When was the last time that a pure point guard scored near 50 points in a game?

but they lost

amare only too 8 shots.

but nash's shooting was incredible...20/28 is pretty insane.

 

shows how overrated amare and marion are. freakin morons cant even create one shot for themselves.

 

I thought Magic hit it right on the head: while Steve Nash had an unbelievable offensive game and was a scorer tonight, he hurt his team overall by not making passes that get his teammates into sync to be effective in the game.

So basically what Magic was saying is this: By not playing like a PG this game, while Nash scored 47 points, his teammates struggled and didn't play well, so that offsets his scoring contribution.

Oh, btw, how many TO did Nash have? I heard something like 8 or 9, which is incredibly high.

Great offensive game, bad team game, he didn't involve his teammates enough and that might have cost them the game.

 

maybe that's why they lost.
when Nash, whose job is to create for his teamates, is busy shooting, you know they aren't doing it right. that's not how they won 60 games this season.

 

i believe it was when the old wooden ship , diversity, first set sail.

back in 1904 that is.

 

Amare will get better. He's young and in his 3rd year. With Marion, he is what he is. People always focus on Amare, but Nash has lifted Marion to another level this year. He is ideally suited for what the Suns want from that position.

 

So when Amare takes only 8 shots, he sux and can't create his shots, Steve nash tried to be the scorer today and that lost the game for them?

Watching the game, Amare played like a big man suppose to and took it inside, but he got tripled (they were denying him the ball and were rushing 3 people at him every time he does touch it). Not to mention quite a few strips and blocks that were blatant foul. And he did get quite a few BS calls fighting for rebounds (very Yao like as far as treatment from Mavs and refs).

Nash scored cuz that's what the Suns defense made him do. If he beat a guy off the dribble, people didn't help, if he splits a pick, no one steps up, they let Steve tried to beat him. His 9 TO is him trying to force the issue and get his teammates involved. If anything, I say if he wasn't looking to pass and to score himself when the Suns let him (which he started to do in the second half) they win the game.

 

Kevin Johnson.... game 4.... 1995 playoffs against us (I believe he had 51).

He also almost scored 50+ again in game 7.

 

it was dana barros, not damon stoudamire that dropped 50 on us, right? would he be considered a pg?



and i liked on the tnt postgame show kenny explaining that the rockets let kj score all those points to keep his teammates out of the game. what you say kenny . of course, i ain't got nothing against kenny, he sucked at D, he couldn't help it, but he was the man on 3's.


and tigermission1, after a season of 11.5 assists per game, i don't think nash willingly didn't get his teammates involved. it's not like he tried to be selfish. but what was he gonna do? the mavs were practically handing him layups at one point. you can't not take those. when you shoot 20/28, you shooting too much isn't hurting the team. in fact, it's exceedingly helpful and it's doubtful any amount of passing to his teammates could have accomplished better. anybody he passed to would've been tightly guarded by a mav since they were purposely staying home. it would be silly to pass to them and avoid the layup in the name of "getting your teammates involved." your teammates throwing up bricks b/c they're covered doesn't help things. the suns will have to try to come up with a way to get others involved b/c there isn't much you can do if they leave nash wide open and guard everyone else tightly. w/o johnson and with them double teaming amare, no one else could created their own shot.

and honestly, offense didn't lose them this game. with nash having to do extra dribbling, the game was slowed down and the suns still scored 109. the problems was they never ever stopped the mavs. between horrible D and horrible rebounding the mavs scored almost every time down. nash was scoring at will and getting the suns as many points as could be hoped for out of each possession, but they just never stopped dallas.

 

What you forgot to mention was that Magic also said Nash took exactly what the defense gave him.

Dallas did a better job of staying at home on Amare and Marion tonight. If you noticed on Nash's penetration Dallas didn't bring very much weak-side help, so Nash had no choice, so to speak, but score when he got in the paint. And that he did.

Now whether or not D'Antoni made the right adjustments to get the proper floor spacing is another question.

Do you only blame Nash for Dallas shooting 55% as a team?

What about letting Dampier establish some semblance of an inside presence tonight? Is that only on Nash also?

Nash took the shots Dallas gave him. He hit almost 70% from the field.

Not only that, but you're partially right about his high turnover game....you never wish for that many turnovers from your floor leader, but he forced a few passes in lanes that weren't there seemingly in a concerted effort to, indeed, get his teammates involved.

To even insinuate that this game was lost because of anything Nash did or didn't do is ludicrous.

