Someone explain to me how this series 'shows up Phil Jackson as a fraud'

He coaches the Lakers now, let it go man, let it go.

 

He's not a fraud. He has really done a great job in turning the Grizzlies franchise around. Oh..what's that you say?? He doesn't coach the Grizzlies?? Something about how they don't have like the best to 2nd and 3rd best players in the game on their team?? Damn...I guess he is a fraud after all.

 

<i>Something about how they don't have like the best to 2nd and 3rd best players in the game on their team?? Damn...I guess he is a fraud after all.</i><p>
If he's a fraud, then so are Rudy T., Riley, Daly, Ramsey, Auerbach, and every other supposedly-great coach who never won an NBA title without a Hall-Of-Famer.<p>
To be sure, there is a kernel of truth in all the Phil-bashing, specifically that the Myth of the Zen Coach is just a myth. Fact is, coaches matter much less than people suppose.<p>
Daly and Jackson have a slightly stronger claim to fame than the others, who had players that were both talented and driven, and didn't have to deal with nutcases like Rodman and Pippen (both of whom were the ruin of lesser men like Bob Hill and Mike Dunleavy).<p>
But the bottom line is that the players are the horse, and the coach is the jockey. His capacity for harm is much greater than his ability to improve matters, and the best ones are those who properly understand their role and its limitations.

 

GB,

Phil has ridden arguably the greatest player ever and now arguably the 2 best in the game today to 8 titles.

Wow, it takes a lot of coaching to win with those guys. Don't give me the ego massaging crap, because that's so overrated.

Also, how about his decision to have FISHER on Bibby with the game on the line and then have the gall to say Kobe didn't want the job.

I am not impressed with his 8 titles or his ZenMaster crap, etc, because put a different coach in LA at the same time Kobe matures and I'm almost positive he wins championships too.

Also, memo to Phil, your team is not God, when things go wrong do not blame the refs in the media everytime please.

Finally, all I have to say is the series should be over right now(taking out Horry's miracle) and the Kings have been without Peja the whole series pretty much. Last I checked Shaq still was getting 20 and 10 in the series so while he isnt 100% he certainly has an impact on the games.

For a team so revered as LA, to be getting outplayed as throughly as they are by a team missing it's 2nd best scorer is quite pathetic, and wouldn't you say the coach deserves some of the blame here? Or is Phil invincible still? If so, I must've missed the memo.

 

<i>Finally, all I have to say is the series should be over right now(taking out Horry's miracle) and the Kings have been without Peja the whole series pretty much. Last I checked Shaq still was getting 20 and 10 in the series so while he isnt 100% he certainly has an impact on the games.</i><p>
So if Horry's last-second shot is taken away, but not Bibby's, and Stoyakovic's injury is cured, but not Shaq's, the Kings would already have won the series. Well, of course they would have, once you've cooked the books in such a biased way.<p>

 

My post was directed to gb and was worded for effect.

It doesn't take much to lead a team with Jordan in his prime to titles, ktheintz. Hell, a chimpanzee could come very damn close to doing the same thing.

DVauthrin pretty much summed up my arguments.

I will also add that unlike Larry Brown, who likes a challenge, or Rudy T or even dare I say, Pat Riley who have taken on rebuilding projects, your boy "Zenmeister" would go pick up his ball and go home because he wants no part of something difficult because that would mean he would actually have to do something difficult like coach a team without players who are the best in the game like Jordan, Shaq, and Kobe.

 

First of all,

I'll agree to wiping out Horry and Bibby's shots. But game 4 the Lakers were entirely lucky to have him at the 3 pt line when the ball was tapped out by Divac, and to win that game they were down by 27 in practically a must win game at Home. In this case, Sacramento led most of the way and while Bibby did save them, my point of the Kings outplayed LA still holds true. The defending champs should be ashamed of themselves for those performances at the Staples Center last weekend.

Oh, and on Peja compared to Shaq. How is that even remotely fair. The Kings haven't seen Peja all series except for an ineffective 15 minutes in game 5, last time I checked Shaq, injured or not, still was putting up 20 and 10 numbers.

