Triangle offense my a$$, that is the ole DIT offense that Rudy installed when the Rockets won their two championships. Anyone else notice that Horry, Shaw, Fisher, etc are all getting the wide open 3 point shot based on the inside out offense. They may run the triangle, but right now, it is the DIT that is winning the championship...AGAIN. See, it is not the offense that was the problem with our Rockets, it is the players. DaDakota ------------------ If you like RTS games, check out this one. www.frontierwars.com coming soon to a PC near you.
I noticed that to DaDakota. He started using that at the start of LAST year when Kobe got injured. Funny how the guy ripped Rudy and the Rockets for using it, but he has been using it for the better part of 2 years. The problem with stopping the Lakers with though is that they have slashers, so if cut off the inside-out attack they have slasher who can score individually. ------------------ "I'm not here to protect my reputation, I'm here to make my reputation! Mama Barkley didn't raise no chumps!" - Charles Barkley
D*MN RIGHT!!!! ABOUT TIME SOMEONE GIVE RUDY HIS PROPS [PROPER RESPECTS] Rocket River ------------------
Phil Jackson is a hack . . . ------------------ blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah
Phil Jackson can suck my koo coo !!!!!!!!! NOT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ------------------ When will I reach 1000 posts ?
Well, yeah. When you have the most dominant center in the league (like we did back then, and like the Lakers do now), that's the best way to run the offense. Inside out. If Shaq's got a shot, take it, other wise there's a wide open guard somewhere ... just gotta find him. ------------------ Founding Father of the Refs Suck Club
I don't completely agree with this. This is not Rudy Ball. There is Triangle there. Shaq is a better passer than Hakeem ever was. Sure there is some classic drop it into the block, of course there is. But nearly everytime Kobe drives, it is a triangle set, straight out of Jordan's book, and nearly everytime Shaq finds a slasher it is a triangle set. Look for the back picks of high post defenders to free a slasher. Rudy never did that, because Hakeem was too fockass'd on shaking to the rim to see slashers. This is no criticism of Hakeem, just acknowledgement that the big Godzilla doesn't need to shake n bake, so he has time to spot slashers, and the Triangle is free-ing them. The other classic Triangle maneuvers that you should be able to spot are noticeable anytime someone with or w/o the ball uses Shaq for a screen. That NEVER happened with Hakeem back in the day. Hakeem was a scoring machine that needed room and needed people to stay out of his way, because he didn't even know which way he was going, much less his teammates. I think Rudy understood that and decided to just have the other players stand still so that Dream could find them easier when he came out of 3 spins not wanting to shoot the ball. I am making no dis on Rudy Ball or Dream, and am not saying the Triangle is magical; I am just saying that the Laker's are not playing Rudy Ball, not really even close DaDakota. Saying the Laker's are doing DIT because Shaq gets the ball in the low post is like saying the Bulls are playing Sixer's ball because they isolate Jordan. Only a fool would not clear out and drop it into Shaq on occassion, and only a fool would not clear out and isolate Jordan on occassion. That does not mean both offenses are not based on Triangle sets.
