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Turkey to seek parliament approval for Iraq incursion

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by tigermission1, Oct 10, 2007.

  1. tigermission1

    tigermission1 Member

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    Turkey to seek parliament approval for Iraq incursion

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/2007101...resterdogan;_ylt=ArX7MdlZ9P13I_AKHf8.T7EBxg8F

    ANKARA (AFP) - Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan said the government was likely to submit a motion to parliament Thursday seeking approval for an incursion into northern Iraq to pursue Kurdish rebels.

    Erdogan, however, hinted that no immediate military action was planned.

    "We could send the motion to parliament tomorrow," he said in an interview with CNN Turk television late Wednesday, adding that a vote on the motion was likely to take place next week.

    He said the government was planning to seek a one year authorisation for an incursion into northern Iraq.

    "It does not mean that everything will happen once we have the authorisation," he said. "We want to have the authorisation in hand so as to make a swift decision when it becomes necessary."

    Under Turkish law, parliament must authorise any deployment of Turkish troops abroad.

    Exasperated by mounting separatist Kurdish violence and Iraqi inaction against rebel bases, Ankara decided Tuesday to employ all measures, "including a cross-border operation if necessary," to combat the Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK).

    Ankara says the PKK, listed as a terrorist group by Turkey and much of the international community, enjoys free movement in northern Iraq and obtains weapons and explosives there for attacks across the border in Turkey.

    It has accused the Iraqi Kurds, who run the region, of tolerating and even supporting the rebels.

    Fifteen soldiers were killed in rebel attacks in southeast Turkey at the weekend, triggering a public uproar and increasing pressure on the government to take tougher action.

    Erdogan expressed frustration with what Turkey considers the US failure to help end the PKK safe haven in northern Iraq.

    A series of consultations between a US and a Turkish representative, appointed to coordinate joint efforts against the PKK "did not produce the expected results," he told CNN Turk.

    "It turned out to be period of wasted time," he said. "They (the US) say they are against the PKK. If you are against, then you should do what is necessary."

    The United States on Wednesday again warned its NATO ally against unilateral military action in northern Iraq.

    The United States is concerned that such action will destabilise a relatively peaceful region of conflict-torn Iraq and fuel tensions between Ankara and the Iraqi Kurds, a staunch US ally.

    The PKK has waged a bloody campaign for Kurdish self-rule in southeast Turkey since 1984. The conflict has claimed more than 37,000 lives.
     
  2. tigermission1

    tigermission1 Member

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    Turkey escalates offensive near border

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071010/ap_on_re_mi_ea/turkey_iraq;_ylt=AiMyFr9CGoAh1UNEGYumSDQBxg8F

    SIRNAK, Turkey - Turkish warplanes and helicopter gunships attacked suspected positions of Kurdish rebels near Iraq on Wednesday, a possible prelude to a cross-border operation that would likely raise tensions with Washington.

    The military offensive also reportedly included shelling of Turkish Kurd guerrilla hideouts in northern Iraq, which is predominantly Kurdish. U.S. officials are already preoccupied with efforts to stabilize other areas of Iraq and oppose Turkish intervention in the relatively peaceful north.

    Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan told reporters that preparations were under way for parliamentary authorization of a cross-border operation, and told private CNN-Turk TV that the motion might reach Parliament on Thursday. The preparations "have started and are continuing," he said. An opposition nationalist party said it would support the proposal.

    If parliament approves, the military could choose to launch an operation immediately or wait to see if the United States and its allies decide to crack down on the rebels, who have been fighting for autonomy in southeast Turkey since 1984 in a conflict that has claimed tens of thousands of lives.

    "If you're against (the rebels), make your attitude clear and do whatever is necessary," Erdogan said in comments directed at Washington. "If you cannot do it, then let us do it."

    Turkey and the United States are NATO allies, but relations have also been tense over a U.S. congressional bill that would label the mass killings of Armenians by Turks around the time of World War I as genocide.

    President Bush strongly urged Congress to reject the bill, saying it would do "great harm" to U.S.-Turkish relations. Defense Secretary Robert Gates said that 70 percent of U.S. air cargo headed for Iraq goes through Turkey, as does about a third of the fuel used by the U.S. military in Iraq.

    "Access to airfields and to the roads and so on in Turkey would very much be put at risk if this resolution passes and Turkey reacts as strongly as we believe they will," Gates said.


    Turkey has conducted two dozen large-scale incursions into Iraq since the late 1980s. The last such operation, in 1997, involved tens of thousands of troops and government-paid village guards. Results were inconclusive.

    The latest Turkish military activity followed attacks by rebels that have killed 15 soldiers since Sunday.

