OK, I have always wanted to know the reasons behind all this hate so I will finally start a thread and ask. 1. Why do (or does it seem) that most Arab/Islamic people/governments hate Israel/Jews? 2. Why do (or does it seem) Catholics and Protestants not get along in Ireland? These seem to have been the two greatest religious conflicts in my lifetime yet I never understood why these groups despise each other.
A lot of history and politics much more so than 'religion', although religion does often become a 'tool' to pursue political interests...
Historically, Muslims and Jews had much better relations than Christians and Jews and peacefully coexisted in many places (see: Islamic Spain) up until the creation of Israel.
To add to that, historically in China, Jews, Muslims, and Christians had very good relations as well among themselves.
Apparently you've missed the brutal Catholic/Protestant experience in Ireland. The thread starter was asking from a historical perspective but I would never expect you of all people to be myopic...
You need to limit the personal insults. Let's keep the D&D civil. If you can't add constructive points to the debate, it's better not to post at all.
I wouldn't say being shortsighted is an insult texxx, you just approached the question with a much shorter timeframe. To answer the question, Israel/Palestine is less about religion and more about Zionism and its final solution for the indigenous Arabs who lived there prior. There would be no conflict if there was no Zionism.
jews, muslims, hindus, christians, and others lived in relative peace in the mid east until the zionists came also, historically jews living in muslim majority areas had much better security than they did in europe for example in contemporary times, whether we're talking about the mid east or n. ireland, it boils down to politics...if there's injustice and oppression and one side is getting screwed, there's going to be a great deal of animosity and hatred and some are going to fight back, i wouldn't expect anything less and would be surprised if this didnt happen...religion is only used as a tool and vehicle to mobilize the masses
It's a bit oversimplified, but the two conflicts stem from a case of haves vs. have-nots. In the Irish situation, while religion was an identifier, the two sides fought over ancestry and deeper aspects of their culture. The Brits had a prolonged history of oppression, colonialism, and attempts at cultural genocide on the Irish Island. As the industrial sector in N. Ireland grew crucial and strategic in the 19th century, it was harder to give concessions to the Irish. They had to take care of their loyal Orange segment of the population anyways. Terrorism has died down because Ireland has prospered greatly in such a short time. The public became wary when they have something to lose. I still have hopes that the Palestine situation is similar and that it's not a ideological/religious struggle over mutual annihilation.
When you continuously make completely ridiculous comments like suggesting that Hindu/Muslim violence is on a greater scale than the Catholic/Protestant conflict, it leads me to believe you are simply catering to some Islamophobic agenda rather than attempting to make a genuine contribution to the thread. I apologize.
These conflicts are more nationalistic than religious. For example in Ireland, the conflict is more between the English (those crazy northern Germany tribes that came over to Britian as mercenaries and stayed as kings) versus Irish (Celtic peoples).
very true..particularly in ireland. more about english oppression than anything else. the potato famine, for instance, has far more to do with the fact England was raping Ireland, "stealing" its livestock and crops, than the fungus that killed potatos (which probably came from America, by the way). .
All are power struggles using religion to mask their true agendas. Good thing that religion is the opiate of the masses, to suppress the pain of all the raping and pilaging done in its name.
What if we were to expand the Catholic/Anglican strife to the wider European Catholic/Protestant conflict? That conflict is resolved now, but they were killing each other in France and Germany after the Reformation and a little bit up to the French Revolution. And what of the English religious strife from the Cromwellian era and the flight of pilgrims and others to the colonies? It is the fashion to say these are all political fights in religion's clothing, but I'm not really convinced. In many cases, the only real cause of disagreement is the religious one and people did kill for it.
