1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Newfound respect for Shaq?

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by whoisray, Jun 21, 2006.

  1. whoisray

    whoisray Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2002
    Messages:
    836
    Likes Received:
    11
    I used to be a Laker hater, rooting for whoever their opponent is. Made me real happy to see them collapse to the Pistons, which is similar to what I feel about Dallas now. :D I hated the way Shaq pummled his opponents to the basket and his cocky attitude. The only skill set he had was just bang bang and dunk.

    After Yao came along, my perception of Shaq changed 180 degrees. Part of it is because I want Yao to be like Shaq and play aggressive like Shaq. Shaq minus the foul shooting, is what a center is supposed to play like.

    It's good to see the old NBA still works in today's game. Even though Shaq is a just a shell of his past, anyone else hated him before but now appreciates his game?
     
  2. Hakeem06

    Hakeem06 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2003
    Messages:
    1,855
    Likes Received:
    3
    shaq is possibly the most overrated player in nba history. he has NO skill set. he's just a mamoth of a guy who uses his size and athleticism well, but that's it. outside of about 6 feet he is useless. he's a poor ballhandler and awful shooter, but has become a good passer over the years.

    i just don't get why people think he's so great. i like the fact that he's a throwback type of center who is tough and agressive but he doesn't dominate like other big guys throughout history. hakeem, wilt, kareem, bill russell, and possibly even moses malone were all better and more dominant. he's benefited from playing the bulk of his career against either aging greats or nobody's at the center position.

    i still think he was much better when he was younger, in shape, and didn't miss 10-15 games a year with bullsh!t injuries.

    he's a good father and a good man, but as a player i think he doesn't warrant all the accolades. if it weren't for kobe and wade hitting the big shots down the stretch of ball games while he sat on the bench because of his liability at the FT line, he wouldn't be a 4-time champion. as good as he is, he's NEEDED another STAR to win.
     
  3. MadMax

    MadMax Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 1999
    Messages:
    76,683
    Likes Received:
    25,924
    i've never liked shaq. but his career has been freaking amazing. he's averaged over 26 ppg, about 11.8 rebounds per game, 2.8 assists per game. He's averaged almost identical numbers in the playoffs for his career. those numbers are better than olajuwon's. now don't get me wrong..i'm not suggesting his prime was better than olajuwon's prime. not at all. but you can't discount shaq's career. he was absolutely the most dominant player on a team that won 3 titles.
     
  4. Nick

    Nick Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 1999
    Messages:
    50,824
    Likes Received:
    17,209
    I never necessarily liked Shaq... but I always respected him because he's always respected our greats (Hakeem), and he's now respecting Yao as well.

    He's also a big man... coming from Houston, you have to already have a soft spot for the abuse that big men take, and the fact that they're trying to faze them out... Wilt is literally rolling over in his grave (and hopefully not on top of a women).

    I did sort of pity him, though, in these finals... he was never a real factor in any of the games that Miami won... and that just amplified his liability on FT's to a level that it never had been before. I also don't see him lasting another 4 years... but he may play it out for the obscene money he's getting.
     
  5. A_3PO

    A_3PO Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2006
    Messages:
    46,708
    Likes Received:
    12,219
    The only thing that changed for me about Shaq was his willingness to play 2nd fiddle to Wade this year and last year. Shaq had no problem letting Wade get all the credit while everyone said his own game was in decline. Once he got to Miami, winning was all that mattered to Shaq instead of pecking order. I'm glad he was less mature during his last couple of years as a Laker.
     
  6. IC2000

    IC2000 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2005
    Messages:
    1,688
    Likes Received:
    0
    please never post again
     
  7. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2002
    Messages:
    15,370
    Likes Received:
    390
    I didn't think too much of Shaq in his younger days. He was just a bull in a china closet that had no skills, just sheer power. He should have got a wagonful of foul out games from all the offensive fouls that he committed early in his career. If he had, he would have been the better player for it and the game would have been a lot better for it. As it was, we went/are going through the Shaq effect now, where the officials hardly call any defensive contact in the paint on big men because of the fact that it was the only way to even up the lack of the offensive foul call on Shaq when he bulldozed over the defender or gave them the elbow hook around the kidneys on his spin move and dunk.