    Turkish troops were blocking rebel escape routes into Iraq while F-16 and F-14 warplanes and Cobra helicopters dropped bombs on possible hideouts, Dogan news agency reported. The military had dispatched tanks to the region to support the operation against the rebel Kurdistan Workers' Party, or PKK, which the U.S. has branded a terrorist organization.

    Also Wednesday, assailants hurled a hand grenade at a police vehicle in the southeastern city of Diyarbakir, killing a police officer and wounding four other people, according to reports and officials. There was no immediate claim of responsibility, but Kurdish rebels have carried out similar attacks.

    Elsewhere, authorities detained 20 Kurds, including eight women, at the Habur border gate with Iraq, the Sirnak governor's office said. Two of the 20 were carrying false ID cards. The office said the suspects had attended a PKK meeting and that those attending were told to prepare for violence against government offices.

    State-run Anatolia news agency said the suspects — most of them university students — were detained as they entered Turkey. Rebels often cross back and forth from bases in Iraq, using remote, mountain passes that are difficult to monitor.

    Turkish military leaders have described an incursion as a necessary tactic to push back the rebels and disrupt their safe havens and supply lines. The government is also deeply frustrated at its inability to curb attacks by concentrating on operations within its own borders, and under pressure to show resolve to an outraged public.

    But such an operation could harm relations with Washington, create instability across the border and destroy livelihoods in the poor region. Turkey provides electricity and oil products to the Iraqi Kurdish administration in northern Iraq, and the annual trade volume at Habur gate, the main border crossing, is more than $10 billion.

    "If this border gate is closed because of war, then everybody in this region will suffer," said Mehmet Yavuz, a Turkish truck driver, hauling cement to the Iraqi Kurdish city of Irbil. "This border gate is daily bread for us."
     
    #2 tigermission1, Oct 10, 2007
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2007
  3. pirc1

    pirc1 Member

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    It is legal I believe to invade Iraq to chase terrorists. :p
     
  4. tigermission1

    tigermission1 Member

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    The Turks have all the justification they need, the only thing that has kept them in check thus far has been in deference to U.S. sensitivities in Iraq.
     
  5. RocketMan Tex

    RocketMan Tex Member

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    And thus starts the all out regional war, ala Yugoslavia.

    Bravo, President Dipsh*t.

    :mad:
     
  6. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Exactly.
     
  7. hotballa

    hotballa Contributing Member

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    hmm bad timing what with the armenian genocide vote
     
  8. tigermission1

    tigermission1 Member

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    Methinks it's good timing because the Turks are using this as leverage, and President Bush and his people are going almost all out to make sure that this non-binding resolution doesn't pass.

    Do you think their timing is coincidental? :)
     
  9. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    It is interesting to me to see this story after listening to it on the BBC yesterday. The story on the BBC very prominently repeated an official US response that said almost exactly, "Each country must decide what is necessary for its own defense. We urge both parties to consider a diplomatic solution."

    The above quote hints to me of acquiescence. But all of the American stories leave out any hint of a US response, or vaguely hint to a more stern warning. This makes me think that there is one version for US consumption designed to make the US look strong, and another internationally that reflects reality.

    It could be nothing - just random noise in the way that stories get reported - but I am inclined to believe otherwise.
     
  10. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    BTW, from the Turkish side, I wouldn't read too much into the timing. As I understand it it is a response to the following which occured on October 6-8:

    [rquoter]

    14 Turkish soldiers killed in renewed Kurd attacks

    DIYARBAKIR, Turkey (Thomson Financial) - Kurd separatist rebels killed a Turkish soldier early Monday only hours after 13 others were killed in fighting near the Iraq border, authorities said.

    The latest fatality in the military was blown up by a mine in the Lice district of Diyarbakir province in southeast Turkey, local authorities said.

    The army said that 13 soldiers were killed Sunday in an attack by the separatist Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) in Sirnak province, bordering Iraq, Anatolia news agency reported.

    A PKK rebel was killed while fighting the army in the Mount Cudi area of Sirnak, the regional government reported.

    On Saturday, the army announced that it has created 27 new temporary security zones, reinforcing the already existing plan to deter rebel movement in the Sirnak, Siirt and Hakkari provinces, all close to the border with Iraq.

    Ankara estimates that there are thousands of PKK rebels who are supported or tolerated by Iraqi Kurds.
    [/rquoter]

    source
     
  11. mleahy999

    mleahy999 Member

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    Why would Turkey care what the US congress thinks? Would we care if the Turkish parliment passed something negative against us?
     
  12. tigermission1

    tigermission1 Member

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    Probably because the Turks are extremely sensitive about this topic, and they don't want a major NATO ally (its biggest ally, actually) 'stabbing them in the back', so to speak. For the U.S., Turkey is a traditional ally with strong relations with another strong ally in the region, Israel.

    But to answer your question, they care, deeply...
     