Is it that hard to see that Shaq at least has made a solid contribution to the Lakers while the Kings have missed their 2nd best player/scorer all series for the most part?

That is not bias, that's just stating the cards both teams have dealt with this series and giving a close to fair evaluation, nothing more.

 

What other coach will ever be able to say that in his career he coached 3 of the Top Ten-Fifteen NBA players in History: MJ, Shaq, and Kobe.

 

Coaches do, do <I>a lot </i>of coaching during practice session's and pre game talks.

The players relye on coaches for various reasons. All players have to be coachable in many ways or they'd be the street legends on the street playing for free.


But we all know it takes a lot to play in the Nba and it also takes a lot of coaching. Meshing 5 players on the court at once to run plays, to set up 15 different defensive schemes during the course of an entire game, to set up screens, to find the open man, is a lot more complicated than it first presents itself front forth to the general public.

Some of these guys may have been superstars in HS. Kobe for example averaged 30.8ppg, 12rpg, 6.5apg at Lower Merion his senior year and He probably received 75% of his team shot attempts. Now if you take 12 other players on that Laker team this year and to look at all of their winding road toward the NBA, they all were superstars in their own respect.

It's up to the coach to mesh, to bring that talent into one group and win games. KObe can't and will not take 75% of the Lakers shots. 15-30% is more reasonable in kobe's respect.

And for that Phil Jackson does and should earn everybodys respect.

He sure has mine, regardless of the greats around him (Jordan,Pippen,O'neal,Bryant)

 

DV,

So your saying the triangle offense didnt have to do anything with the Bulls and Lakers championships???? I am pretty sure Phil Jackson could build a basketball team if he wanted to. I mean yea he has got lucky and got good players but he is still a good coach

 

Sonics,

If you want to give credit to Phil for the triangle offense, let's not forget Tex Winter invented it, and guess what he's been an assistant coach for all 8 of Phil's titles.

I think Phil is an ok coach, but the media portrays him as some god-like mythical figure which he cannot even begin to approach nor deserves.

Also, give me one example where he has built his own team? He wasn't willing to stay in Chicago for the rebuilding and got offered by the Nets and Knicks well before LA, yet turned them down?

I Wonder why?

 

I saw a special on one of the bulls title runs and they had one of the those inside the huddles during the timeout. All phil said was get the rebounds and then just said Micheal and gave jordan a stare that said do your thing. Any coach can do and say that. I have never had nor will I have respect for jackson. The clippers offered him a job as soon as he left chicago but he turned it down. But a year later when the lakers came calling he took the job. If he is that good why didnt he take the job with the clippers? they're in la too

 

I think Phil is an ok coach, but the media portrays him as some god-like mythical figure which he cannot even begin to approach nor deserves.

I agree with you on this one he isnt the "ZenMaster" i actually dont like that phrase either.

Also, give me one example where he has built his own team? He wasn't willing to stay in Chicago for the rebuilding and got offered by the Nets and Knicks well before LA, yet turned them down?

I said he could if he wanted to, not he has. Not sure why he turned them down, so your saying Phil Jackson couldnt do it?

 

I'm saying that, Phil is simply in the right place at the right time.

It's great for him, but in no way does he deserve all this media love he gets and I'd have to see him build a winner before he ever, ever gains respect in my opinion.

The great ones always find ways to fight through adversity, Phil Jackson prefers to run away or make excuses whenever he is confronted with adversity. See his departure from Chicago or ways he criticizes the officiating after every loss.

 

So do you think if Phil came to the Rockets and coached he wouldnt turn them around? even with Francis and soon to be Ming (most likely)

 

The Rockets were defeated by a ton of injuries this yr.

Two years ago, with an awful frontcourt, RudyT guided them to a 45-37 record in the tough western conference.

That's the kind of thing I want to see Phil do before I declare him a great coach.

So if you had to ask me do I think he could do it, right now I'd say no.