I don't know about you, but the big trade threads, playoff season, and the draft are getting me excited. I'd like to complement the trade threads with a thread about the effects certain trades will have on us. Here's the Challenge Pick you favorite trade/acquisition from a trade thread and tell us how you'd run the new team with the new look. Remember, rookies likely want have a grand impact next year. Let's close one variable for now, just to keep the discussion focused on reality: Let's consider that Francis, Mobley and Shandon will be with use for at least 2 more years. Clearly, we are very thin on the frontline, really only have 2 big guys for our entire future, both unproven. IMO, I believe over the next year we need a sum gain of 3 big men to provide us with at least 5 total and 3 who get 30+ minutes. Superstar PF or not, we need 5 nba quality big men to last a whole season, and we can't afford to bank on KT and Cato being solid 30-35min contributors for years to come. We must add to them this summer and next season. Questions to ponder: Can we do that by trading Cato or KT for small forwards? Can we achieve that through the lottery, middle-class exceptions, etc? Are there other needs you consider equal or more important? What effects will certain player dynamics have on a 3 guard team? What do the 3 guards need? [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited June 04, 2000).]
I don't mind the three guard team, but I would like to see the Rockets pick up another small forward. Assuming that we draft a big man with our lottery pick, I wouldn't mind if we picked a small forward with great defensive abilities (Pete Mickeal). But I also wouldn't mind if we took another big man as a project. If any of that can be taken care of with free agency (or a trade with the exception), that would be fine too. I say that we see what we get in the draft and then see what the needs are and address those with free agency/trades. It is certainly an exciting time to be a Rockets fan. Do all lottery teams have this much fun? ------------------ [This message has been edited by TraJ (edited May 20, 2000).]
I agree that a 'small forward' is not a real need for us. Our best 3 players right now are all guards, and you can't have them on the court at the same time by acquiring another swing player. Something I started thinking about, though, was that Rudy would often have the Wizard playing the 4 spot this past year, and sometimes would even have 4 guards on the court at the same time. The reasons he gave for this were usually "out of necessity", or "just trying different combinations", but should we give credence to those comments? What if that's really the way he wants to play? You can't deny that the new rules favor penetration from the perimeter players. Is Rudy trying to utilize this to the extreme? If the 'new rules' are officiated properly, what is the benefit of having strong post players? After all, a strong side zone is legal (thus hurting the post game), and you can't touch a player on the perimeter. To answer the question "what are our needs?", I would say it depends on where Rudy wants to take this team. Common sense would say we need some power players, but Rudy has been known to do some unconventional things (I still trust Rudy at this time). As an aside, it is my hope that the player Rudy's been talking about in Clutch's thread is Al Harrington. I think that guy can really play, and Rudy has a history of putting guys on his team that have burned his team in the past (Brent Price comes to mind). ------------------ "We're sitting there, shooting alcohol into our veins... We could just drink it!" -Tommy Lee
I'm thinking defense. The Rox seem alright on the offensive end. How can their defense be improved? Are the Rockets' current personnel capable of forming a strong defensive team next season given time to gel, or do the Rockets need to make a few additions? I've been thinking a bigger version of Shandon Anderson (defensive stopper, opportunist on offense) like a James Posey or Ron Artest would be a nice acquisition for the team, cuz he wouldn't demand a lot of minutes - he'd probably only be used against the 3's Shandon supposedly struggles against, thus keeping the Big 3 happy on minutes. I don't see anybody like that in the draft however, unfortunately (Mickeal peaked my interest until it was revealed he is actually significantly smaller than Shandon Anderson). Rudy T has also already stated that the team is looking for big guys who can hit the outside shot, so there's a need too. Furthermore, a team can always use more shot blocking. I'm also not sure that the team has found its long-term starters at the 3 and the 4. The guys they have in there now are adequate enough, however. ------------------
I think the Rockets only need to find 2 more big men in the future. A PF, and a center. If Hakeem comes back next year, then that position isnt such a big concern, just need a scrub like Pig to fill in a few minutes. Hakeem/Cato/Pig(or Mass) but after next season the Rocks need to find someone who can at least play back up center for 20 - 25 minutes. at PF, i think the Rockets need to find someone THIS offseason, hopefully a starter or someone who could fite for the starting position. Croshere, B. Grant, Fortson, whoever. Rockets should try to land a PF thru trade or free agency. after that, just need a scrub PF cuz 3 PFs are rarely needed. starter PF/ KT /scrub it would be nice if the Rocks could find someone like TMass, a quality scrub who can play both PF and center. IMO, I think the Rockets should draft a sf like Demarr, Miller, or Miles, should any of them drop that low. Next year would be ideal to bring along a sf, already having capable starter in Walt. But Bullard isnt going to be their much longer. Walt may stay for 2-3 years maybe, but I think his role may be reduced to the bench after next year(maybe even during). It would be nice to have a young groomed stud to step up and take the starting role. ------------------ I have a special purpose.