  13. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    In support:

    source

    [rquoter]

    Turkish president protests U.S. approval of genocide bill

    ISTANBUL, Turkey: Turkey's head of state protested a U.S. congressional panel decision to approve a bill calling the World War I-era killings of Armenians a genocide, saying the decision came as a result of "petty domestic politics."

    Despite earlier protests Wednesday in Turkey and opposition by U.S. President George W. Bush, the House Foreign Affairs Committee passed the bill by a 27-21 vote — a move likely to be considered an insult by most Turks.

    Bush had warned that the bill could harm U.S.-Turkish relations.

    "Unfortunately, some politicians in the United States have once again sacrificed important matters to petty domestic politics despite all calls to commonsense," President Abdullah Gul was quoted as saying by the state-run news agency Anatolia.

    "This unacceptable decision by the committee, like its predecessors, has no validity or respectability for the Turkish nation," Gul said.

    Egemen Bagis, a foreign policy adviser to Turkey's prime minister, told Turkish private NTV television early Thursday that he was disappointed by the vote.

    "This is a result that Turkey does not deserve. From now on, our effort will be to stop this measure from coming to the house floor, or even if it does, (our effort will be to) stop this from passing there," Bagis said.

    Bush had urged Congress to reject legislation, and Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and Defense Secretary Robert Gates also conveyed their concerns.

    Passing the measure "at this time would be very problematic for everything we are trying to do in the Middle East," Rice told reporters at the White House hours before the vote

    On Wednesday, hundreds of Turks marched to the U.S. Embassy in Ankara and the consulate in Istanbul to protest the bill.

    The U.S. Embassy, meanwhile, urged its citizens to be alert for possible violence after the vote, amid fears of an increase in anti-American feeling in Turkey.

    Members of Turkey's left-wing Workers' Party on Wednesday chanted anti-American slogans in front of the U.S. Embassy, an embassy official said. They left books on the sidewalk in front of the embassy, saying they were written by Armenian historians and politicians who also believed a genocide did not happen.

    The state-run Anatolia news agency quoted party official Nusret Senem as saying the "genocide claim was an international, imperialist and a historical lie."

    A group of about 200 people staged a similar protest in front of the U.S. Consulate in Istanbul, also leaving similar books on the sidewalk out front, private NTV television said.

    The Turkish anger over the bill has long prevented a thorough domestic discussion of what happened to a once sizable Armenian population under Ottoman rule.

    Armenians say up to 1.5 million Armenians were killed in a systematic genocide between 1915-17, before modern Turkey was born in 1923.

    Turkey says the killings occurred at a time of civil unrest as the Ottoman Empire was falling apart, and that the numbers are inflated.

    Turkey's political leadership and the head of state have told both Bush and U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi that passing the bill could strain U.S.-Turkey ties, already stretched by Washington's unwillingness to help Ankara crack down on Kurdish rebels holed up in Iraq.

    "If a country passes a bill that harms Turkey, then we should make a move that will counter it," said Onur Oymen, deputy chairman of the main opposition party in Turkey. "More than 70 percent of logistical support to U.S. operations in Iraq is done through Turkey."

    After France voted last year to make it a crime to deny the killings were genocide, the Turkish government ended its military ties with that country.

    When Washington started an arms embargo against Turkey in 1975, due to a dispute over Cyprus, Turkey ended all its logistical support to the U.S. troops and intelligence until the embargo was lifted, Oymen said.

    Many in the United States also fear that a public backlash in Turkey — a key NATO ally — could lead to restrictions on crucial supply routes through Turkey to Iraq and Afghanistan, and the closure of Incirlik, a strategic air base in Turkey used by the U.S. Air Force.

    [/rquoter]
     
  14. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Atomic Playboy
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    A Turkey incursion - just in time for Thanksgiving.
     
  15. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Any chance this could have been a black-ops by Iran to roil the waters? I was trying to remember how often the PKK have made attacks of this nature against the Turkish military and with such success. Just a thought. This is one of those times when I'll wish I'd googled this first, instead of speculating first. ;)




    D&D. Impeach Bush for Promoting Terrorism.
     
  16. Rashmon

    Rashmon Member

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    Thanks for the laugh.
     
  17. danny317

    danny317 Member

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    WW3

    gonna have to start recruiting more illegal immigrants into the military or start a draft.

    no way the military can extend tours again...
     
  18. pppbigppp

    pppbigppp Member

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  19. danny317

    danny317 Member

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    this could easily escalate into a really really bad situation.

    but i think cooler heads will prevail. (i hope :confused: )
     
  20. danny317

    danny317 Member

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    man this tread is dead :D

    i see a storm brewing... too bad the collective attention of the US seems to be unaware of the implication of this situation. :(
     

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