SHAQ is definitely a better passer or should we say that the pass gets to person intended. How many times against a team like Seattle back in the day did Hakeem have like 10 TOs because he would try to kick it only to have it stolen because the Sonics were playing the passing lanes. That used to kill me. I love Hakeem to death but SHAQ is a better passer and more patient. ------------------ Rockets Season Ticket Holder
I totally agree with you heypartner, the Lakers mostly run the triangle and they do dump down to Shaq every once in a while. I dont think their is anyone in the game that seals off his man on the low block better than Shaq. Im a huge Dream fan but Shaq is a much better passer than Dream, just ask the Sonics. ------------------
Shaq is not that good of a passer. Philly's horrible d on cutters make him look like a good passer. Anyone can hit a guy WIDE OPEN cutting to the basket for an UNCONTESTED layup. pfft ------------------ .,.·^*'´'|'\..........,.·^*'´¯¯¯'`*^·,...,/|'`*^·-, '|.......'|::\......,·'.....,.·:*:·,......'`i:'|.......| '|.......'|:::|.....;.......':,:::,:·.......';:|.......| '|.......|::;i - ·;i'`:,......¯¯.......,·´|::|.......| '|.......'´.......'|'i:::`*:~·.–·~^*'´: :'|::|.......'`*·-, '|........,.-:^:':'\:'`:;:: :: : : : :: ::;·'i::/`':^·.,......`'i '|..,.:'´:::::::::::'\| '`*^~·:–:·~^*'´..'|/:::::::::'`:^:., | '´:;:::::::::;:-·^*'´.....................`'*^·:;-.....:;·' ....`·;:·'´........................................'`^·:;·´
people tend to forget that the post up is a primary option in the triangle - both for the center and for the guards. in fact, the triangle was designed (by tex winters) with the purpose of going in to the center. the cuts made by horry, fox, kobe, etc. are not what you'd call spontaneous. they are a part of the design of the triangle. the only spontaneous part is reading the defense.
I have to object to the lack of slashers in the Rudy offense. After the championship years we didn't see much slashing, but I do remember having some in our two championship seasons. Not everyone was frozen in place initially, the way I remember it. ------------------ RealGM Gafford Art Artisan Cakes
oh yea, shaq is an outstanding passer. if you can't see that, you don't know bball. yea, part of it is knowing where people are, but that says nothing about the ability to get it there with good touch. for a center, he is probably second only to arvydas sabonis and *maybe* diflop.
Allow me to clarify the "better passer" thing. Sure anyone can pass to a cutting slasher, I am not saying Shaq is Bill Walton or something. I am simply saying this offense uses Shaq as a more effective passer than Dream. That is partly attributed to the difference in offensive sets, and partly attributed to Hakeem's moves causing him to lose sight of his teammates. Shaq can make his patented move (ummmm, walk to the basket) while still looking at his teammates. Hakeem's patented move most definitely caused him to lose sight of his teammates. That difference makes Shaq a better passer. He sees the court more.
True, but the offense allows him to see the court more... ------------------ "Modern bourgeois society with its relations of production, of exchange and property, a society that has conjured up such gigantic means of production and of exchange, is like the sorceror, who is no longer able to control the powers of the nether world whom he has called up by his spells." [This message has been edited by tacoma park legend (edited June 14, 2001).]
I don't think anyone is saying we had a lack of slashers. We are meerly talking about the different means of using slashers. Our slashers never got picks (except Drexler) or never ran nearby Hakeem. Often our slashers were slashing with the ball upon a double/triple team caused by DIT. We are just talking about comparing the Lakers to Rudy Ball, right? Note, now we are slashing around players and screens. Nearly every Francis alley-oop is using a back pick. Who else has noticed Mo' holding the ball and Shandon and Mobley cutting around either side of him. That is a classic Wooden maneuver, and I would not argue with anyone who corrected me and called it a Triangle manuever.
I got the impression that you're saying that Shaq is a better passer because of that though. He's put in highly easy passing situations that any center with average to above average passing abilities could complete. I really don't see the patented move you're talking about, or how it allows him to make passes. The only patented move I know of Shaq is the dislodging of defensive players with his shoulder. His move across the paint is not a patented move and I never see him pass when he's doing that move. I see his passes coming when he's from a standstill position with a double team on him. When you're as big as he is, and can see over the small guard doubling you so easily, those passes aren't that hard, and he already knows where the open man should be. His passes are instinctive. ------------------ "Modern bourgeois society with its relations of production, of exchange and property, a society that has conjured up such gigantic means of production and of exchange, is like the sorceror, who is no longer able to control the powers of the nether world whom he has called up by his spells."
TPL, I am not going to talk in circles with you. I have already said everything you are saying. Just because you misread me, does not mean I need to reclarify and further draw DaDakota's thread off topic. As for the patented move thing, Dream's patented move made him lose sight of his teammates or to fadeaway from them. That is my point. Me mentioning Shaq's patented move was a joke ("ummmmmm, to walk to the basket").