    Now, I kinda feel sorry for him because the defensive contact has gotten way out of hand (and Yao is suffering from it as well) while Shaq's game has become much more cerebral. He is no longer just a bull moose bowling over people in the paint. And he (along with Yao) has gotten jammed by the officials the last couple of years. Now the officials are going out of balance the other way, calling every little bit of contact as offensive fouls against him and letting way too much defensive contact go on him.

    The fact that he was so willing to accept the double and triple teams and make plays for his teammates really stood out. He really did the right thing this whole series passing out and telling Wade to rack it up because Mami was so focused on shutting him off.

    All that being said, the more his athleticism goes, the less value he is going to bring to a team because he has absolutely zero range and his FT shooting is atrocious.

    I think we all were probably thinking about Yao and TMac while we were watching this Heat team, realizing the possibilities of Yao being 6 inches taller, younger, and much more skilled further away from the basket than Shaq and what Yao could possibly do if surrounded by ...........dare I say....some shooters. Along with wondering if McGrady's body could hold up to the abuse that Wade took/takes on a consistent basis with his relentless drives to the basket. But still imagining that big old PnR with 111 and a couple shooters spreading the floor.

    Shaq's day has come and gone. But he is so smart with the basketball now, he can get by on cleverness. And Dallas was foolish enough to concentrate their defense on him instead of on Wade. They should have shut Wade off, let Shaq receive the ball, and then used the 18 fouls of their 3 big guys on Shaq after he got into shooting position. They would have given up some dunks granted. But they would have been able to stymie him and Wade better because he is so horrid from the line. Bad strategy on their part. They kept giving up the fouls on Wade and the other players, just to get into the bonus and get Shaq to the line instead of just letting him receive the ball, baiting him into the shot with one on one defense and then letting Diop, Damp, and Mbenga just hack him so they get the possession back as well as having Shaq clank a couple from the line.

    I do like Shaq a lot better though then when he came into the league. He is a winner. And his sheer presence and attitude being all about winning is something that a championship team needs to thrive. I think we've already got that mentality with Yao and TMac. We just need to put the role players around them and let them experience the big party.
     
  8. count_dough-ku

    Joined:
    May 19, 2002
    Messages:
    18,210
    Likes Received:
    10,211
    I always respected Shaq. I think Dream was a better overall player in his prime since Shaq never worked as hard as he could've(especially on the defensive end). But there's no denying the great career the man's had.

    But I like him a lot more these days since his declining skills have humbled him to the point where he's more than happy to defer to D-Wade. I'm not saying he should've played 2nd fiddle to Kobe in L.A., but the fued between those two always made it difficult to like him.

    Of course it's worth noting that Shaq also likely gets along with Wade a lot better than Kobe cuz Dwayne doesn't have a massive ego or hog the ball.
     
  9. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2002
    Messages:
    43,786
    Likes Received:
    3,705
    some of you guys really don't give this man credit. he's just bigger and stronger than everyone else? he doesn't have to work hard? that's flat out ridiculous. the first maybe true, but it doesn't mean the second is. in shaq's younger years he always put pressure on the defense. he always worked to get in position. there are flaws in his game, obviously, but what he does he does damn well.

    there have been plenty of guys who went through the nba only to waste phenomenal size and talent. benoit benjamin and joe barely cares. and quite frankly I take offense when someone says a great black athlete doesn't work hard. its a tired racial cliche.
     
  10. count_dough-ku

    Joined:
    May 19, 2002
    Messages:
    18,210
    Likes Received:
    10,211
    It's not a racial thing. Shaq has had problems throughout his career staying in shape. And he's never been as great a defensive player as he could be. The next time Shaq guards a pick-and-roll, it'll be his first.
     
