Stop Loss and three questions for the Bush supporters

1. No
2. a resounding YES.
3. Would have, but just a bit too old (I did in '74)

Just to clarify, I'm a HUGE Rockets homer. I'm a HUGE Houston homer. I'm a HUGE Texas homer. And as such, I'm a HUGE USA homer. My passions are degreeless.

RR

 

Not saying you are evil or anything like that, but it is ONLY because of people like you, or the blind loyalty you showed, Nazi Hitler and Japanese governemnt got supports among their citizens to committ atrocities in WWII.

Being a patriot doesn't mean following the leader whereever he goes or no matter how wrong he is.

 

First, I would like to thank you for your service, cmiller. I was an ardent Vietnam War protester, and was prepared to go to Canada (at least that's what I told myself, lol!), but got lucky. I think the professional military is arguably the finest institution in the country, woefully underpaid, woefully without the benefits they deserve, and that their families deserve, and is being crucified by the incompetence of this administration, along with Bush's mad infatuation with Rumsfeld, the worst War Secretary we have had since McNamara. The examples of that incompetence are in plain sight, for those who bother opening their eyes.

The way Stop Loss is being handled is a scandal. The way the National Guard is being strip-mined of it's equipment to furnish the hard-pressed troops in Iraq is a scandal. Our readiness, if we were faced with another sudden conflict, is a scandal, and it's because of the stubborn stupidity of the people at the top. Those generals who called for more troops were ignored, forced to retire, or threatened with being passed over promotion (which would end their career) if they didn't shut their mouths. I could go on, but I'll answer your questions, instead.

1) In the classic sense, no, we are not in a national emergency. In reality, we are, because the Administration has placed us there. What should have been a conflict fought by law enforcement and special forces, except for Afghanistan, the one thing I agreed with Bush about, before he pulled out forces from the theatre and placed 7 times as many in a war we didn't have to fight in Iraq. There, we needed to do what we did... take names, kick ass, and go after those behind 9/11 and the government that backed them. We did not need to fight a war in Iraq, with the resultant chaos showing itself today in Afghanistan, something completely predictable for those with even the slightest knowledge of the country and the region.

2) I am completely against the draft, and for expanding the volunteer military, increasing their pay and benefits, equiping them as they should be, spending the money to do so, and increasing taxes to pay for it. Not cutting taxes during a war for the first time in our history. I am middle-aged, so the draft doesn't apply to me, but I have a 15 year old son, and I have no intention of having him face a draft. Not for the reasons we have been given by the Administration.

3) Clearly, I don't support Bush, so this question doesn't apply.


Thanks for your post. Post more often!



Keep D&D Civil.

 

1. As 'national emergency' is defined when we're engaged abroad like in Iraq, yes. Even as we were in massive draw downs from Vietnam there were similar mandatory extensions for some personnel. You are certainly correct that such programs are the same as the draft in terms of making your service mandatory.

2. If drafted I would definitely go. I think there should be a draft. Give everyone a choice of either the military, the peace corps, or something like the civilian conservation corps. I do think the draft should only serve as a supplement to the military, however. The AVF is just heads above the draft in terms of developing a professional fighting force.

3. No, I haven't visited a recruiter. I don't think that to support an intervention one must go sign up.

I echo Deckard's comments commending you for your service.

 

2. I unlike W am not bat sh*t crazy. I would move to Canada and not look back. Let the crazy f*ckers in Red States bleed red for their W.

 

Would I be a coward if I said I believed I could support my country at home which wouldn't require me to change my life in any way?

 

Is it cowardly to constantly push through tax cuts during a war, for the first time in our history? Is it cowardly for the Administration to reward it's supporters among the wealthy and Big Business during a war in that fashion, when the National Guard is being strip-mined of it's equipment to supply our forces in Iraq, and are at one of the lowest levels of readiness in recent memory?


WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. National Guard units are under-equipped and increasingly unready to help in domestic disaster relief because essential gear is left behind after service in Iraq and Afghanistan, a congressional report said on Thursday.

Heavy demands on the Guard since September 11, 2001, have caused "declining readiness, weakening the Army National Guard's preparedness for future missions," the Government Accountability Office said.

It said the Pentagon's strategy for the Guard was "unsustainable and needs to be reassessed,"

The report said Guard officials believed the response by its units to Hurricane Katrina last month "was more complicated because significant quantities of critical equipment, such as satellite communications equipment, radios, trucks, helicopters and night vision goggles, were deployed to Iraq."

