Our bullpen is overated

We may have a pathetic extra inning record and Williams may pull the hook too early, but to call the bullpen overrated is a bit overboard.

Our bullpen is one of the best in the league.

 

Lidge, Dotel, and Wagner are NOT overated. The others are all average at BEST though. It is one of the best in the league so far this season, but everyone knows it wont last at this rate. I hadn't thought bout how they did when the score was even, good observation Dakota.

 

Our bullpen is overworked, not overrated. We lead the league in innings pitched by our relief guys. Heck, this is the same staff that combined to pitch a no-hitter at Yankee Stadium. Saarloos has really pitched well out of the pin, with Stone and Lidge posting very nice numbers. Dotel is the best set up man in the league, and Wagner is one of the most feared and successful closers in the game. This staff in the playoffs will be hard to touch.

 

I agree with overworked and maybe just slumping a little right now. Lidge, Dotel, and Wagner are probably the best trio of relievers I can ever remember having in Houston. Wagner has really improved over the years from a thrower to a pitcher. I'd still trade him if the Red Sox come calling though.

 

but there are many bullpens who cant even close out games. Like the Astros offense has had many come from behind wins. And in the late innings, I forgot the ratio but it was something ridiculous, the Astros are outscoring their opponents by A HELL OF A LOT!!

 

Hey Timing, are you a Red Sox fan? Before the season, I was thinking the 'Stros should trade Wagner while he is still productive, but this guy seems to be getting better and better. Maybe not his stats like Ks per innings, but his command.

 

I'm guessing there are at least 25 teams in the majors that would trade their bullpen for ours.

We've had zero consistency among our starters, and still we find ourselves in first place. Our bullpen has been NAILS.

Dakota -- you cite two examples...two. and use those to say the bullpen is overrated.

 

Our bullpen closes games out...but they hardly ever hold the stros in the close games.

Again..tonight....2-2 bullpen gives up 5 runs.

Dotel a couple of weeks ago gave up a run 2 straight nights, and the team rallied to give him the win.


So basically, unless the bullpen never gives up runs, they are overrated?! Why not mention the no-hitter? Seemed that in that game the bullpen kept us close until we scored.

You realize that in a 2-2 game, we have to score some runs eventually .... When we don't do that (Chicago, 16-inning game where the bullpen was amazing), yeah, the bullpen is eventually going to get the loss.

The combo of Wagner, Dotel, Lidge, Stone and Saarloos are 17-8. That's 17 games that we've been tied or losing when they come in to pitch and we win. I think they are keeping us in plenty of games.

 

wow! that's amazing.

 

The reason we are 1-5 in extra inning games is because Jimy uses Lidge, Dotel, and Wagner in the 7th, 8th, and 9th innings. So one of our average relievers is usually losing it in extra innings.

BTW, how long before Jimy has a 5th and 6th inning specialist. Pretty soon, he'll get rid of starters and have a designated specialist for every single inning.
We'll never win a championship with Jimy Williams. I think he is a big reason why our starters struggle. He has no confidence in them at all. Even if they are pitching great, the second they allow a hit after the 6th inning, they are yanked.

 

Especially for an overrated bullpen.

 

BTW, how long before Jimy has a 5th and 6th inning specialist. Pretty soon, he'll get rid of starters and have a designated specialist for every single inning.


The reason that he yanks our starters in the 5th and 6th is that the majority of them implode around then. All of our mediocre starters (Robertson, Redding, etc) have bad habits of looking awesome and then blowing up. Early in the season, we really had this problem, I think. It sucks, but they haven't proven they can perform more than twice or so through the order.

 

Jimmy Williams has yanked our starters early the whole time he has been here. I think we only had 1 complete game last year which came at the end of the season. We only have one so far this year too. Look at Bartolo Colone, he has at least 4 already this season. Our bullpen is way overworked. We have 2 quality pitchers willing to go the distance, when healthy. Miller is a workhorse and can be as good as Kerry Wood. The 7,8, and 9th innings are shut outs for us cause of the pen. But the middle relief kinda blows. You know when Munroe comes in, he's good for a run or two. Saarloos has been pretty good out of the pen. But that won't last if Jimmy keeps yanking our starters, which he will. Just let them pitch if they are up.

 

Can people please learn how to spell our manager's name at least?

I'm normally not big on spelling, but that drives me nuts.

 

So sorry, I'll watch my grammar on the bbs from now on. Jimy, is that better? Please replace all the Jimmy's in my previous post with Jimy. Thanks

 

I think Jimy is just hung up on 'managers decisions'. He always has to make a move or something late in the game, and it seems he does it just so he can have some kind of influence on the game. Take last night: I have no problem with him pinch hitting Ensberg late in the game (even though he should be starting by now dammit), but to substitute him in for BERKMAN? Yeah, I know that Ensberg is a better righty than Berkman hitting righty, but I don't think he should take out one of the STAR players when the game is on the line. I just think that is bad for morale. Now, if he wanted to pinch hit Ensberg for Everett and move Blum over to SS, I could understand that. But to remove Berkman is making a move just so he can say: "MANAGERS DECISION".

As for the bullpen, they are basically carrying this team to a decent record, and unless we get some starters that Jimy feels can go 7 innings, it will all implode very soon. They can't keep pitching these types of innings and expect to go 162 games, much less the playoffs.

 

I think some of the posters are overrated.

 

Jimy Williams is the best manager Houston has had in a LONG time.

Being in Red Sox country a few weeks back, I realized how much they loved that guy. He got an ovation every time he came out of the dugout. Every Sox fan I talked to told me how much they wish they still had Jimy.

I can't question the manager who has my team in first place right now. There are a lot more worthy objects of my complaints.