I didn't watch the VP debate, nor do i know alot about politics but can someone give me a rundown on what was said as a timetable for the war in iraq? if there is any and both sides please.
Obama favors making Iraqis taking more control and a 16 month withdrawl plan. McCain favors no timetable. One is a time for the Iraqis to step up and pay for their own country, the other is...they are not ready yet. DD
IIRC, there was a question about a plan for withdrawing from Iraq. Palin spoke first but didn't really answer the question. Biden responded with "with all due respect, I didn't hear a plan." He proceeded to lay out Obama's 16 month phased withdrawl plan. Palin responded that they won't set a time line and will let the generals on the ground tell them when they think Iraq is ready to govern themselves.
Obama-Biden - withdrawal McCain-Palin - more of the same/no real answer see the bolded portions for the closest thing to an answer IFILL: You both have sons who are in Iraq or on their way to Iraq. You, Governor Palin, have said that you would like to see a real clear plan for an exit strategy. What should that be, Governor? PALIN: I am very thankful that we do have a good plan and the surge and the counterinsurgency strategy in Iraq that has proven to work, I am thankful that that is part of the plan implemented under a great American hero, General Petraeus, and pushed hard by another great American, Senator John McCain. I know that the other ticket opposed this surge, in fact, even opposed funding for our troops in Iraq and Afghanistan. Barack Obama voted against funding troops there after promising that he would not do so. PALIN: And Senator Biden, I respected you when you called him out on that. You said that his vote was political and you said it would cost lives. And Barack Obama at first said he would not do that. He turned around under political pressure and he voted against funding the troops. We do have a plan for withdrawal. We don't need early withdrawal out of Iraq. We cannot afford to lose there or we're going to be no better off in the war in Afghanistan either. We have got to win in Iraq. And with the surge that has worked we're now down to presurge numbers in Iraq. That's where we can be. We can start putting more troops in Afghanistan as we also work with our NATO allies who are there strengthening us and we need to grow our military. We cannot afford to lose against al Qaeda and the Shia extremists who are still there, still fighting us, but we're getting closer and closer to victory. And it would be a travesty if we quit now in Iraq. IFILL: Senator? BIDEN: Gwen, with all due respect, I didn't hear a plan. Barack Obama offered a clear plan. Shift responsibility to Iraqis over the next 16 months. Draw down our combat troops. Ironically the same plan that Maliki, the prime minister of Iraq and George Bush are now negotiating. The only odd man out here, only one left out is John McCain, number one. Number two, with regard to Barack Obama not quote funding the troops, John McCain voted the exact same way. John McCain voted against funding the troops because of an amendment he voted against had a timeline in it to draw down American troops. And John said I'm not going to fund the troops if in fact there's a time line. Barack Obama and I agree fully and completely on one thing. You've got to have a time line to draw down the troops and shift responsibility to the Iraqis. We're spending $10 billion a month while Iraqis have an $80 billion surplus. Barack says it's time for them to spend their own money and have the 400,000 military we trained for them begin to take their own responsibility and gradually over 16 months, withdrawal. John McCain -- this is a fundamental difference between us, we'll end this war. For John McCain, there's no end in sight to end this war, fundamental difference. We will end this war. IFILL: Governor? PALIN: Your plan is a white flag of surrender in Iraq and that is not what our troops need to hear today, that's for sure. And it's not what our nation needs to be able to count on. You guys opposed the surge. The surge worked. Barack Obama still can't admit the surge works. We'll know when we're finished in Iraq when the Iraqi government can govern its people and when the Iraqi security forces can secure its people. And our commanders on the ground will tell us when those conditions have been met. And Maliki and Talabani also in working with us are knowing again that we are getting closer and closer to that point, that victory that's within sight. Now, you said regarding Senator McCain's military policies there, Senator Biden, that you supported a lot of these things. In fact, you said in fact that you wanted to run, you'd be honored to run with him on the ticket. That's an indication I think of some of the support that you had at least until you became the VP pick here. You also said that Barack Obama was not ready to be commander in chief. And I know again that you opposed the move he made to try to cut off funding for the troops and I respect