it would be nice if the Rocks could find someone like TMass, a quality scrub who can play both PF and center. Why do we have to find someone like TMass? WE already have THE Tmass... we dont have to get somebody LIKE him. ------------------ treasurer of the moochie norris fan club
I know what you mean Snowman, but is he gonna be healthy? I doubt it. hopefully hes not looking for a big contact, cuz i don want the Rockets to give him oone. ------------------ I have a special purpose.
What everyone is forgetting, is next year's draft. I'm sure the Rockets are eyeing an SF there that would make many happy, named TERENCE MORRIS. Remember him? Francis' buddy? To answer HP's question: By trading Cato? No. I personally think KT is expendable, if we were getting an integral part (such as Croshere) but a lot of people don't agree with my assessment. I'd love to pick up Mickeal in round 2. Phoenix used a 4 guard lineup to start several times in the playoffs a few years ago. It was KJ, Kidd, Rex Chapman, and someone else. Chapman played "PF" and was 6'4''. TheFreak-Croshere and Rose severely burned us as well. ------------------ Rockets fans wanted at hoopsboards.com Draft Chat, NBA Chat, Team Chat, and more! [This message has been edited by NIKEstrad (edited June 03, 2000).]
I like your trade idea, but how would the salaries work. Don't really want to take on too much more salary for next year. Also, I am not too big of a fan of Terrence Morris yet, but will see. Right now would prefer Haywood, of course,, but so would a lot of people. ------------------ When I die I want to go peacefully like my grandfather. Not screaming like the passengers in the back seat!
HP is right that we need more big men, but I believe the Rockets should focus on the 4 and 5 we are just too shallow at those positions and figure out the 3 in due time. We need guys that are going to bang and hustle every night. They don't need to be big scorers(10-15ppg is fine), but they must be able to rebound the ball(10-12rpg) and get back to play defense. KT proved that he is capable of playing in this league, but is going to have to shoot the ball more consistently if he is going to be a factor on this team in years to come. He has shown signs of posting up, can rebound fairly well and at times has hit the three. He must learn that when the three isn't going down for him that he must pass!! Othella had that "blackhole" syndrome at times and KT must becareful not to fall into that trap. Cato has alot to prove to the Rockets this offseason otherwise he may be traded. If he is traded the Rockets desperately need to get a center or two. He is extremely athletic and was relatively injury-free last season, but he needs to hustle 120% more on the boards and get up and down the court. I think he has the most potential of any player on this team and may be going out on a limb, but I think he can be as good as Rasheed Wallace when he matures as a player. Its up to him to realize it. Do I think we SHOULD do that by trading Cato/KT? It would be extremely difficult for the Rockets to move Cato and come out on the winning end of a trade, not because of the salary(he is in demand), but because a legitimate replacement at his position(swing C/PF) would be difficult to replace. Athletic 6'10"(or 7ft if you're HP ) guys don't grow on trees! What do the guards on the Rockets need? They need quality big men to rebound and play defense and kick the ball out on the fast break. If the Rockets can find these "big men", watch out NBA, the Rockets are coming to reclaim their title! ------------------ We need some meat in the post!
guys who average double-doubles that are affordable are not very easy to find. We need another rebounder, I personally feel KT's board work is a tad overrated, people are talking like he's gonna be 18-12 in a few years. Which is why, I'd be in support for drafting Olumide with a later pick. He's a bona fide rebounder, when he gets 30 mins a game, he'll have 10 a game easy by my projections. As I've said a few times, he's the PF incarnation of Mutumbo, he's got a 7'5'' wing span, and he's agressive. Offensively, we'd be lucky if he were to develop into a 15 ppg scorerr, but he's got the defense. ------------------ Rockets fans wanted at hoopsboards.com Draft Chat, NBA Chat, Team Chat, and more! [This message has been edited by NIKEstrad (edited June 03, 2000).]
