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The 00's the Chinese Decade and Chinese Triumphalism

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by rocketsjudoka, Jan 3, 2010.

  1. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    I was reading over two articles about the PRC this morning and thought they helped explain some many of the issues and attitudes that have been brought up in CF.net debates.

    The first article is about how relations in the first part of 2010 could be tense between the Obama Admin. and the PRC due to weapon sales to the ROC and a meeting with the Dalai Lama.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34671422/ns/politics-washington_post

    U.S.-China relations to face strains, experts say
    Obama’s looming Dalai Lama meeting, Taiwan weapons sale could sour ties

    What I found very interesting in the article was this part:
    [rquoter]New assertiveness
    Still, U.S. officials and analysts have noticed a new assertiveness — what one senior U.S. official called a "sense of triumphalism" — on the part of officials and the public in China. This stems from a sense in Beijing that the global economic crisis proves the superiority of China's controlled economy and its authoritarian political system — and that the West, and in particular the United States, is in decline.

    This triumphalism was on display during the recently concluded climate talks in Copenhagen. China only sent a deputy foreign minister to meetings set for the level of heads of state; its representatives publicly clashed with their American counterparts. And during the climax of the conference, China's security team tried to block Obama and the rest of his entourage from entering a meeting chaired by China's prime minister, Wen Jiabao.

    That type of swagger is new for China and it could make for a stronger reaction from Beijing.

    "If they really believe the United States is in decline and that China will soon emerge as a superpower, they may seek to take on the U.S. in ways that will cause real problems," said Bonnie S. Glaser, an expert on China with the Center for Strategic and International Studies.
    [/rquoter]

    The second article is about how the last decade the PRC has basically reshaped the World.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34481985/ns/us_news-decade_in_review/

    In one decade, China reshapes the world
    Symbolized by the 2008 Olympics, most-populous nation makes its mark

    The article points out how China's vast modernization in the last decade has had profound affects for both the PRC and throughout the World.

    Found these two paragraphs pretty interesting:
    [rquoter]For many despots in the world, China has become an attractive model: an authoritarian system that delivers stupendous economic growth. Why bother listening to American sermons about democracy when autocratic China seems to be thriving?

    But China's political system remains brittle. Even things like Facebook and YouTube are perceived as threats and blocked by China's Internet censors. The leadership seems to know that although the surface can appear calm and orderly in an authoritarian society, a small problem can quickly develop into a big one.[/rquoter]
     
  2. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    China should listen because it is no where near a developed economy. When the Chinese economy starts inventing things rather than just assembling, then the discussion will shift.

    Until then, China is just the West's factory.
     
  3. Air Langhi

    Air Langhi Contributing Member

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    The problem is what does america make?
     
  4. Bandwagoner

    Bandwagoner Member

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    Money. the only thing that matters.
     
  5. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    Money, drugs, medicine, weapons, etc.
     
  6. Bandwagoner

    Bandwagoner Member

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    difference? :confused:
     
  7. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    I put things like MRI and PET scanners under medicine, while lipitor would fall under drugs.
     
  8. Bandwagoner

    Bandwagoner Member

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    Look to japan for those items then.
     
  9. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    True, but I subconsciously lump Japan in the West when talking about economies. That, and GE owns many patents on medical machinery.
     
  10. Northside Storm

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    China may be the West's factory but it is also the debtholder. This is why I think the balance of power is slowly shifting to China.
     
  11. Grizzled

    Grizzled Member

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    Their regulatory system protected them from suffering the same problems that befell the US, but then so did Canada’s. Maybe they are beginning to see their star rising, but politically their system is headed for inevitable change, and I would think that they would be aware of this. They are creating an ever expanding, wealthy, powerful, middleclass. The free enterprise direction they’ve taken inevitably leads to a devolution of power from the government to the bourgeoisie.
    I don’t think China is an attractive model for despots, not ones with brains anyway. The Chinese government is progressively giving up power. It’s just managing the way that’s happening.
     
  12. YallMean

    YallMean Member

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    One or two international incidents, which may reflect China's foreign policy change from passive past on that front, don't mean China thinks it is superior to other developed nations.
    But a stronger sense of sovereignty and self esteem is rising among Chinese, in contrast to 10 or 20 years ago, when many Chinese think moon is more round in developed countries. Americans overstaying visa in China these days get kicked out of China and a lecture about China's sovereignty, which was unheard of 10 years ago.
    I don't think it is fair to call that sentiment triumphalism.
     
  13. orbb

    orbb Member

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    The balance of power is being decentralized, but it definitely wont be tipping towards China. It can't afford to antagonize the US and Russia at the same time for example, and Europe will always side with the US.
     
  14. Ari

    Ari Member

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    Good! Competition is healthy. Lord knows Americans need to get off their asses and start competing again. America needs to regain its competitive edge, but before that we will need to eat some humble pie first.
     
  15. A_3PO

    A_3PO Member

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    China's influence in the world is growing both economically and militarily and there is nothing the U.S. can do to stop it. Get used to it because it will continue unless there is a sudden event or two that throws things off track. Bush got it right when he said the two countries are strategic rivals. The sparks will fly.
     
  16. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Probably the fact that Mercantilism runs out of customers will be that track thrower-offer.
     
  17. Ari

    Ari Member

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    China should also try to not drink too much of its own kool-aid. At the end of the day, China invents practically nothing! America is still by and large the innovation engine behind the world's progress. As long as America continues to dominate the world in intellectual property, China will continue to lag behind.

    Also, China will no longer be the 'world's factory' when its standard of living goes up enough so that it would make more sense to shift production elsewhere, it is just how capitalism works. Industrial production is a terrific way to develop a nation's economy and modernize its infrastructure, eventually someone else will be able to provide that service for cheaper and then China will have to find other venues for growth. Granted, China is still a few decades from worrying about that.
     
  18. CometsWin

    CometsWin Breaker Breaker One Nine

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    Hello, India.
     
  19. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    I think the CCP will be okay with not being top dog in the next 50 years...provided that they're still in power.

    They're playing a long term game.
     
  20. Northside Storm

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    Well, yes. I think the Chinese are keenly aware of that.

    And one area I know China has made significant progress over the United States is in stem cell research, thanks to the very wise executive order severely limiting research in that field, mandated by our dearly beloved President Bush Jr. The ambition is there as well; we know China is trying to become a leader in green energy and medical innovation as well. The talent pool is coming along too. The infrastructure and support are being provided. Quite simply, there is almost nothing that can stop China from simply transitioning away from the world factory into a more knowledge-based power. The will is there and the resources are too.
     

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