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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    So are we finally at the point where as a nation we have realized the Bush Administration knew there was a very low probability of WMDs but invaded anyways? Let's hope this isn't Bidens legacy too.

    ....12 years the CIA has been meddling in Ukraine?

    NYT: CIA network of bases in Ukraine at risk if US does not pass aid
    https://news.yahoo.com/nyt-cia-network-bases-ukraine-123116608.html
     
    LosPollosHermanos likes this.
  2. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    Russia, not the United States, invaded Ukraine because Nazi.

    It’s no secret that US Intel has been working with Ukraine since Russia invaded Ukraine.
     
    astros123 likes this.
  3. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    "We knew there was no WMDs. We did it to liberate the people"
     
  4. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    So wait the argument is now that the US is actually invading Ukraine?
     
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  5. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Contributing Member
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    Fine, good people. Pretty sure Matt Gaetz and MTG liked this post.
     
    No Worries and FranchiseBlade like this.
  6. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    I am absolutely positive you would allow US troops on the Ukraine front line if that is what your party told you was best.
     
  7. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    Seriously… what in Gods name are you blabbing about???

    Your point only makes sense if you are talking about Putin’s ridiculous excuses to invade Ukraine. And lord knows you’d rather be caught dead then ever say anything remotely negative about Vladimir Putin.

    You are so animated with your anti American passion that you really have ceased to worry about making f-ing sense.

    I hear Moscow is nice this time of year Comrade. Why don’t you just take a nice long 20 year vacation there if you are so committed to defending it.
     
  8. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    I am very pro american. Ive said it dozens of times. We should be focusing domestically. We should be spending that money here on education, medicine and infrastructure. Its important we continue to make the core of our country stronger. We should spend better efforts at educating the immigrants, illegal or not, instead of using them as political pawns like the disgusting democrats and republicans do.

    Instead, you are over here swearing feudality to the war mongers.
     
    basso likes this.
  9. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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    new Ukrainian language translation of the 4th movement. worth seeking out.

    всі люди стають братами


    RoonShareImage-638445728507347970.png
     
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  10. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    I believe he's simply making his same old argument that Ukraine can't win this war and implying that Biden agrees but isn't honest about it. He's not articulating it well or clearly, maybe because he knows how silly and lazy the association to Bush's Iraq war is.

    BTW, rocketsjudoka, I'm absolutely positive you and people like you will support sending troops to Ukraine because YOUR PARTY said so. You are such a cult member.
     
    #15450 Amiga, Feb 26, 2024
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2024
  11. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    There you go again with your gaslighting. I’ve said zero things that are pro war mongering. The entire purpose of funding Ukraine to protect themselves is to deter future invasions that’ll draw us in a conflict.

    The only one here with the stance that’ll get the US in a war is you by promoting a nationalist agenda that empowers dictators around the world. You are doing nothing but recycling the same talking points that Lindbergh made when he was in the pocket of Axis powers dictators.



    Your propaganda is a problem. You are full of crap and the only ones who buy your crap are Trumpers and maybe an idealist RT Today leftists. Everyone else with half a brain understands that we don’t live on an island in this world. The military industrial complex sucks. It’s a problem. Bush’s war in Iraq was a problem. Vietnam was a problem. You also know that of course I am in favor of expanding healthcare and education. My wife is a public school teacher a$$hole.

    I know that you know I believe all of that so you try to use my liberal leanings as a bullsh$t gaslight tactic in order to support your pro Putin agenda.

    Fck off to Moscow jacka$$.
     
    Andre0087 likes this.
  12. LosPollosHermanos

    LosPollosHermanos Houston only fan
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    And they’re trying to get us to war Iran now too
     
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  13. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    Huh? How is that a response or clarification to my post?

    Also it’s a good thing that other than volunteers we don’t have US troops on the front line. Also more reasons to make sure that Ukrainians have the abilities to defend themselves o we don’t have to even consider putting US troops there.
     
  14. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    To add the only situation at the moment where we would have to commit US troops to the region would be if a NATO country is attacked. One of the points from the beginning is that we need to support Ukraine to dissuade Putin from trying to attack NATO countries like the Baltic states.

