Looking at Cuttino's contract, why should Francis get the max?

I think they will make it up to Cat later.

 

At the time of that contract, Cuttino was a reserve averaging 15 points. If he was a free agent after this season, he would probably make close to the Max, along with Francis.

 

well Cuttino and Steve probably have a joint checking account anyway.

"We never plan it," Mobley said, wearing a headband with the initial `CM' and `SF' with `DP' for "double platinum" in the middle.

maybe DP really stands for Domestic Partners...

 

Well, I personally feel that Cuttino Mobley is egregiously underpaid.

Steve Francis is worth the maximum, IMO, and I would give him such.

 

I could be wrong, but i thought we payed him as much as we could considering he was early bird.

 

I like Mobley a lot, but Francis is in a different league. Francis is a better shooter, gets more assists, gets more rebounds, plays better defense, and is also getting better. Mobley is a one dimensional player. Francis does a hell of a lot more than Mobley does for this team.

 

Actually Francis isn't really that much of a better shooter, if better at all. And don't blow off Mobley's contributions because he isn't a one-dimensional player. And saying Francis defense is better then Mobley's isn't exactly the best thing to say since they both play that "El Matador" defense. I don't like the Francis vs Mobley comparison, because they are different players. Francis is obviously the more talented player, but the most talented player isn't necessarily the better player. During the Bulls championship years I always considered Scottie Pippen the more talented player on the team. For all the raves Jordan's defense got Pippen's was light years better during that era. He was also a better passer and rebounder then Jordan, yet Jordan was the man on the team because he was the go-to guy. That's why I think that Francis and Mobley are the perfect duo. And I never understand why people blow off Mobley's contributions. Not only is he a go-to guy, but he is fearless, fast, and explosive, and nobody can stop him. So to say "Francis does a hell of a lot more than Mobley does for this team" isn't completely accurate. Francis is the star , and the most talented guy on the team, maybe the best PG in the league, but Mobley is the fire that lights this team. Francis is our Michael Jordan, and our Shaquille O'Neal, and our Isiah Thomas, but they don't win the championships without Pippen, and Kobe, and Dumars. Obviously Cuttino is getting better, he went from 10 ppg to 20 ppg. Cuttino is a special scorer. There are scorers, and then their are scorers who can take over a game and just completely negate another team's SG and backcourt. Mobley is capable of doing that. We already know Francis can.

 

Based on?

Dirk has made huge strides in each of his three seasons and is already one of the games better players. Last year, he elevated his game even further when it mattered. In the last game of the Mavs playoff series, he single handedly kept his team in the game, scoring 42 points and pulling down 18 boards. Why is it again that he can't lead his team to a championship?

 

Thanks for posting that. You are correct. Mobley was an early bird player. We could only offer him what we gave him.

Francis is valuable not just for what he does on the floor but for who he is. The kid is a star plain and simple. As great as Cat is, his numbers on the whole and his "star power" to use a horribly cheesy phrase will never be what Francis' are. The comparison to Thomas and Dumars is probably appropriate. The are both hall-of-famers but whose name puts more people in the seats?

 

No, Francis isn't three times the player Mobley is. But that isn't the question.

1. We are probably three times less likely to win a game without Francis than without Mobley. We are certainly three times less likely to make the playoffs without Francis than without Mobley.
2. Francis is three times harder to replace than Mobley is.
3. If the market thought Mobley was worth more, he would have been offered more.

I could go on, but I don't want to irritate the Mobley fan club. Let's just say that all of the stuff Mobley does is conspicuous. Only some of the stuff Francis does is conspicuous.

 

Hmmm...I've never heard that one before. Sure, Pippen might have been a better rebounder (possibly because his position allows him to be close to the basket at times) and a slightly better defender, but I don't think that makes him more talented. I base talent almost solely on offensive skills, and clearly Jordan was superior to Pippen in that regard. I mean, look at Rodman. Sure, he got a lot of rebounds and was an incredible defensive player, but I'd have a hard time calling him talented, since he possessed close to zero basketball skills. He was good because his physical attributes and his hustle, not because of talent or basketball skills. I think saying Pippen is more talented than Jordan is pretty ridiculous. Jordan's still twice as good as Pippen even after being out two seasons.

