Hakeem at number 1! Digg it. http://thehoopdoctors.com/online2/2009/06/top-10-nba-defensive-players-of-all-time/
I like their number 1 choice, but I have some issues with the rest of their list. Kareem is #2? It seems like he most went with career steals, blocks, and rebounds. Having Stockton on this list, but no Rodman and no Pippen doesn't sound right.
one of the few times i'd say, 'wrong forum' cause it SHOULd go in the garm. This thread is more about Hakeem #1 than anything else!! (But it works fine here, too)
i appreciate the gesture but anyone that uses steals/blocks/rebounds statistics and DPOY accolades as their primary (and in this writer's case, seemingly sole) evidence in supporting defensive prowess doesn't deserve to be taken seriously.
I don't like the Kareem choice. But aside from that, I don't have huge issues. I would think Russell would be higher.. Rodman should be on over Wallace.. Pippen over Kareem maybe? And then the order would shuffle as Pippen slides in at 10, Mourning 9, Rodman 8, move Russell up somewhere higher
Yes, that list is very strange. Stockton was smart at playing passing lanes, but he was garbage on the ball. Also funny that the majority of the list played in the 90's...clearly identifying the age of the writer.
Weighted too heavily towards big men. Where are the all-purpose guys (Rodman, Cooper, Pippen, Battier, Bowen) who can guard multiple positions?
you'd think he'd have dropped in Rodman, Pippen then.. or even Bowen, though I'd disagree with that like I disagree with Wallace. Need it over a longer stretch of a longer career to be on a list like that
while I agree for Hakeem at #1 I dont care for much of the rest of the list. having gary payton that high, having kareem that high, having zo, russell and deke that low is a crime. leaving rodman and pippin off the list is a travesty..I hate pippin but there is no denying his defensive talent. if i had to make a list i would go 10. zo 9. stockton 8. payton 7. jordan 6. rodman 5. pippin 4. deke 3. wilt 2. russell 1. dream i am sorry wallace was a great defender but i think he was pretty much a "stats" all-star like he got a lot of rebounds and blocks but i dont really remember him being a guy who could stop his man in the middle. Rasheed was a better post defender than ben was. ben would flop far too often
It's a stupid list, and its entirely driven by stats. Russell should be way higher. Wes Unseld should get a mention on any all defense team, certainly better than Ben Wallace. Guards should include Michael Cooper and Walt Frazier. Maybe Joe Dumars. There should at least be some forwards. Rodman, Pippen, Bobby Jones, Dave Debuschere. Centers is pretty good. Kareem was a great defender when he was young, but slacked alot. Wes Unseld should be on any all defense list. Possibly Moses. Russell should be higher than Wilt, maybe higher than Hakeem (but it was different eras).
much better, yoyo duffy, you need to put a list together of your own if you're gonna do something like that. Cause anyone can throw out a bunch of names...you're approaching 20 names with the guys you listed, plus the centers which you liked, plus guys I assume you still include like Jordan and Stockton
OK, here's my list, but not in any order. All I'm thinking about is guys that I have seen who could completely turn around the character of a game with their defense. Guards - Jordan, Payton, Walt Frazier They basically invented the steal stat because Frazier brought the steal to prominence. He is to steals what Russell was to blocks. Forwards - Rodman, Pippen, Dave Debusschere I think they invented the all defensive team largely because of Debusschere. He won first team the last six years of his career, which were the first six years of the award. I've never seen a smarter or tougher defender. If you ever get a chance, see if you can find footage of game 5 of the 1970 championship, just to see the D the Knicks played after Reed went down. Centers - Hakeem, Russell, Chamberlain, Deke I don't think any explanation needed here. Jabbar actually misses out because of his longevity. With Magic, I always thought Jabbar was dialing it in on D, and you rarely saw flashes of his former greatness. And when he was with the Bucks, he was tremendous, but not in the same class as the others. I leave Wes Unseld off the list only because I'm left with only ten. I could pretty easily switch him off with Deke. For a couple of years, Unseld was better than anyone I've ever seen on defense. But it only lasted a few years, and that's not enough for this list.
Mutombo should've been higher. How did Rodman or Pippen not make the list? I thought at times, Pippen was a better defender than MJ. No power forwards on the list. Kareem was good defender, but I don't think he was as good as some of these other centers. The list is not perfect, but at least it didn't put anyone totally undeserving on there.
As much as I hate Scottie Pippen, he also put on one of the great defensive performaces in modern history was when he almost played the "1" in a box and one defense and roamed around tipping balls and creating turnovers in the 1998 finals vs. the Jazz when the Bulls held them to 54 points in that one game.
I've never understood the fascination with Rodman. He was an annoying defender, and perhaps a great one for a small period of time, but he did not sustain it. He made some flashy plays, rebounded a lot, and gave the impression of working hard, yet he could only play well when he was within a certain comfort zone of being a role player. His numbers drop in the playoffs... some years significantly so. He was frequently out of defensive position because he was concentrating on padding his rebounding stats. His numbers for steals and blocks are underwhelming. His two DPOY awards came at the height of the Pistons run, where he was a valuable contributor. However, after that he seemed to fall into the trap that rebounds were the most important thing and he neglected to develop other aspects to his game. He was not by any means a shutdown defender against good post players... again, he was annoying and would use some quickness to try to interrupt the entry pass, but once the ball was delivered, it was over barring a Bad Boys bush league move like pulling the chair out or flopping. I think most people get seduced by the rebounding numbers and the remembrance of flashy plays made on TV (not to mention his public persona). He quit on a number of teams, and often only seemed concerned about his own stats. If you want to be on any Top Ten of All Time lists, you don't take your shoes off and lay down in the middle of a playoff game. Here are some stats... 1996 Finals: Kemp averages almost 4 more ppg. 1997 Finals: Rodman plays Luc Longley type minutes, averaging 7.6 RBG while scoring 14 points for the entire series. Meanwhile, Malone has a 24 and 10 series. 1998 Finals: Same song second verse... Rodman goes for 3.5 and 8 while Malone goes for 25 and 10.
