I posted this in another thread but I wanted to make a new topic out of it to get some feedback. I just wrote it as a response to anothers question, but the more I think about it the more and more I like it. There were some rumors about this guy around the deadline but nothing ever happened. I really think Shareef Abdur-Rahim is exactly what the Rockets need. He's a bit of a tweener (Rudy likes players who can play 2 positions) but he puts up good rebounding numbers and can diffently score. I don't think he's the type of player that can "put a team on his back" (as he's shown in both Van. and Atl) so to speak, but I think he would be one hell of a complimentary player for Francis and Yao. Atlanta being where they are, they are diffently looking to make some changes. I think Mobley and Griffin would be a good starting offer. I'm not sure if they have any interest in those players so maybe you bring in a third team but I don't think they would laugh at you. Another thing to think about is next season Rice will be a hot commodity. A big contract in its final year. You will have to take another big contract in return but on a team not going anywhere and looking to get under the cap(Atl), you might be able to swing a pretty good player out of that. Although Les doesn't want to pay the luxary tax either so he may just let Rice play out his contract out and use the money to re-sign our own players.
Buck 88, If the rumors that were swirling at the deadline were accurate, the Rox could have had Rahim for Rice and Griffin. Mobley and Griffin do not work salary wise. Problem with Rahim is he is on a max contract and it is unlikely the Rox do a deal to bring in another Max Guy. If Rahim were on a more reasonable salary, then the Rockets might do it, but then why would Atlanta want to do the deal. The Rockets didn't then want to part with Griffin, and they obviously think they can land a better piece with GR's expiring contract.
Actually, that was what was conjectured by the fans on the board. Later on the rumors from the media were that the Hawks were asking for Mobes and Griff to be included in the deal. Yeah SAR for those 2 straight up doesn't work, but I'm sure a workable deal could be struck with those 3 as the main principles. I wouldn't do it, I think SAR is overrated.
I think the biggest drawback to SAR is his Max contract. He certainly is not a Max worthy player. SAR is suited more for the Eastern Conference where the forwards there are smaller than in the West. SAR in the west is more of a SF than a PF. In the East he is a solid PF. SAR has a nice offensive game and in my opinion is better suited to be a solid 2nd or 3rd option and not the first option. He is the first option in Atlanta, here he would be the 3rd option. You have to like SAR's ability to put the ball on the floor and attack the basket as well as hit the jumpshot. He has a nice offensive game. He is averaging over 20ppg for the Hawks. But defensively he is not all that much stronger than Eddie and doesn't have the shot blocking tendencies of Eddie. So I guess the question is, what do you want from your PF? If you want more offense then perhaps SAR is your guy. But defensively there might be a hole there. Do we get better in this regard? Remember, we have Mo Taylor coming off the bench. Probably a better fit would be someone like an Elton Brand who has decent size and long arms and can battle inside for rebounds (#1 in the NBA in offensive rebounding) and battle western conference PFs. That is the type of player that probably is a better fit with Yao Ming. Someone that has a well rounded offensive and defensive game and someone that is STRONG and can rebound the basketball. Let's put it this way, if the Rockets are going to deal for SAR then they should have decided to deal for Rashard Lewis over last Summer. Rashard is younger, has more upside and I believe his contract is not as large as SAR.
Crisco- I would agree with you that SAR is not a player to build your team around, but if you could get him to compliment Steve and Yao then I think you might have something. I would much rather have him shooting the ball then Mobley, so his offense isn't missed. And his straight-up man defense can't be any worse then Griffins (although he won't block as many shots). IMO he is the upside for Griffin (numbers wise), if you could get the sure thing then why not. Plus he's only 28 or so. He's been in the league awhile but remember he came out as a freshman from UCLA. The only drawback as I see it is that it would leave us with no viable 2. Unless you think Posey can play the 2 for extended minutes, and even thats is contingent upon us resiging him. But Rudy always finds a way to pull those CBA players out of his a$$...lol.
I've mentioned this before. SAR put up good numbers in the West as well as the east. Eventhough he's a max player, you could deal Taylor,Mobley and Griffin for maybe SAR and someone like Johnson to make it work. The same 14 shots Mobley takes,SAR takes them and makes 48% and 20pts. Posey could slide to the 2 and let Rice,Johnson,Nachbar,and Morris fight for the 3 spot and minutes.Cato could back up both spots at the 4 and 5 or sign someone like Campbell or Ty Hill for 1\2 mle. People always wants to talk about east vs west like they did with brand, but if you can play, it doesn't matter. On top of that,SAR is 26yr old. 20pts 8rebs from our 4 spot to go along with more touches with Ming, the offense could change and we would have 2 legit post players who are effecient. I would do it and besides, his contract is up after another yr. Resigning him to close to the max along with Ming and Francis would be ideal. Remember ,the west just got tougher with N.O moving to the mid west within the next 2 yrs.
