Useful Mo Salary Information

sounds like a plan to me. our cap situation has NO meaning whatsoever in this scenario.

Same goes for Shandon.

Now, WHAT do we have to lose by getting SAR and Reeves and maybe Othella as a bonus?

what good cap does us when only Webber an Finley are worth it next yeard and with the former probably going to NY and the latter staying put?

Besides, i would rather have 'Reef on the rockets than Finley. Any day.

So is it Dream and KT and picks? Is it Dream and Walt? Dream, KT and 'Los?

I don't care. Get this deal done and we are contenders. Maybe even THIS year if things go our way an the team jells.

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"I have posted so much that what I say must be true"

 

This type of a cap provision makes it very possible to deal for Rahim by taking on Reeves and still keeping the nucleus intact. It would be very difficult for Shandon and his agent to validate him receiving significantly higher than Mobley. Thus, Shandon signing on an early bird like Mobley did would seem to be the logical solution. 6 yrs at 32-35 mil is more than fair for Shandon. Also, 8-9 mil a season is more than enough for Mo.

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Check out the Best Source for Draft Info

Draftsource.net

 

How do you know CWebb is going to NY? Has he said anything about that?

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personally i think resigning our free agents SA and MO unless CWEbb all of a sudden comes is the #1 priority. since we dont have tons and tons of capr oom, if we have any left i'd go after mark jackson... then maybe draft a SF or C. just dont think any big trades or free agent signings r coming.

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--TEX

 

He and Sprewell have both hinted (indirectly?) at re-uniting.

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"Christ, it's not as if Steve pissed on a guy!!!!!" -- cson makes a return to my quotable sig as he comments on how Steve Francis should not be T'd up for slapping the backboard on a dunk...speak loudly cson, you rock!

 

Nike,

Once Hakeem's contract expires, we'll be under the cap. That means that we won't have a mid level exception to give to Taylor. Now, if you trade Hakeem and we're over the cap, then you'd have that exception to give Taylor.

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Sound like a plan to me... trade Hakeem for Reeves and Reef and we can give Mo the contract Nikestrad has come up with.

Now, WHATS KEEPING US FROM PULLING THE TRIGGER!!!!!!

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"Dream another dream, this dream is over... Dream another dream, this dream is over... Dream another dream..." - from the Van Halen song, "Dream Another Dream". Fitting, isn´t it?

 

Maybe Vancouver have realised were robbing them

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CUT Tino
These Heaves are just getting Ridiculous!

 

I pray that isn't true, my friend.

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"Dream another dream, this dream is over... Dream another dream, this dream is over... Dream another dream..." - from the Van Halen song, "Dream Another Dream". Fitting, isn´t it?

 

So what? You either have the exception, or you have cap room. Either way, NIKEstrad is right about the $$ amount.

Also, you could sign another free agent before signing Mo' as a way to use the cap on the FA and the Early Bird on your own man.

 

One question, is there anyone in this draft that is as good as Rahim?

And can we get him?


Then I say go out and get Rahim!!!!


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The guns are cocked and the soldiers are in place, it's time to march and let the battles decide the war.

 

i agree

pushing Pippen69 down

 

So what? You either have the exception, or you have cap room. Either way, NIKEstrad is right about the $$ amount.Also, you could sign another free agent before signing Mo' as a way to use the cap on the FA and the Early Bird on your own man.

HP,

You're correct in terms of just signing Taylor and making no other roster moves, but that's never been in question. We've got cap space and obviouly we can give it to Taylor if we like. But I'm assuming that we're talking about the case where we didn't make a trade to put us over the cap and we intend to use some of our cap space to sign a free agent. If we're also signing a free then we can't neccessarily use Nike's strategy.

Here's an example:

-If we're under the cap on Aug 1st, then we don't have a middle class exception. Period. That is regardless of whatever moves we make after Aug. 1. If you sign some contracts after Aug 1 and go back over the cap, you still don't get your middle class exception back. So, under this scenario, we're under the cap on Aug 1 and our middle class exception is gone for the entire year.

-According to Davo's page, we've got about $33M in salary commitments for next season and the cap will be around $43M.
That gives us $10M in cap space

-We'll most likely have two first round picks next year, possibly three, so you'll need to deduct those salaries off of your cap space. Let's be really conservative and say $2.5M, so now we've got $7.5 M in cap space.

-Moochie is making $364K, so he's counting against the cap at $473K. Assuming that we intend to keep Norris, we can't renounce him in order to first sign a FA because we'd lose the ability to sign him under early bird rights. So, you have to deduct his $473K off of your cap space, reducing it to around $7M.

-Taylor would be counting $3M against the cap until we resign him or renounce him so our actual cap space is $4M. Now, Let's say we renounce him (no real loss since we don't have his early bird rights yet) and free up that money so our cap space is again $7M.

