Flame me if you want, but the comments I've been reading are just totally uncalled for. And yes, I know this probably should go into another forum, but being that it relates directly to many of the threads here, I was hoping the mods could take pity and let it stay in the GARM. Players who loved the team, who didn't want to leave, who wished like hell they could've finished their career here. We get comments like "You're a loser" "You're a whiner" etc. Roger Clemens should ask for 30 million dollars a year, he's a Cy Young Winner, he won for Houston, should be allowed to ask for whatevr he wants right?. Beltran should have demanded 150 million since he was a winner for Houston. I know Franchise had his faults (and there were plenty), but some of you people called him totally moronic names just because he expressed a still strong desire to have stayed in Houston. By far the worst treatment of any athelete who espouses those same characteristics that most hypocritical fair-weather fans profess to want in a player, LOYALTY. In some of your desparation to wipe away any good qualities of Franchise, you embrace a player that some (me and all of Orlando, plus some NBA analysts) feel is a slacker and who admittedly has quit once on his team because he was unhappy about the situation. This is not a defense of Franchise's weak points (excessive dribbling, inability to make the entry pass, etc.), so don't quote me numbers and wins and losses, because if thats all that it matters to you, the next time an athlete talks about needing to feed his family on 14 million dollars a year, you should all just STFU as long as he's putting up the numbers and Ws. Bottom line, a player asked for the same loyalty he thought he showed a franchise and its fans, and in return he gets told that not only is he unwelcome, he is and always will be a loser who will never grow up. In that same breath, some of these same fans cry and moan when their football team leaves their city for a more lucrative financial deal in Tenessee. Ok I'm done with my rant, let the flaming ensue.
I will side with some of what you say in that he seemed like he really LOVED playing for us, but Jeff sold me when he talked about how Steve wouldnt come out to save the team and the new TOY BOX... When the the best people on this board JEFF, DOC ROCKET talk bad about him, there is a good chance they know much more then we do..
I don't see what that has to do with it. I love working for my company, but they have about a million charity events every year and I go to maybe one or two of them. I got things to do with my own life, my performance as a worker shouldn't be based on my off hours work with the company.
yeah, but your not in the public eye so you are right.....Steve is, so to me it does matter, I root for our team and all players up till the day they are gone...Hell I even lost a bet that we wouldnt trade Steve cause I liked him so much, but I'm just a dumb homer for our team.. I do see your point in that we could give him more respect, and we will at the game Monday... he unlike T-mac will get a standing O on Monday and I will be one of them, but that doesnt change the point that I like WHATEVER is better for the team and T-mac seems to be just that...
well the post wasn't directed at you, if you seen some of the posters in the game thread and the Fran article, you'd know exaclty why I posted this.
Glyde.....that was Jeff that talked about that....they are not the same person. hotballa.....gee...Orlando thinks he is a slacker? big surprise there... NBA analysts....say it...you mean Barkley and Smith....two brain dead morons that take EVERY opportunity to trash this team whenever they can...oh yea...Im gonna take my NBA opinions from them You just dont like him cause he has taken the focus of this team away fom Yao....admit it...you know Im right... and if I am as right as I think I am... that leaves you with zero credibillity on this issue... face it.....players and teams slack off if they know they aint getting anywhere....happens all the time.. McGrady's play so far this season for the Rockets has proven the assertion that he is a lazy, no good, me-first slacker as WRONG WRONG WRONG...... IF you dont see that...then you have a axe to grind and therefore cant be trusted to be objective.
you completely missed the point of my thread, which was to talk about the shoddy treatment Franchise is getting at the hands of some of the posters on this board. If you feel my shot at Mac was uncalled for, then feel free to ignore it. Why don't you just come out and label me a YOF? Don't play these silly games. Just because I have a problem with a player, suddenly I get a label attached to my name. I'm trying to stick up for a guy thatr I think needs it after the verbal beating his name is taking in these boards. if you think that all my posts are a hidden dig at Mac because you label me as a YOF, please save it for another thread. Allow me to show some love for a guy who worked hard and displayed major loyalty to my basketball team.
