I am so sick of all the whiners around here. It's as if this is a team of bonafide NBA veterans who should be on the cusp of winning a championship. GET REAL PEOPLE! Let's look at our lineup and you will soon see that where the Rockets are right now is just about where they should be.... VETERANS win championships, people. And, you can hardly call anyone on the Rockets squad a true NBA veteran (except for Glen Rice). Center position - Rookie center in Ming, a sixth year backup in Cato. Hakeem didn't win his first ring until his NINTH year in the league. O'Neal didn't win his until his SEVENTH year. Cato isn't going to win one on his own, EVER. So, take the average of Dream and Shaq and we'll be looking good if the Rockets win one in Ming's EIGHTH year. Forward position - Mo Taylor is hardly a bonafide veteran. And, he's more of a role player. Eddie Griffin is in his SECOND year for crying out loud. Jeez. Small forward - James Posey is a freakin' kid for all practical purposes. Glen Rice is the only true veteran on the team and can't stay healthy long enough to get into a rhythm. Shooting guard - Mobley. Ah, Mobley. We all know he makes boneheaded plays sometimes. But, give the guy a break. By NBA standards he is still young. Look at Michael Finley. He's been in the league for NINE years, alright? NINE. He is just now really coming into the peak of his career. And for the first time he's on a contending team. Point guard - Francis is still just a fourth year player. People seem to forget that. He's 12th in the league in PPG and 14th in the league in APG. Of course, he's also #1 in the league in turnovers, but that's for a different discussion (about how he really should be a 2 guard). But, granted, he's still a youngster by NBA standards and has a lot of learning to do. The idea here is, CHILL EVERYBODY. It's as if every time the Rockets lose, the whine-o-meter spikes to the red line. A week ago it was "WE'RE GOING ALL THE WAY BABY!!!!!", now it's "FIRE RUDY T, WE SUCK!!!" etc... etc... I guarantee you if we were in the Eastern Conference, we'd be 2nd or 3rd seed but it wouldn't matter because even if we got to the Finals we would get our butts whooped just like the Nets (young team) and Sixers (young team) did the last couple of years. I know, sports fans will be sports fans. We all want the ring right now. But, look at the improvement from last year. Three years in a row, we were in the lottery. the LOTTERY!!! Last year we flat out sucked completely. This year we are having some quality games. Not every game is good, but hell were winning 54% of the time. Compare that to last year and what the hell is everyone complaining about? At this rate of improvement, in two to three years we will be winning close to 70% or more of our games. Please stop whining. And try to enjoy life a little bit. The Rockets are on the way up. We don't need to throw a temper tantrum every time they have a bad game, for crying out loud.
Oh boy.... God have mercy on you Axeman cause this thread is gonna turn into a slaughterhouse... (By the way.. I agree, give them a few more seasons, make a couple of trades but keep the core of the team together).
Ask Michael Jordan - 7 years. Ask Hakeem - 8 years. Ask Shaq - 7 years. Look at the Kings. Perfect example. Sure, they had a young PG last year in Bibby, but do you think Bibby would have been in the playoffs without Webber, Divac, and Doug Christie? All of those guys are bonafide veterans who have proven themselves as top-tier NBA players over a long stretch of time. What was Bibby doing the year before that? Languishing on a team that was full of young, inexperienced players.
Thanks for the kind words, but that's the point. I want people to debate this until they see the absurdity of expecting the Rockets to just transform themselves from a lottery team full of young players into a championship team overnight.
Actually, to further along your point, the Kings (with Webber and Divac) were a below .500 team a few years ago, and are now a powerhouse. The Mavericks (with Nowitzki, Nash and Finley) were a below .500 team a few years ago and are now the best team in the league. Even a nice core group of players takes time to develop into a bonafide contender, no matter age or talent.
Sense can't penetrate most of their skulls. j/k Sides have basically already been chosen, this topic has been a focal point of discussion for a long time. Don't expect to persuade many ppl.