Guard troops and other relief workers complained that they did not have the equipment to communicate properly for days after Katrina swept ashore, destroying phone and radio links.

The Bush administration has dismissed concerns expressed in Congress that foreign deployments had hampered the military's ability to respond to domestic disasters. "We've got plenty of troops to do both," President George W. Bush said last month.

http://www.mfso.org/article.php?id=410



Is it cowardly to ask the men and women of our volunteer military and their families to sacrifice, but not raise taxes to pay for the equipment they need? To cut taxes, instead?

I think it is. I think George Bush is a coward.



Keep D&D Civil.

 

I don't think any of that is the right thing to do, but I'm not sure it's cowardly.

 

1. Yes.
2. Yes.
3. I support Bush and his actions, I have not visited a recruiter. My personal skillset and preferences are better suited to a non-military career.

 

Tax cuts are good. Supporting the wealthy and big business is clearly good. Our military is volunteer, and there is plenty of money to pay for their equipment. I have the utmost confidence is Rumsfeld as a defense secretary, and as Bush as a president. Maybe if the American public were more supportive of our nation and it's policies we could pursue a more beneficial course of action in the Middle East. As it stands, Bush is doing a fine job of walking a middle ground (but at times panders too much to the middle).

 

And Lincoln got support among his citizens to join the Union army, fight the Civil War and end slavery?

Or FDR got support among his citizens to enlist, fight WWII and help end the Holocaust and Japanese Imperialism?

 

So i can conclude that you support blind loyalty??

 

OH yeah there is plenty of money to go around... It's light cigars with $100 dollar bills time. Pay no attention to the future costs of caring for the 20,000+ wounded troops, the utter depletion and exhaustion of the National Guard and it's assets, the cut in the number of top rate fighters being purchased (from 600 to 183), no biggie that the 6 BILLION per month Iraq costs us is the equivalent to buying 3 aircraft carriers, or more than we spend on education.

And Rummy... yeah... Everything the man does turns to gold. From the fine job he did preventing 9/11, his triumphant capture of Bin Laden, to the utter flawlessness of Iraq. Not to mention you just can't get the guy to stick his foot in his mouth.... He's just the best Secretary of Defense ever.

You really hit the nail on the head with the President too... It's only the powerful evil of the Democrats that thwarts our President and savior in the Middle East. And agreed, he is definately too middle of the road, and should move back to the right. If we need to, we should be able to turn a terrorist inside out to tell us what we want to hear. I tell ya, give those hippies an inch and they'll take a mile!

 

This is hilarious. The American public is the nation. This is the problem with Bush Republicans in a nutshell. You think the nation is the President. Most of us realize that in a democracy the nation IS the people. The President is our servant.

 

I'm not a Bush supporter but since these questions seem open to all I will respond.

I will agree with Deckard's answer to one.

2. Even though I oppose the invasion of Iraq I'm not against a draft and agree with HayeStreet's response on a draft as a type of broader national service. The main reason why I would support a draft is that while an all volunteer military is more professional it allows huge segments of the population to dissociate from the military. We've often heard the argument, "Well these people volunteered" regarding disgruntlement with the Iraq deployment. Yes that's true that they did volunteer but that doesn't mean that they should be treated so cavalierly. If our military service was more widely based there would be much more empathy and caution regarding the deployment, equipment and care of the military. If there was a draft I would go. I don't agree with the current leadership but at the sametime if there is a legal draft I would feel obligated to follow the law.

3. I obviously don't support this Admin..

 

just to clarify, i'm a bush supporter because he is serious about the WOT, which is definitely a "national emergency" this isn't a police action. so:

1. yes
2. yes
3. no, but then i'm nearer 50 than 40 so i'm unlikely to have 1A status. just missed the end of vietnam, and was too old for the cutoff when registration was reinstated in the late '70s.

 

First, cmiller: Yes I'm a Bush supporter (and a supporter of ANY president of ours), and Yes I would go to Iraq in a draft.

Canoner2002: Come on, admit it, you are calling me evil.

Well, since I've started posting a small bit more I've been compared to present day terrorists of the Middle East and now evil people of 1940 Germany and Japan. Although my actions would never ever suggest that I would be in any of those camps, apparently, and this part truly amazes me, my love for my country is all the reasons some of you need to try and label/compare me as such.

Just understand that, unlike present day terrorist and the citizens of 1940 Germany/Japan, I absolutely know I have a choice, a vote, the freedom and the awareness of history thats reflects what I will and won't do.

RR