    Our support of Ukraine isn’t just about feeling bad for Ukraine but is about averting a wider war that will require an even greater commitment from us.
     
    Amiga likes this.
  15. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    The Biden administration is open about preventing a wider regional war in the ME, advising Israel not to respond to Iranian-backed aggression, deterring Iran from escalating tensions, normalizing Saudi relations with Israel, and supporting a two-state solution involving multiple players in the ME. They are not seeking war with Iran or any other ME country.

    Statement from President Joe Biden on U.S. Military Operation in the Middle East | The White House

    After U.S. Strikes, Iran’s Proxies Scale Back Attacks on American Bases - The New York Times (nytimes.com)
     
  16. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    For those who claim that the Biden administration or our military complex wants to continue the war in Ukraine, you have forgotten that the Biden administration warned everyone that Russia had decided to invade Ukraine. Despite this, they engaged with the Russians to address their security concerns through diplomacy in an effort to prevent the invasion. Russia, at the time, denied their intentions to invade and showed no interest in diplomacy, ultimately leading to the invasion. This isn't the action of an administration that desires war but rather one that attempted to prevent it.

    Russia-Ukraine Tensions: Citing U.S. Intelligence, Biden Says Putin Has Decided to Invade Ukraine - The New York Times (nytimes.com)

    “It is not too late to de-escalate and return to the negotiating table,” Mr. Biden said, referring to planned talks between Secretary of State Antony J. Blinken and Russia’s foreign minister next week. “If Russia takes military action before that day, it will be clear that they have slammed the door shut on diplomacy.”
     
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  17. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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  18. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    Russia is not going to attack a NATO nation. This is a fantasy. You are being encouraged to support this fantasy when there is zero evidence Russia will attack a NATO nation. All the evidence suggests otherwise.
    Just like the Iraq war, you were told to 'trust' there were WMD's when the intelligence community had zero evidence, but yet we entered into an illegal war. Over a 1/4 of a million needlessly died for "American interest".

    Putin has stated he will not attack a NATO nation unless they are provoked. Simply because Putin is a liar (all politicians are ...again, there are no WMD's) does not make it opposite day and can be used as evidence. This point is a non-starter in this discussion. Look at the conditions instead:
    -China and India will not support Russia if Russia attacks NATO. For the most basic reasons. They will sanction Russia.
    -Half the globe will rally around NATO.
    -THE MOST IMPORTANT PART - Russia does not have the capital to fight a war bigger than the one its in now, nevermind lacking the support inside Russia. The Ukraine 'special operation' is tolerated at best, just like Americans tolerate our 'special operations'.

    The most probable options at this point are:
    -declare a cease fire. Russia gets to keep everything it currently occupies and acknowledged by the West, with Kiev becoming part of the EU (not NATO). The new Ukraine now becomes a low growth country for the next couple decades.
    -The inevitable fall of Ukraine and Maldova.
    -A coup overthrowing Zelensky and directly negotiating with Putin.

    This is an interesting poll.
    For those who are so concerned about Poland -
    17.4% (the highest of all nations polled) believe Ukraine is winning the war
    conversely, 33.4% (also the highest of all nations polled) 'don't know/don't care)

     
  19. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    Putin also stated that he will not start a war with Ukraine unless ...

    Putin does this propaganda thing that encourages you to believe him, and when he goes against his word, he shifts blame to others and urges you to believe in a different narrative.
     
    No Worries likes this.
  20. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    I don't think anyone has forgotten the Biden administration warned of an inevitable invasion. I was one of those people who did not believe Russia would invade Ukraine. We didn't hastily abandon Afghanistan because we wanted out of war. The US left hastily because the intelligence community knew Russia was going full provocation.
    In Spring of 2022, military advisors were signaling to industry that they expected the Ukraine conflict was going to last a decade. That is not the case. Capitulation is setting in. More and more Americans want us to abandoned this conflict.
     
    LosPollosHermanos likes this.

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