Shane Battier's contract will run for another season after this one, with the signing of Ariza, Morey is obviously hedging his bets on Shane. If Ariza is a success, then Battier becomes tradeable or at least they can drive a harder bargain with him when it comes time to extend his contract. Trading Shane is a tricky proposition since I think his greatest value is playing next to a superstar WING player, if he plays next to a superstar C or PF or even PG, his value is not as great since he cannot form a tag team defensive duo, usually superstar WINGs are great defensive players who choose not to play D because they need the rest, having battier allows the WINGs to rest but also gamble for steals and blocks since Shane is such a cerebral positional defender. e.g. look at all the past champions and most of them have that combination of lockdown specialist defender + roving menace defender that is offensive superstar. e.g. jordan + pippen Kobe + rick fox Manu + bowen tayshaun + rip Kobe + Ariza Wade + Posey Given this, I think for trade purposes only 4 teams would give full(or even overpriced value) for Battier, those teams would need to have an elite wing player, and also be contending, and also need to have a hole in the wing position on defense. Those 4 teams would be Lakers(if artest doesn't work out) Blazers(very likely if they make the jump to being a true contender) Cleveland(probably only if Lebron resigns) Miami(if beasley works out and they make the jump to contender in East) I think those 4 teams would also be the same 4 teams that would throw the full MLE at battier if he ever became a free agent. Beyond those 4 teams, i can't really see any other teams who would pay full price for battier, maybe OKC if they make a huge leap, possibly boston if they let rayray expire. But the trade market for Battier is quite limited, and it's almomst guaranteed he will get the full MLE thrown at him when he becomes a FA.
Good post. I think your analysis is spot on. The four teams you mentioned are probably ones that would be interested in what Battier provides. Since we bought Battier here for "win-now" mode, I could see us holding onto him for the length of his contract just in case the pieces fall into place, although I wouldn't put it past Morey to pull the trigger on a valuable trade, should one pop up. I think bringing Ariza here at least turns up the temperature on Shane. Hopefully both guys will benefit from the competition with each other in the meantime.
Ariza, great off-the ball defender, has never been a lock-down defender. not too many NBA GMs are as impressed w the slow-footed Battier as you. against Kobe in the last playoff series, he caugh lightning in a bottle and gave Kobe fits. every dog has its day
There are no lockdown perimeter defenders in the league, battier is as good as it gets, I can't think of any perimeter defender who is as consistently good as battier.
As if Kobe the only player in this league that needs to be defended. Lol. Get real, Shane might not do great against Kobe all the time, but that's pretty typical of anyone guarding as Kobe as much as Shane does. Shane has done an excellent job against other premiere offensive players and has brought a great deal of stability to the Rockets defense.
Portland probably is the best trade partner if you try to get equal value back. They need Shane's defense the most among your listed teams and are loaded with young talents that could be appealing to a rebuilding team like us. I'm not sure how much they would give up for Shane though.
Did we win the series???...if you answer No to that...then anything accomplished is empty and meaningless.....
So every player in this league that did not win a single title has empty and meaningless accomplishments? Is that it? Seems like stupid logic and reasoning. I don't think Battier alone could win that series. He is not a superstar .but he is one of the best role players in the league. The fact that our superstars are made of glass is not Shane's fault.
I love your use of the term "full price". Full price according to whom? If nobody is willing to pay more than x amount of money for Battier, then that's his full price. It doesn't matter how stupid you think the other GM's are for not valuing Battier more.
Of all the pairs listed, at least one if not both players were skilled at creating offense. At least one if not both were all-stars. Rockets needs to decide if its worth spending 7 million a piece to defensive wings that are limited on the offensive side. Particularly when mediocre offense has been what's keeping us back for so long.
No, I'm not saying that every player who did not win and performed really well are those of empty and meaningless accomplishments. That would be a huge exaggeration of my point. What I'm saying is we can look at Shane's defense on Kobe and whether they mean anything in regards to winning this way: There are tonnes of star players on losing teams such as Zach Randolph and Allen Iverson...you name it...and even though they put up all-star numbers, everyone would simply dismiss those stats as empty and meaningless as long as their team loses and has little success(post season success to be precise)... Now we can look at Shane's DEFENSE in the same way as we look at Zach Randolph's or Allen Iverson's OFFENSE.....sure, they are top-notch. We don't need stats and numbers to measure Shane's defense as much as we need stats and numbers to measure AI's offense but we all know Shane's defense is well-recognised by everyone as one of the best in the league. However that defense, no matter how great it is, as long as it doesn't turn into wins and tangible achievements is just as meaningless as Z-Bo putting up 25 and 10 each night. It is not a co-incidence that Shane never made it to NBA All-Defensive number 1 team.