  11. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2002
    Messages:
    43,786
    Likes Received:
    3,705

    staying in shape isn't really what I'm referring to. its the premise that's its easy for him to go out and dominate, I don't know how hard shaq works in the gym, I have accused him of being out of shape, but on the court shaq works hard.
     
  12. arkoe

    arkoe (ง'̀-'́)ง

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2001
    Messages:
    10,387
    Likes Received:
    1,598
    I didn't like Shaq in LA. I always thought he was kind of dumb, it took me a long time to get that he was just goofing around. I like him alright now that he's left LA.

    Kobe, on the other hand, can play anywhere and I won't like him. If he played on the Rockets, I still wouldn't like him.
     
  13. rocketfat

    rocketfat Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 1999
    Messages:
    1,742
    Likes Received:
    1

    LOLOL...some idiots do whatever the hell they can to force the race card into absolutely everything. i dont know or care whether you are black or white, but you're an oversensitive joke of a human being either way.

    get off your high horse and get a life. people like you are sickening.
     
  14. s land balla

    s land balla Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2001
    Messages:
    6,610
    Likes Received:
    365
    I've always been fond of the bloke...
     
  15. Chronz

    Chronz Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2006
    Messages:
    814
    Likes Received:
    11
    How can you not respect him, the Mavs sure as hell did. They were gaurding him like it was 2000, the fact that Wade put up the numbers he did could be greatly attributed the all the defensive attention Shaq recieved. Sure they kept Shaq in check but at this stage in his career I wouldve focused more on Wade. Wade said so himself, "if theyre gonna keep gaurding you like this, Im goin to keep taking over."

    The Man has 4 rings and the if the only thing you got on him is that he has no skill level or that he NEEDS a star gaurd then I got 2 things to say to you.
    A pt is a pt whether it was made from 15ft or 2ft, and those same gaurds that he needed, needed Shaq MORE than Shaq ever did.

    Thats like me discrediting Kareem for having played with the BIG O, and then Magic Johnson. Even then its even worse because the year Kareem missed the playoffs he was a vet with no gaurd, Shaq missed the playoffs once and that was with an expansion team in their 2nd year.
     
  16. Chronz

    Chronz Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2006
    Messages:
    814
    Likes Received:
    11
    When Kareem left the bucks they made the playoffs while Kareem watched them, when Shaq left the lakers they missed the playoffs and saw him go to the eastern finals.

    The best bigmen in the game
    Wilt
    Shaq
    Russell
    Dream
    Kareem
    Bill Walton
     
  17. Stone Cold Hakeem

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 1999
    Messages:
    1,263
    Likes Received:
    89
    Pot, meet Kettle. Kettle, Pot.

    RE: Shaq

    The man has been not only been the mountain, he owns property on the mountain and vacations there every other June or so. He's amassed amazing wealth. He's mentioned in the same breath as the men he continues to revere -- Wilt & Russell & Dream. He has an undeniable media presence. In spite of all this, he stepped back this year to allow give Wade some breathing room in the spotlight.

    I can respect that.
     
  18. wnes

    wnes Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2003
    Messages:
    8,196
    Likes Received:
    19
    Newly found respect for Shaq after the MDE recorded career lows in pretty much every statistical category of productions in the just completed NBA finals, only to have Wade saved his butt?

    That's hilarious.
     
  19. TheFreak

    TheFreak Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 1999
    Messages:
    18,304
    Likes Received:
    3,310
    Thank you.
     
  20. Manny Ramirez

    Manny Ramirez The Music Man

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2001
    Messages:
    28,805
    Likes Received:
    5,747
    I had never liked Shaq but then I read about all the stuff he did for George Mikan and his family. The man is an incredible human being. With that being said, I still don't care for his game, but I respect him as a person and the way he plays.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now