We won 54% of our games two years ago...54% doesn't cut it... Come on, Axeman, I can't believe how much you've regressed in your Francis bashing. You were a pretty big Francis Hater a while back, and now you're making excuses for him I believe the immortal Jim Mora said it best... "PLAYOFFS?!?!? PLAYOFFS?!?!? I'll just be happy if we win a game!!"
I dont think anyone expects the Rockets to win a championship, i just think everyone expects them to show improvement in which they arent.. Thats all dude, i never once read here that anyone expected this team to be in the championship.....
Good point, give it time ya'll. No doubt they'll improve again next season (if they don't we're in big trouble and then big changes must be made). I'd give them next season and the next after that before I start losing faith and trading away the whole team.
Those players all made the playoffs in their first or second year. Francis and Mobley have not made the playoffs in 4 and 5 years respectively. After playing 4 to 5 years of NBA basketball you should learn something about how to win, don't you think?
Center position - Rookie center in Ming, a sixth year backup in Cato. Hakeem didn't win his first ring until his NINTH year in the league. O'Neal didn't win his until his SEVENTH year. Cato isn't going to win one on his own, EVER. So, take the average of Dream and Shaq and we'll be looking good if the Rockets win one in Ming's EIGHTH year. Of course, they both made the playoffs in their first two or three years. This team, unless it makes a major turnaround, will not make the playoffs at this rate if the Lakers show any signs of life. Shooting guard - Mobley. Ah, Mobley. We all know he makes boneheaded plays sometimes. But, give the guy a break. By NBA standards he is still young. Look at Michael Finley. He's been in the league for NINE years, alright? NINE. He is just now really coming into the peak of his career. And for the first time he's on a contending team. Finley played with Barkley in Phoenix in '95-'96. Finley also got brighter each of these last several years. He's played team basketball much of his career. Mobley has not. But, look at the improvement from last year. Three years in a row, we were in the lottery. the LOTTERY!!! Last year we flat out sucked completely. This year we are having some quality games. Not every game is good, but hell were winning 54% of the time. Compare that to last year and what the hell is everyone complaining about? At this rate of improvement, in two to three years we will be winning close to 70% or more of our games. Huh? Two years ago, we were winning 54% of the time as well. So at that rate of improvement, two years from now, we'll still be winning 54% of the time. This team is spinning its wheels going nowhere. They get no smarter. The dumb ones are veterans now, and play the same as they did as rookies. Yeah, their scoring is up because they take more shots. We win no more often, though. They pass no better. Francis' assists have actually dropped each of the past 4 years. They simply aren't improving at all.
People are not expecting a championship. They are expecting a solid run into the playoffs. They have the talent to make the playoffs and be competitive. Right now we're hanging by a thread fighting 2 other teams for a playoff spot. The Lakers will surely pass us based on experience alone. That leaves Houston, Utah, and Minnesota fighting for 2 spots. Right now, it's a tossup. The general rule is, the first year you make the playoffs, youre first round fodder. Year 2, you may get to the second round. In your 3rd year, if youre lucky, you get to the conference finals - and lose. If youre unlucky, you play a tough second round but come up short. Year 4 is another loss in the conference finals. Ok, now you get to year 5 - assuming youre lucky and good, it's finally time to take the next step - and make the NBA finals. We're not even at stage 1 yet. Ok, how old is Mobley? BY the time this thing gets untracked, he'll be just old enough to be irrelevant - and that's if everything above holds true.
So Francis and Mobley aren't as good as Shaq, Jordan, and Hakeem? You've got to be kidding!! Michael Jordan can make the playoffs in his second year, but Cuttino Mobley can't! Who would've guessed!! I could've sworn they were both on the same level.
Your right Freak. Lets give Francis and Mobley some room here. hmmmm...lets see...would 10 years be enough?
Axeman, I'm stunned! This thread means a lot more coming from you than it would me. cc.net rox!! I'm licking my wounds today. But man, Garnett is in the house Friday. I'm psyched. People: learn to like Spritel and Chim Chim driving the Mach V. You'll have more fun!!