W22, you usually make cogent and well-reasoned points, so I will assume you are just having a bad day. But this argument is downright ludicrous. AI (especially in the past couple of seasons) and Randolph (throughout his career) have put up offensive stats expressly to the detriment of the team. They would force bad shots when their teammates were open or when an extra pass would create a better shot for the team. Shane Battier's defense is for the betterment of the team 99.9% of the time. Even when he's not focused solely on his man (which still helps the team), is he playing great help defense to erase mistakes of his teammates or to simply help them out when they get beat. How many times have we seen an opponent's fast break stopped by a Battier block at the rim? Dude gets about one block per game from the SF position, which itself is impressive. Not that I'm focused on stats or anything. Battier's defense helps the team win games. If you want to point at his lack of a dominant offensive game as a reason why the Rockets didn't defeat the (clearly superior, no offense) Lakers in a seven-game series, then so be it. But to point at his defense and call it "meaningless" is short-sighted and, frankly, stupid. Again, you're too smart a poster on this BBS to sink to such depths of ignorance. You're better than this. We'll just call this one a mulligan.
But that's the exact same type of logic Battier-lovers always use. When comparing Battier to a player with less playoff success (somebody like Durant or Rudy Gay): When comparing Battier to a player with more playoff success (somebody like Posey or Tayshaun Prince):
Ugh.... Battier plays a team game while Z-bo plays a me game. If the Rockets don't have Shane Battier in the past few years, I guarantee you we would have less wins combined for those years therefore giving us an even lower seeding. Shane's defense has been that important. He has been the motor that drives our defense. I mean look at Scola, Landry, and Chuck, they have even taken some of Battier's tips by putting their hands in players faces, by taking charges, by never giving up on the defensive. Granted these players are already great hustlers. I'm sorry but I'm not willing to take Shane's defense as meaningless just because he could not help the Rockets beat the eventual NBA Champions. He sure as hell tried his best and it showed. Kobe got to the line less and he wasn't able to pass to his teammates as well (therefore getting less assists), which was huge in pushing this series to seven games.
I don't get it. He pointed out that because we did not beat the eventual World Champs that Shane's accomplishments up to that point were pointless and meaningless. I know people don't like counting the season as "the real season" but fact is that we have to win in order to get to the playoffs. Shane plays a huge role in those 82 games, whether we win or lose. I don't understand why people brush off these accomplishments as something meaningless. Hell Shane has almost always been the team that was going to be beaten, so it's not like there was some human super strength that Shane could have brought to his teams that would have willed them to victory. Shane does what Shane does best and that is simply to be a role player to a team that is suppose to have two top guns. He plays defense, he hits the occasional three, he holds our team together during many of our defensive lapses. I don't understand why people expect him to carry us to wins. The other players have to do their part as well.
I think Battier is a contributer on any team, he's just a bench player though. The op made good analysis except out of those pairs listed, battier is probably the worse offensive player of the bunch. On boston, they started allen and pierce. In detroit Prince and rip. Even in ariza because he moves so well without the ball and attacks the rim and gets in transition is a better option and a guy that has to be guarded. Battier is a solid vet and can help any team, but at 7m is different kind of help.
Selfish arse remark. I thought it meant a lot for a team of young players without half the salary playing taking 7 games form the champions meant a lot.. Take your meaningless crap outta here.
Yeah, it's funny. Bruce Bowen, a 5-time first team All-NBA defender, and 3-time NBA champion, never made more than like 5m in a season. Yet people want to act like Battier at 7m is some kind of bargain.
Exactly. What Battier gives now is worth $5 mil at maximum. He's become purely a defensive specialist, rarely cuts or shoots the ball. If you look at the salaries of players similar to Battier around the league, they all make around $2 to $5 million a year.
You're correct. What we need is a player who can replace McGrady at the wing. Tracy wasn't always lazy on the defensive end. We need a true all round player,who may not be as talented as him,but a fit,healthy hard working replacement who is somewhat younger than him. Ironically,that depends mostly on how Tracy performs this year. If some team deems him as a missing piece to a championship,they might give up someone good for him. We all know,that's unlikely,so what else can the Rockets do? I feel the key is what are Les and DM trying to achieve. They are putting all their eggs into the Yao Ming,Tracy McGrady basket along with vets like Battier,Scola and the youngsters. How far can they go? Not more than the 2nd round in my opinion if both of our "superstars" get healthy. Shane is of value to veteran teams eg trugoy said. So is Scola. I'm of the opinion,both of them need to be traded(probably combined) for good young players who can be part of the rebuilding process. Tracy's expiring contract won't be of much value,and he is hardly the kind of guy who will settle for the MLE. Yao is a terrific guy,who's value unfortunately isn't even equivalent to Shaq right now. I fully expect him to pick up the player's option. How well he does after that,will determine his future NBA direction and also his trade value. I think we have a very slim chance of being able to build a championship around Yao in the future. Rebuilding will be painful,but more likely to be helpful in the long run.