And I'm sorry, but I just compared the career stats between Jordan and Pippen. Jordan beats him in nearly every category: points per game, assists per game, steals per game, blocks per game, field goal percentage, free throw percentage, three-point percentage. Jordan even had less turnovers per game. The only thing I see Pippen beat Jordan in was rebounds, and it was by .30 per game. Sure, its hard to put a lot of meaning in stats, but come on. Pippen's not even near Jordan any way you slice it. Plus, Pippen's a d**khead.

 

"Plus, Pippen's a d**khead."

Right on bro!!

 

No way one can compare Francis to Mobley.

Francis is much better than Mobley. He can pass. He can dunk on seven footers. He can takeover a game.

Mobley should learn to pass more often. Sometimes, he just jacks too many three-point shots unnecessarily. His shooting percentage is terrible(418 in preseason).

Mobley ain't no franchise player. He is expendable.

 

There are many reasons that Steve will get a max contract.

#1 This whole team is built around Steve. I'll give you an alternative: Stevie leaves and all of a sudden the team is built around Cato and MoT. No disrespect, but that sounds like the foundation for the Wizards, part II.

#2 Steve is special. How do you know that he is special? I could go into a whole list of his attributes, but I've got a simpler way. Name me one point guard you would like to trade him for. I'm waiting....heh - didn't think so.

#3 Fair market value. If Steve was a free agent at the end of this year, do you think that he wouldn't get a max contract offer?

#4 You compared him to Cuttino. Well, chemistry issues aside, we could replace the Cat with other gunners around the league. Back to point #2, but we could not replace Steve.

#5 CD knows how to handle players. Trust me, he will not do anything to alienate or insult Steve. I do not see another Robinson or Hakeem fiasco brewing here.

When it comes to signing Steve, we will have several advantages over other GMs in the league. I would assume that we will sign Steve while he's still a restricted free agent, but these advantages will apply even if he is unrestricted at the time.

#1 Steve should have confidence in CDs ability to build a strong team around him.
#2 Steve has talented players that he wants to play with here.
#3 Steve likes life in Houston.
#4 Steve likes playing for Rudy T.
#5 Steve can get a max contract from the Rockets. Don't underestimate the importance of this. A player who has been told by everyone that he is the Franchise, will be insulted if he is offered what is his due.

I firmly believe that the Rockets organization sees the opportunity to build a championship team here. They saw how we liked having a great Rockets team (seasons of Compaq Center sellouts), and now they see the flip side - attendance under 10,000. This just adds to their motivation.

On the flip side, Steve could shock the hell out of me - if he did what I hope I would do in his place. If the cap numbers fit, he could tell CD "Thanks for the max offer. I appreciate it - but let's talk championships here. If I followed the example of Cuttino and took a reduced contract, say 10 Mill for 10 years guaranteed, how much would that help our team?"

Face it - Steve will be rich. His family will be rich. It would be really cool if he wanted to win badly enough to do something like this. I think Duncan was trying to work something out like this with other players in Orlando, but egos got in the way.

Anyway, that's the only situation where I see Steve getting less than a max contract - where he says no because it clearly benefits the team. I believe that the Rockets have a great chance to win titles in the future even without this - but I would give mad props to Steve if he did it.

 

Mobley is underpaid but only by 8-10 mil over the lifetime of the contract in relationship to Derek Andersons contract.

I doubt Mobley will be able to spend all his money anyway. The question is "how much money will he leave his grandkids?" It is very hard to spend 36 mil in a lifetime.

 

This the reason right here. If we don't give it to him, someone else will and where would we be. Lottery bound again. I don't care if everyone on our team gets the max as long as we win. It's Les's money and not mine.

 

Cuttino Mobley is <b>not</b> replaceable.

That is all for now.

 

2 quick corrections:

1. Mobes plays better D.

2. Mobes was offered more elsewhere, but decided to stay.

 

Its crazy to have this discussion, but how many pg's would you take before Francis? Maybe Payton or Kidd. How many 2 guards would you take before Cat? Finley, Miller, McGrady, Allen, Kobe, Iverson, Stackhouse, must i go on? Both are important and its not a matter of being paid 3 times as much as the other. Mobley, like Rashard could only get so much money because he was a second round pick. If I were coming into the league and had a chance for a big payday after a couple of yrs, I wouldn't sign for more than 3 or 4 yrs because of the changing market and the collective bargaining agreement. No one told Cassell to sign for 6 yr 24 mil, just like no one told Kemp to sign for his contract before they acquired McIllvane either. Norris is basically making what Cassell is making and the Buck can't renegotiate his contract until after 3 seasons, but thats his fault, not theirs.