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Uhmmmm, Bring it On? Guardsmen offer candidates differing responses

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by basso, Sep 17, 2004.

  1. basso

    basso Member
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    from the NYTimes:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/15/politics/campaign/15bush.html

    http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/17/politics/campaign/17kerry.html?pagewanted=print&position=

    --
    Interrupted by several standing ovations, he said Mr. Kerry would undercut the military operation in Iraq, where about 50,000 National Guard troops are now serving.

    ...It was part of a theme Mr. Bush has used in stop after stop in recent days, as polls suggest that his attacks on Mr. Kerry's reliability as a future commander in chief are beginning to have a measurable effect. But Tuesday was the first time one of those attacks received a prolonged standing ovation, and Mr. Bush, showing a tight smile at the response, argued that it was essential that "the president of the United States speak clearly and consistently at this time of great threat in our world, and not change positions because of expediency or pressure."

    "He failed to tell you the truth," Mr. Kerry, the Democratic presidential nominee, said to a crowd that greeted him with restrained applause.

    ...The convention of more than 4,000 Guard officers responded far more coolly to Mr. Kerry than it had to Mr. Bush. The hall, which had been full on Tuesday, had scattered empty chairs on Thursday as Mr. Kerry arrived, and the group, which repeatedly interrupted the president's speech with standing ovations and hoots of approval, offered Mr. Kerry a polite but quieter reception.

    At the point that Mr. Kerry said Mr. Bush had not told the convention the truth, a man shouted out "No!" As Mr. Kerry finished speaking, a few officers sat in their chairs, arms crossed. Col. Joanne F. Sheridan, of the Louisiana National Guard, got up and walked out before he was done.

    "Mine was a silent protest to what he was saying," Colonel Sheridan said later. "What he was saying about George Bush not telling the truth on Iraq - I just don't believe that. George Bush did tell us the truth, so I guess I couldn't believe what Kerry was saying. Here, he came before a military audience, but he said what he said for the media, for the television cameras - not for us, that's for sure."

    Other officers praised Mr. Kerry for saying he supported lowering the Guard retirement age to 55 and allowing guardsmen to have access to military medical coverage even when they are not deployed.
    --

    And the WaPo:

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A27270-2004Sep16.html

    --
    The 3,500 National Guardsmen at the conference in Las Vegas gave Bush seven standing ovations, but Kerry received polite -- but only occasionally enthusiastic -- applause. Kerry's biggest applause lines occurred when he talked about new benefits for those who serve in the National Guard.
     
  2. mc mark

    mc mark Member

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    Nice to see Kerry have the balls to stand up and speak to a group of people that may not agree with what he has to say unlike a certain pResident.
     
  3. basso

    basso Member
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    but who really has the biggest balls in this campaign? :eek:

    [​IMG]
     
  4. mc mark

    mc mark Member

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    Looks more like camel toes.
     
  5. AMS

    AMS Member

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    LMAO.
     
  6. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Atomic Playboy
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    [​IMG]

    Well you just drove this thread right off a cliff.
     
  7. basso

    basso Member
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    i know, didn't think the picture merited it's own thread, but, back on topic, kerry has put so much emphasis on his military service, it's fascinating to watch the differing responses of veterans groups to the two candidates. i think it's also indicative of how little the public, and certainly the military, cares about the whole national guard kerfluffle. i still think this issue backfires for kerry/moveon.
     
  8. Kyakko

    Kyakko Member

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    I watched a breif on that... here's my take. my thoughts are that bush's speech was more of a rally, where as kerry's was sobering. Kerry is obvious the more intellegent of the two, hands down. If that was a prep rally at a high school, bush was the popular jock whereas kerry was the class president. I did see about two people walk out on Kerry speech, but i also saw an older audience member started to cry during an intense moment.
     
  9. mc mark

    mc mark Member

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    That's because the truth of this war is sobering and some people can't handle it...
     
  10. bamaslammer

    bamaslammer Member

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    More likely they were bored to tears. What a dryball Kerry is! He has to be one of the dullest public speakers in recent memory, even worse than Clinton's rambling, flowery wastes of oxygen in vais search of a coherent thought.
     
  11. thegary

    thegary Member

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    :rolleyes: as opposed to w's inspired eloquence, right? :rolleyes:
     
  12. bamaslammer

    bamaslammer Member

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    I never said Bush was eloquent, but he doesn't exactly put you into a deep sleep like Kerry's rambling monotone does.
     
  13. thegary

    thegary Member

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    bush doesn't put me to sleep, he makes my blood boil.
     
  14. mc mark

    mc mark Member

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    Seriously!

    My wife won't let me watch him anymore as I tend to start throwing things at the TV and screaming uncontrollably.

    :)

    I'm out! Yankees and Red Sox tics! Time to drink some beer!!!!!
     
  15. thegary

    thegary Member

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    cool, i gotta watch it on tv :(
     
  16. nyquil82

    nyquil82 Member

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    right, Bush keeps hammering away at the same thing over and over like he's forcing us to learn something. Some people learn through the Sesame Street method, but us adults have outgrown it. Seriously, watch his speeches, map out his logic, and then compare it to Sesame Street. Exactly the same. Not to bust on the middle states and the educationally weak middle-america, but its no surprise that these are the people most enamored by his speeches.

    personally, when I'm listening to a speech, I want to know HOW we are safer and WHAT we are doing to continue with it. I dont need to hear that "we are safer" 27 times without any reasoning behind it. but if you are the type of person who enjoys being told how to think without a reason to back it up, vote Bush.

    I'll agree that Kerry is a bore to some, but that's because many can't understand logic and others don't like to be lectured to. Again, if you wan't to be entertained, Mr. Sesame Street is right for you.
     
  17. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    If that's what you think of Clinton as a speechmaker, then I don't know what to make of any other opinions about political orators that you might have. Well, I do, but I want to continue in the D&D effort to attempt semi-respectful give and take amongst the members. :)

    Clinton was/is/can be superb. Several of his opponents give him credit for that, regardless of what they think of his politics. You don't look objectively at the abilities of people, certainly in politics, if their politics disagree with yours. I always thought Reagan was very good, even if what he was saying made me cringe. I don't see that coming from you... not that I can remember.

    My opinion, of course.
     
  18. bamaslammer

    bamaslammer Member

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    This is exactly the problem with the Left in general. Your intellectual snobbishness is the very reason that you wonder why many on the Right despise you. Kerry is a huge offender as a leftist who thinks he "knows better" than most. His arrogance and condescension is insulting. But this is a common attitude amongst the Left, at least from what I can gather from this board, where they are the true intellectuals and those not in their orbit are mental midgets.

    Well, you did "bust" upon the heartland, which I find very offensive. Flyover country as your ilk would dub it is more of real America than the crowded, decaying East Coast metro-hells most leftists call home. Kerry is an awful public speaker, no matter what party you are a part of.

    As for Clinton being a great orator, maybe it was the fact he told the truth (where was the middle-class tax cut he promised us? Guess he forgot?) 10 percent of the time that was a turnoff. Or maybe it was the fact he rambled on as if he were in love with sound of his voice, which I think he did. I saw Reagan speak and he followed my father's rule of speaking (my father is a member of his church's priesthood and delivers sermons) which is "make it short, sweet and to the point." Clinton on the other hand, reminded me of the song about the Wanderer (I wander, wander, wander). I saw him speak and my first thought was "When is this sonuvabitch going to call it a day? Standing at position of attention is getting painful."
     
  19. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    The Republicans need to hire some of those professional protestors that the Democrats use. Are they unionized? Are they even available?
     

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