This was in response to the MANY shots you constantly make at Tmac... IF I thought even for a second that they were justified by his play THIS YEAR FOR THE HOUSTON ROCKETS...I wouldnt say a thing. Did I label you ANYTHING??? I dont use labels....not anymore anyway...it has gotten way too common here to do that.... but....I notice you didnt dispute the reason why you cant stand Tmac...did you? oh...btw....do you see me saying a thing about Francis? I said one thing....I said I hope he does well.....except when he plays against us....as any Rockets fan should.... Seems to me I must have hit a nerve.....Ill take you ignoring the question as confirmation that I am right....and wont discuss it any further...but now I know where you are coming from, adn Ill take your posts with that in mind... btw btw... you said let the flaming begin.....yet you b**** and cry when it does...if you cant take the heat...stay out of GARM.
Victorious return can't eclipse T-Slack's legacy in Orlando Published January 21, 2005 The boos started to build even before his name was announced. And then came the chants: "Meee-Mac! Meee-Mac!" And then the hoarse screams: "Hey, T-Mac, it's quittin' time!" And then the signs sprouted up all over the arena. One had Tracy McGrady's face pasted on a baby's body. Another read, "When the going gets tough -- quit." And what's that one say over there? "Tracy McQuitter: Where's our refund?" Or that one: "Quitters don't die, they just go to Houston." This is how it had to be. This is how you knew it would be. But this isn't the way it should have been. Tracy McGrady's return to Orlando Thursday night should have been like Grant Hill's return to Detroit just a few nights ago: Standing ovations. Adoring fans holding up signs of thanks. Even the opposing general manager (Joe Dumars of the Pistons) saying, "Grant Hill should get a great ovation from the fans here in Detroit. He represents everything that's right about professional athletes." As we all know, Magic GM John Weisbrod would never offer such a glowing assessment of McGrady. Especially Thursday after Weisbrod witnessed an all-too-familiar sight from last season: McGrady on the floor and the Magic not playing defense. This time Magic fans had to watch their team fruitlessly try to counter the offensive brilliance of McGrady, who scored 27 points and led the Rockets to a 108-99 victory. But even though McGrady triumphantly thrust his fist into the air after the game, he will never be a winner here. Sadly, the greatest pure talent to ever play in Orlando will be remembered like this: Me-Mac. T-Slack. McQuitter. "To leave a place where everything blossomed for you and to come back as the villain," Magic Coach Johnny Davis said, shaking his head, "that's painful." And this is the difference between Hill and McGrady; between being beloved and belittled; between being a pro and a prima donna. When Hill left Detroit, there were hard feelings but not hateful ones. But then Hill never committed the grand sin of sports: He was never accused of packing it in and quitting on his team. Unlike McGrady, he never publicly admitted to Sports Illustrated that he was taking millions of dollars and giving fans less than 100 percent last year. "It saddened me to hear that," Davis said. "As a competitor, no matter what the situation is, no matter how dire the situation may seem, it's just foreign to me to ever give up and not give total effort." "An athlete," Weisbrod said, "is not always at his best, but he can always give everything he has." McGrady, as we all know, has a penchant for saying things he shouldn't say even if they do happen to be true. Even Thursday, before the game, he was asked by reporters about a lawsuit against him filed earlier this week by a former employee who claims he was bitten and disfigured by McGrady's pet Rottweiler. Admitted McGrady: "That dog is vicious, really vicious." And that big splash you just heard was McGrady's attorney jumping off the St. Johns River Bridge. Is McGrady a terrible person? No -- just a selfish one. In his mind, he led the league in scoring last year so he did his part. As if doggedness and defense and toughness and teamwork have nothing to do with winning games. As for the crowd jeering him Thursday, McGrady just laughed it off while Rockets Coach Jeff Van Gundy slammed the fans. "There's no reason to boo the guy," Van Gundy said. " I just chalk it up to ignorance." Added McGrady unrepentantly: "The fans who were booing me wish I was still on their team. Actually, when I left Toronto, the fans were worse than this." What a great guy. First he tells Orlando fans that they weren't even good enough to get his full effort last year. Now he tells them they aren't even as loud and rowdy as basketball fans in a hockey country. It was billed as "70s Night" at TD Waterhouse Centre Thursday, but there was one notable musical omission. In the litany of bad 1970s songs that reverberated throughout the arena during timeouts, somebody forgot to play the most appropriate tune of all: Me and You and a Dog Named Booooooooo. Link
I ignored the question because I was trying to keep the focus on Franchise. I have my opinions about Mac in other threads, which I assumed you would respond to in those threads. I didn't want to turn this into a Mac thread, in retrospect perhaps I should have left out that comment about some people embracing Mac, would that make you happy? You hit a nerve with your dancing around the label issue, because seemingly everytime I say something bad about Mac, someone (not you) calls me a YOF, which I don't understand. I am a firm believer in the low post game from my days of watching Dream, were brad Miller or Ilgauskas the option at Center, I would be making the same complaints about the permiter guys' inability to play with the low post guys. There's an element of fans here that want Yao to be stressed simply because he is a skilled low post presence, not because he is a skilled Chinese low post presence. I'm not b****ing and crying btw, I'm just trying to clarify my statement, I dont mind getting flames like Francis sucks or I'm a moron for thinking that. but getting flamed for what I think is a misunderstanding is not something I am comfortable with
So it's ok for you to call Tracy MeMac, but godforbid someone calls you're boy stevie any names?. if you cant take the heat, getout of the Kitchen!