You bring up a valid point. What do we want from Griffin? 20ppg, 8rpg and 3apg? How about those numbers? How happy would we be with those numbers from Griffin? Those are the numbers SAR is putting up nightly, now! I suppose Griffin's potential defensively is much higher than SAR but who knows how Griffin will turn out. SAR is still reletively young and while he does have a MAX contract now it does run out in 04/05 I believe. If the Rockets made a trade like that then they could always use the MCE to go after someone like Piatkowski from the Clippers to play the 2 spot. I am not necessarily advocating trading for SAR. But you can't argue with SAR's numbers and how great it would be if Griffin produced those numbers. I think the main thing that is the sticking point is on the "defensive end." And I am talking about "potential" defensive end because as of right now I am sure SAR's defense is as good or better than Eddie's. I think people believe that Eddie's defensive game will end up being better. Ultimately, I think any trades the Rockets will look at will be for the "long term" success of the ball club and not the short term.
Since everybody wants to get rid of Steve, how about Steve for SAR and Atlanta's pick this year? I'm sure there would be a couple of throw in players to make the salaries work...
I agree that if you think Griff is never going to get better then it is probly a good trade, but I think Griff will improve. Just too early to give up on Mobes and Griff unless you get someone ideal, like Brand. And SAR just isn't ideal I think. I like SAR's rebounding, but his scoring, eh. IMO, he's one of those David Robinson(but worse) type of guys, in that he can put up monster numbers, but can't score a bucket when it counts, which is one of the reasons his teams have sucked so bad. SAR is a rich man's KT, and we just traded KT.
IF SAR was traded to the Rockets however, he would not be counted on to be "the guy" that hits huge buckets when it counted as he would be relegated as the 3rd option behind Yao and Francis. The whole idea of getting a 3rd "star" type player on this team is to add "consistancy" to this team. Give us the consistancy in scoring on nights when one of our star players is "off" to help carry this team to victories. Again, I am not too sure SAR is right for this team. However his 20/8/3 numbers are pretty nice. Personally I don't see Griffin ever putting up those types of numbers. Aren't Rashard Lewis' numbers similar to Rahim's numbers in his early years? In SAR's first year in the league he was 19/7 type of player as a "Freshman out of college". Griffin was a freshman out of college and we all know what he put up his first year here. I think most Griffan fans hope he can cap out somewhere around 15/10/2.5blks a game.
Deuce - Both your posts bring up good points, and I really don't disagree with any of it. I agree that Griffin's defensive potential is better then SAR. Griffin is only 20 and I'm not ready to give up on him yet, but I'm going to say something really crazy here.....I don't think defense is the Rockets problem, offense is. This is not a knee-jerk reaction to last night either. The Rockets offense is TERRIBLE. I really think the Rockets defense is playoff caliber. I mean Steve will never be confused with a stopper but I think the Rockets play decent team defense.....when the effort is there. Which is part of the reason I don't have a big problem trading defensive potential for a better offense player wich I would hope translates into better offensive cohesion (which the Rockets have had basically none all season). Deuce, sometime the best defense is a good offense...lol.
There are other player who I would like instead of SAR(Brand!) but he could be a nice James Worthy-esque 3rd option for this team. bit of a hefty price for such a player though.
GBRocket- Perfect comparsion. James Worth on a good team. A great 3rd/sometimes 2nd option. I'm not saying he would bring us to the caliber of the Lakers of the 80's but I think he would put us in a position to at least battle the likes of Dallas, SA, and the Lakers.
I'd go along with the James Worthy comparison, but Worthy was also a tough defender, meaning he brought more to the table other than being the third scorer. To everyone bringing up Brand in lieu of SAR, Brand is not attainable, and if he is, we don't have the expendable pieces to land him (Mobley and Griffin won't do it - why would they want griffin, they have two of him). By the way, that is one helluva price (max contract) for a little offensive cohesion. Perhaps the coach (and staff) having Ming for an offseason, I don't know, could provide that. I don't see us jumping at landing a third max contract guy due to the luxury tax anyway.
please note, I treat Ming as a max contract guy who is actually playing on the rookie scale. he has to be budgeted/factored as a max guy. Francis, Yao and SAR...three max guys is too many!
Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe it would only be a MAX contract for 2 seasons, 03/04 and 04/05. Basically his contract would be up before Yao's and we could sign him to a smaller contract and save room to offer Yao a Max contract. So really it is not that big a deal. SAR's MAX contract would be worse if it was for 4 or more years versus 2 more years. To see a worse contract look at Brian Grant's! His doesn't end til the 06/07 season! Yikes!
SAR's contract runs out just in time to sign Ming. He is a good contract fit. I would try SAR at 3, and get a brute with the MCE for a 4. SAR plays both 3 & 4 effectively. Cato can be that brute. Without a brute, we'd be too soft. I like SAR - I like his near 20/10, and think he'd fit perfect with Ming and Francis. We still would need a banger and a backcourt Hawk (Elie-type) for o/d balance and toughness. Also depends on how much they want to move him. If we give up Rice's expiring contract and take on a max, can we force them to take Mooch? Taylor and Mobley? I would want to give one good contract and and one bad one in the exchange.