-We then go out and sign Marc Jackson for $6M (probably a bit low) and we're left with $1M in cap space,no mid level exception and no early bird rights on Taylor. How are you going to resign Taylor? Even if we trade all of our draft picks for future picks, we'd still only have $3.5M to offer Taylor next season.

- That scenario assumes that Anderson doesn't opt out of his deal. If he does, then we'd have even less cap space.

Does that make sense?

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[This message has been edited by aelliott (edited January 18, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by aelliott (edited January 18, 2001).]

 

yeah that makes perfect sense. But teams do not give Mid-Levels to the same player two years in a row. It is not needed.

I still disagree about all this having any effect on signing a FA and Mo' this year. The Bird Exception can pay Mo' the identical amount to the Mid-Level. I thought it was clear to everyone that some type of Bird exception is always available to a player who wants to stay with their home team. The CBA is designed to keep players in place, by giving home teams the advantage. I always consider the Spirit of the CBA when looking for these things. I guess I confused things by not using the proper name for it, "the Non-Bird Exception", which covers *any* free agent on your team; years in service doesn't matter.

The Non-Bird is for a 120% raise, which could conceivably be more than Mo' would get for the Mid-Level. Is the league average Salary expected to greatly increase the value of a Mid-level next year or something? Am I missing something?

Bottomline: It will not matter if we are below the cap by the combined sum of our exception, thus lose the Mid-Level. We can pay Mo' mid-level *range* salary just as NIKE says, *and* sign a free agent with the cap room.

[This message has been edited by heypartner (edited January 18, 2001).]

 

yeah that makes perfect sense. But teams do not give Mid-Levels to the same player two years in a row. It is not needed.

Why not? That's exactly what Minnesota did with Joe Smith and LA did with Rick Fox. If you don't use the exception, how would they pay the player?

The Bird Exception can pay Mo' the identical amount to the Mid-Level.

Huh? Taylor won't be eligible for an early bird deal until he's been here two years.

The Non-Bird is for a 120% raise, which could conceivably be more than Mo' would get for the Mid-Level. Is the league average Salary expected to greatly increase the value of a Mid-level next year or something? Am I missing something?

I think I see where your confusion is:

In the last CBA, the amount of the mid-level exception was defined as follows:

98-99 $1.75 million
99-00 $2.00 million
00-01 $2.25 million
thereafter The "average" salary of the previous season

So, through this year, it's been an arbitrarily selected fixed number. Starting next year it's calculatged off of the average salary. Based on this year's salaries that number would be around $4.5M. So, that means that Taylor could get $3M from us for a non-bird exception(120% of $2.5M), but other teams could offer him the $4.5M mid-level exception or of course, they could use available cap space and offer more.


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[This message has been edited by aelliott (edited January 18, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by aelliott (edited January 18, 2001).]

 

It is a misconception that Joe Smith and Rick Fox signed two Mid-levels. Smith signed one Mid-Level and then a Non-Bird for 120%. Rick Fox was different because he signed a $1 minimum before the new CBA when no Mid-Level existed, then he signed a Mid-Level on his 2nd year, so his 3rd contract was an Early Bird.

Teams haven't used two Mid-Level's in a row for the same player, because it is a waste of an exception and the players make more money signing the Non-Bird, which inspires the player to sign the 2 one-years. This year is the only year it makes sense, because the one-time big jump in the Mid-Level. But this is an anomaly year. After this year, the Mid-level doesn't jump as fast, and can actually go down. The Non-Bird is what teams look to use as the second contract.

Mo' can sign a Bird exception this summer for 120% over his salary, at the very worst.

aelliott's point is clear: if Davo's predicted cap room is more than the Mid-Level plus the $1 M exception, then we lose them both. That number is assumed to be $4 plus $1.3M.

So, if our cap room exceeds approx $5.3M we lose those exceptions and can only use the Non-Bird or the cap room on Mo'. But, we indeed can sign a FA and re-sign Mo' with a Non-Bird exception.

My point is that NIKE's numbers are accurate. That money will be available no matter what.

I do see what you are saying that there likely will not be a chance to spend Davo's cap room on a FA *and* give Mo' the NIKE contracts. Thx, yes I agree on that. In fairness to NIKE, he never said that in his calculations. I'm the one that strayed and said that without proper research, forgetting about the anomaly year for Mid-Levels increases. I get careless that way, because it wasn't my main point, and I was just thinking of Joe Smith's contracts. Thanks again for showing the numbers discrepancy.

[This message has been edited by heypartner (edited January 18, 2001).]

 

HP,

But, we indeed can sign a FA and re-sign Mo' with a Non-Bird exception.

That's correct, but that non-bird exception for Taylor would be $3M not $4.5M. Nike mentioned that we could offer Taylor the mid-leve $4.5M exception and said "everyone should find this useful whether or not we make the 'big trade'.". To me that implied that we could offer the mid-level exception whether or not we're over the cap, which we can't. That was the only point that I was trying to correct.


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