you for that. I don't know how you can defend that position now but I know that you know especially with your son in the National Guard and I have great respect for your family also and the honor that you show our military. Barack Obama though, another story there. Anyone I think who can cut off funding for the troops after promising not to is another story. IFILL: Senator Biden? BIDEN: John McCain voted to cut off funding for the troops. Let me say that again. John McCain voted against an amendment containing $1 billion, $600 million that I had gotten to get MRAPS, those things that are protecting the governor's son and pray god my son and a lot of other sons and daughters. He voted against it. He voted against funding because he said the amendment had a time line in it to end this war. He didn't like that. But let's get straight who has been right and wrong. John McCain and Dick Cheney said while I was saying we would not be greeted as liberators, we would not - this war would take a decade and not a day, not a week and not six months, we would not be out of there quickly. John McCain was saying the Sunnis and Shias got along with each other without reading the history of the last 700 years. John McCain said there would be enough oil to pay for this. John McCain has been dead wrong. I love him. As my mother would say, god love him, but he's been dead wrong on the fundamental issues relating to the conduct of the war. Barack Obama has been right. There are the facts.
I remember this now... this was the looooong pause for Palin before pulling out the surrender line. For a moment, I thought she was going to run home w/ her ball.
wow thanks for that sam! Well, as someone who fights and has fought in iraq. i kinda have to go with biden, because i think the war against terrorism, has been pushed into a diffrent country and what we are fighting there now is sectarian violence. Also the Iraqis are tired of us telling them what to do..... imagine this having another country roll down your streets, in tanks trucks just destroying anything and everything in its way. you wouldn't be the happiest person in the world. after it has been going on for 5 years, you would get tired of it. maybe you want some revenge for maybe family members that died, so you walk outside and just start shooting at them! or placing a bomb in the road! thats real life over there thats what happens. We are not fighting known terrorists there anymore, we basically driving down the road looking for a guy to shoot at us or blow us up. we have done what was needed in that country to take saddam away. check. build economy, and drain ours. check. see how many soldiers can we have die for no cause. check. I feel the war against terrorism is necessary but we have driven all the terrorist out of iraq into different countries, we need to back out, let new leaders show face that take charge and in 2years go wipe them out. terrorism will never stop you can only try to contain it.
Not true. 16 months is the projected date, but its always subject to change, given the stability of the nation. But your answer is pretty clear cut I guess.
Since you obviously don't know the candidate's position please stop trying to pass it off as the candidate's position since it just isn't.
XBL... Thanks for the explanation of what's really happening down there. We sure as hell don't hear it here...thanks for your service, too.
Given the political environment, withdraw is the easy answer, at least in wooing for the voters, so I don't quite understand.
I think that it was telling that Biden did not evethe old "surrender" thing. It might appeal to the faithful few that still support Bush.
I thought hte best Biden line (which I didn't previously know) on Iraq was the fact that Iraq's govt has an $80 billion budget surplus. The fact that we are footing the bill for their security is starting to become infuriating - there's a lot of things that 80 billion can be doing back here.
80B Surplus? Do you really believe that? 80B oil revenue or 80B surplus as Biden said? I don't think Iraq will have anything close a surplus in the next 10 years.
From NYTimes: Soaring oil prices will leave the Iraqi government with a cumulative budget surplus of as much as $79 billion by year’s end (2008), according to an American federal oversight agency http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/06/world/middleeast/06surplus.html
Since a link has been provided and the amount has been confirmed, has that changed your stance on Iraq at all? It does not make any sense for us to stay in Iraq indefinitely while continuing to pour out $10B a month from our funds now, does it? Especially since our economy is hurting so bad. People are getting it now because they are struggling. McCain made the mistake of not setting a timetable for withdrawal.
It's still not a surplus. It's money that hasn't been used because many projects haven't started because of security issues. Saying Iraq has a surplus, is like saying the US has a surplus because it just got $700B in the bank.