 

The guy shot 70% from the field and was getting open shots. I will take that every time, and so will Steve Nash, and so would Mike D'Antoni - and so would Magic Johnson if he considered the alternative and wasn't just being a talking head.

Their defense sucked, they gave up 119. It's hard to win when that happens.

But they didn't lose because Nash was selfish or took to many shots. Hell he probably didn't take enough. Shockingly enough, Magic was wrong.

 

is that how you spent post #10000? or was another post the magic number?

 

43 in Game 4 (which the Suns won)

46 in Game 7

 

That's exactly what I've seen as well.....Amare getting butchered inside with no calls and then ticky tack garbage like moving screens called on him. Is it just me or do the Mavs get the benefit of an awful lot of bad calls even against Phoenix?

 

I agree. You can't just setup your teammates for the sake of seting them up and make their numbers look good. Nash only got 5 assists but 9 TOs was simply because the Mavs denied his attempt to get teammates open looks, and just let him score. Everyone on the Suns teams is accustomed to wait Nash to feed them, once that option is gone, NONE of them, including Amare and Marion, can create their own shots. They didn't play defense all year long, so they just can't shut Mavs down. Everyone on Dallas can play ISO, and they want to turn this into an ISO contest, unless that coach of the year comes up with something to counter, the Suns won't make it.

Lots of Rockets fans want a PF who can rebound, block shots, and make those 15 footers, but those guys all ask for insane money. I would rather have a pure PG, an European. To be honest, nowadays, with all the fame go to the finisher, no one in the young American generation wants to play a Stockton, Kidd, Nash kind of game. You can only get Marbury or SF3 like PGs. I would say we play Howard, and get a young cheap 4, who can get 8 boards, 2 blocks, and absorb 4,5 fouls from Yao, and forget about the 15 footers, we will be just perfect. Let TMac and Yao to worry about the offense. They can all create and pass out from the double.

Nash's 9 TOs are indeed evidence that he tried really hard, or even too hard to get those guys open, but Mavs don't allow them.

Still, defense wins you championships.

 

When you play a low post game, refs will let lots of contacts go, just like what Shaq and Yao get every night. When Amare was moving to open spots, with defenders coming out to help on Nash, Nash will find him everytime, Amare can finish and get his calls. But when the defenders let Nash score, and stay with their own man, Amare doesn't have a low post game, and Marion can't create for himself either, it's tough for the Suns. If Nash gets 18, 20 points and 14 assists, the Suns will win easily, but if the Mavs cut his assists to 7,8, game over for the Suns. On top of that, if Flopitzki wakes up and makes his shots, I can see Mavs advance.

 

One aspect of Amare's game is that he can actually attack the basket off the dribble as a big man because he of his athelecism. One step and he's at the basket. But today, every time he attack the rim, he gets fouled and alot of the whistle are swallowed. One in particular was play in the 4th where he went up for a dunk of rebounds and 3 Mavs went at him, missed dunk and no call. Another one was where Dampier hit him on the arm and on a dunk and no call. Things like that kills rhythm and makes people tenative about going to the basket.

Though you do have to give credit to the Mavs in letting Nash beat him. Amare from what I seen in this series, isn't that he doesn't have a post game, is that he's unwilling to go into the post mode because of the way zone and defense is allowed to play these days (look at Yao and Shaq, it's harder than ever to setup a good post game for a big man). But if you look at Amare's game when they are able to run, he actually does play occassionally with his back to the basket before defense has time to get into a defensive scheme and can take a player one on one in the post. And with a point guard like Nash, they can run and get him posted up. But this is why Nash is good for him and he's good for Nash, a big man that get run the floor and get into the post before the defense is completely set and a pg that push the ball and can get it into the post before the defense is set.

But the way today, the were basically giving Nash open jumpers even in transition and sealing off any passing angle to Amare in the post in transition.

 

Just see Dirk have his way with Shawn Marion a dn Walter McCarty makes me even more in awe the defense TMAC and Bowen played against the Deutche Bomber.

TMAC is indeed an underrated defender.

 

I don't think TMAC is underrated in defense department. Actually, the league already took notice during his Raptors time. I really hated to see him go at the time, coz he played way better defense than VC. But with Orlando, he was the main focus of offense, and he couldn't afford the energy in defense. I know lots of people here hate Kobe, but if he wants to, he plays very good defense as well. Look at MJ and Pippen, they are all great defensive players. I believe all the great offensive players can play great defense, because they can anticipate your move so well. But whether they have the mind set or energy to play defense night in and night out, it's another story.