Wright purchased two empty lots in Tinley Park, Ill., from Chicago restaurant chain owner Kenny Lewis for $345,000 in 2004.

    Documents show Wright sold the property to his church, Trinity United, in December 2006, with the proceeds going to a living trust shared with his wife, Ramah.

    The sale price for the land was just under $308,000, about $40,000 less than Wright’s original purchase two years earlier.

    Public records of the sale show Trinity initially obtained a $10 million bank loan to purchase the property and build a new house on the land.

    But further investigation with tax and real estate attorneys showed that the church had actually secured a $1.6 million mortgage for the home purchase, and attached a $10 million line of credit, for reasons unspecified in the paperwork.

    There is apparently nothing wrong with that, according to non-profit tax expert Jack Siegel of Charity Governance Consulting, who examined public documents FOX News obtained from the Cook County Register of Deeds and the Village of Tinley Park.

    “At least looking at it from a public document standpoint, there’s clearly not a problem that jumps out or some sort of wrongdoing,” Siegel said.

    Siegel characterizes the transaction as unusual, however, because of the way Wright sold the property to Trinity and the way the deal was financed, with the attached $10 million line of credit.

    Because churches are classified as private businesses, Trinity isn’t required to reveal its intended use for the line of credit. Nor, because it’s a non-profit entity, is it required to provide that information to the IRS.

    A spokesman for ShoreBank, the Chicago-based financial institution that secured mortgages for the loans, said the deals were aboveboard.

    Wright did not respond to repeated calls for comment, and Trinity United refused to discuss the specifics of the home it is building for him and the way the deal was financed.

    The church referred FOX News to its denominational headquarters in Cleveland, which provided a statement of support:

    “It is customary and appropriate in many Christian denominations, including the United Church of Christ, for local churches to offer housing provisions for retiring clergy, especially in cases where pastors have served long-term pastorates. We support efforts by our 5,700 local churches to ensure that retiring pastors and spouses have continuing housing, adequate pension and health care, as an expression of our continuing appreciation for their years of service. Each local UCC congregation is free to honor a retiring pastor in ways it feels most appropriate to address the needs of that clergyperson’s circumstances,” wrote the Rev. J. Bennett Guess, spokesman for UCC’s national office.

    “This is about how these kinds of churches work,” notes Walsh. “These pastors who made big successful churches are real valuable commodities. Is it morally wrong? Well, Protestants don’t have the idea that their religious leaders should live modestly or aesthetically. We’re not talking Buddhist monks or Catholic priests here. There’s no tradition that says they have to live poor.”

    Tradition at Trinity United centers on a congregation that’s unashamedly black and unapologetically Christian, according to the church’s website. There are also no apologies from the church for the home it’s building for its former senior pastor, who nurtured a religious empire that grew to have more than 8,000 congregants.[/rquoter]
     
  2. FranchiseBlade

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Messages:
    51,803
    Likes Received:
    20,461
    It's wrong for people to live in nice houses.

    Good find basso.
     
  3. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2002
    Messages:
    15,564
    Likes Received:
    6,553
    The house that hate built.
     
  4. insane man

    insane man Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2003
    Messages:
    2,892
    Likes Received:
    5
    unlike your house that illegals built?
     
  5. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2002
    Messages:
    15,564
    Likes Received:
    6,553
    My house is the house that love built.
     
  6. Xenochimera

    Xenochimera Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2005
    Messages:
    1,929
    Likes Received:
    25
    to be fair i think he was simply exploiting the feelings that some african americans have in order to to benefit himself. it would be no big deal if he wasn't linked to obama. sharpton operates the same way.
     
  7. insane man

    insane man Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2003
    Messages:
    2,892
    Likes Received:
    5
    why do you think he didn't really agree with parts of that narrative?
     
  8. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2002
    Messages:
    35,985
    Likes Received:
    36,840
    Post of the year candidate. I bet it was like an Amish barn-raising. Perhaps even UT alums in the mix!
     
  9. ROXRAN

    ROXRAN Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2000
    Messages:
    18,814
    Likes Received:
    5,219
    My biggest problem is the seemingly increasing allocations of materialism by churches in general to pastors, this also goes beyond Wright. However, this is especially troubling coming from a preacher utilizing hateful and anti-American speeches as part of "the message"...
     
  10. CometsWin

    CometsWin Breaker Breaker One Nine

    Joined:
    May 15, 2000
    Messages:
    28,028
    Likes Received:
    13,051
    The greed is good crowd now has a problem with greed. ;)
     
  11. leroy

    leroy Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2002
    Messages:
    27,353
    Likes Received:
    11,213
    So they did nothing wrong and it's a common practice?

    Wow...real news here. Well done.

    :rolleyes:
     
  12. Pushkin

    Pushkin Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2008
    Messages:
    411
    Likes Received:
    10
    I do not see anything wrong with that house in the context of what other leaders of large churches receive.

    This is so true. While I agree that most pastors at large churches are actually fulltime CEOs of large entities, that is not a justification for exorbinant pay and benefits.

    While I no longer attend Catholic church, I am sure that upbringing (I was raised Catholic and I have an Uncle who is a priest and an aunt who was a nun) influences my thoughts, but I believe that when a person makes that commitment to God, that person should give up a lot of the material possessions. The church should provide enough money for a good upper middleclass life and not anymore. The house pictured above goes beyond that level, especially since he is now retired.

    I would not be surprised to find out that a large portion of these well-paid pastors do not tithe when you take into account the value of all of the benefits (cars, houses, etc.) or that the salary is not purposefully inflated by 10% to cover the tithe.
     
  13. Beck

    Beck Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 1999
    Messages:
    1,132
    Likes Received:
    15
  14. MR. MEOWGI

    MR. MEOWGI Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2002
    Messages:
    14,382
    Likes Received:
    13
    Haha.

    Suckers.
     
  15. thegary

    thegary Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2002
    Messages:
    11,006
    Likes Received:
    3,128

    agreed. the crappier your house is, the better human being you are.
     
  16. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2002
    Messages:
    43,783
    Likes Received:
    3,705
    battle of attrition
     
  17. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2002
    Messages:
    35,985
    Likes Received:
    36,840
    as I said earlier, it's not even attrition or even paper cuts.

    It's like plucking arms hairs one at a time. Not a good way to get someone to bleed.

    I'm just wondering if they start on the pubes once the arms hairs are gone. Yuck.
     
  18. Apollo Creed

    Apollo Creed Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2001
    Messages:
    4,449
    Likes Received:
    3
  19. cson

    cson Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2000
    Messages:
    3,797
    Likes Received:
    29
    Courtney built your house ?
     
  20. bnb

    bnb Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2002
    Messages:
    6,992
    Likes Received:
    316
    I'm not sure I get the white folks reference in the title.

    I thought it was a predominently black church? Wasn't that our outrage last month?
     

Share This Page