hotballa i agree with you that it is strange how alot of people bash steve because he wanted to play here. I'm very iritated because of that. I liked the trade and i love the fact that T-Mac plays for us. But this thread is not about who is the better player, or if the trade was good, this thread is about the fact that people bash steve for his comments that he wanted to be here. am i right hotballa if that i the case then i agree with you 100% p.s. this has nothing to do with T-mac or how the orlando fans treated T-Mac, it is about how alot of posters here treat Steve
Whatever T-Mac did before joining the Rox is done. I've really been impressed with his diving for loose balls, drawing charges, forcing steals, setting up his teammates... He is so much more than a pure scorer.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. Lemme get this straight. We're supposed to respect and like Steve Francis? The same Steve Francis that refused to report to Orlando and nearly stopped the Rockets from getting McGrady? The same Francis who reportedly didn't travel with the team because he wanted to go to the Super Bowl? The same Francis who now claims that he sold the tickets for the Rockets organization for the new stadium? The same one who publicly talks down on the Rockets head coach and playing style from last year? We're just supposed to just sit back, take this all in, and cheer for him when he returns to Houston right? McGrady could go on and on about how horrible Orlando was. His supporting cast sucked, the head coach had no idea what to do, the management didn't attempt to put more capable players around him. The list goes on and on about what McGrady could have said but doesn't. He moved on and doesn't talk as much about it as Francis does. But Francis can say it all day long about how bad it was in Houston and we are supposed to smile and cheer for him when he comes back? No hotballa, you have your opinion and others have theirs. Cheer if YOU want to but don't make it seems as if others who do not want to cheer for him have completely unfounded reasons. Do not chastize others who don't feel the same way you do. Leave it at that and stop your campaign to get people to cheer for Francis and making it seem like Houston hates players who return here. Hell, I'll cheer all day and night for Mobley when he comes back because he was a class act and did not act immature when the trade happened refusing to report. Mobley has my respect but Francis definitely does not. This is a tired argument, leave it alone man, my goodness.
Hotballa- Steve was loyal to Houston and I sure liked that about him. But because he was our Franchise savior, I mean player, from day 1 here it was an ugly divorce. What I mean is most fans were frustrated by Steve's play and top that off with the friction between Steve and JVG and you could see the marriage was in trouble. So some are going to bash him unfairly and yet a lot of fans feel fortunate that a change was made and the player to be named = TMac. Guess how the Grizzlies felt when they drafted Steve and he put the I'll never play here on them- hurt. Guess how Steve felt after the trade- hurt. I don't think the fans should blast Steve, he didn't do anything. But it's not wrong to be glad he's gone either. That's all about the future direction of the team. I'm glad we made the trade. Steve has all the talent in the world for a PG, superior quickness, leap and a good shot. But he is not a catch and shoot player, and he doesn't shoot well off picks. He is a spot up shooter and a slasher. He is not a pure PG, he struggles with decision making, turnovers, and he gets lost on defense. These are all BB issues and do not reflect on his heart and passion. I did enjoy watching him dribble the ball off his foot and lose it out of bounds committing an unforced error last night, it reinforces all the things that drove us crazy when Steve was here and reminded me of why I got excited over the trade. Let Steve rest in peace- all those for and all those against.
Jesus, can more Steve Francis fans come on the Rockets board and whine about how Houston fans are abusing poor Steve?