NIKE, you just can't do it can you. you can't come into a thread without mentioning speculative trades. this whole bbs is one big trade thread to you. What I'm trying to do with this thread is discuss what we need and what effects those players will have. You keep talking about the transaction itself. Who cares how the transaction goes. OK...i'll play ball. Forget the damn trade, just lets say we get Potepenko and a SF with the #11. Would you ever play Cato and Potepenko together? With KT? Would you continue playing small with KT, Walt and 3 guards. Does the small line-up work? Do we need a real starter PF if the Cato, Walt, SA, CM, SF line-up continues its success of March/April? Is there someone available in the draft that could play in that line-up better than Walt in a couple years. Does Potepenko make us slower, better in any way than Cato on a bad day. Can Potepenko and KT work as a bench combo, or is Cato/KT better? NIKE You see how many questions are out there that don't need to discuss trade ideas. Just assume the trade and tell us how it effects the teams offense/defense.
HP-OK, I see what you're saying, but thinking about it, do all of our big men have to be these super athletic Cato/Garnett/Moiso/Webber types that run the floor? Wouldn't Mutumbo make a great impact on this team, because of his post presence, defensive skills, and ability to START (via board, or block) a fast break? (no that wasn't an idea to acquire Mutumbo ) Is there a young athletic big man who rebounds and creates an offensive presence out there not named Shaquille O'Neal or Tim Duncan? to answer the better than Walt question, of course there is. But, a lot of it is potential, and there are very few, if any sure bets, especially with so many underclassmen. I personally would like a presence down low. It doesn't really matter defensively or offensively. I feel its better to have a guy who does one thing exceptionally well, than a guy who's mediocre. (But what you have to do is cover up his shortcomings by another player.) Would I ever play Cato/Potapenko/KT with 2 guards? The only instance I could ever think of that, would be against a team like Sacramento, who uses Corliss Williamson at SF. In most cases, it'd be a no. the answer to many of the questions is determined by whether you mean short term, as in the month or two following, mid term, as in the playoffs, or long term, as in the next few years. Short term, sure it could work. But in the playoffs, what if we end up facing a Portland? Wallace ate AC Green for lunch, what would he do to Walt Williams? My goal for the offseason is to get bigger up front. Get a guy with real size like Moiso, who can also block some shots. That's why in all the supposed Croshere acquisitions, he's a SF to me. The purpose of the supposed trade, was to show a possibility which would make our big men problem somewhat cleared, not "this is a great trade idea". Has Walt shown any indication of being the great player he was over the past 2 months, and doing that for a full season? I'd say no. Walt should be expendable, and shouldn't be penciled in as the 3rd (or 4th, depending on Shandon) "star". If we give him that based on the end of the season shouldn't we give Cato rising star or all star status, based on his preseason? Or KT a guy who'll average 15 rebounds a game, based on one game where he pulled down 22? Now, I'm gonna make the trade idea go away. ------------------ Rockets fans wanted at hoopsboards.com Draft Chat, NBA Chat, Team Chat, and more! [This message has been edited by NIKEstrad (edited June 03, 2000).]
HP no offense man but out with the old threads on with the new. alot of those threads r ridiculously long. lets just talk in this one instead of having 200 post threads to read through. ill start another thread pretty quick. ------------------ --TEX
I am not comfortable penciling in a PF/SF like Croshere or Corliss as a starter SF. Getting a good PF thru trade or FAgency AND draft doesnt seem like a good idea to me. That is 3 good PFs. I would rather maximize the talent on the floor at all positions than just stacking up at one postion. UNLESS ... what do you guys think about a guy like Croshere or Moiso playing center for part of the game. small ball with 2 athletic PFs. That sounds interesting, but I dont know how well it would work in practice. I still say drafting a SF who mite turn out to be a star and grooming him for a while would be better than drafting a decent big man. What do you guys think of a 2 PF line-up? Would it work well? ------------------ I have a special purpose.
Texasalsa...look at the date of my original post...blame Crisco for resurfacing this thread. Maybe I should edit my title post now, as you say. Before I join in again on this thread...I'd like to take a pole: How many people want to talk about needs and effects of trades, rather than just our roster? My dream scenario is finding people at cc.net who want to talk about what you The Coach would do with your team, not how you the GM would create a roster. Roster building is not nearly as exciting to me and Team building. There is a difference; it's the difference between a GM and a Coach. To each his own. All I say is wannabe Coaches exist on cc.net, we are just fewer than the wannabe GMs. Let us have our fun, too.
hp-I'm not quite sure I follow. Wouldn't talking about a trade's effects be part of the trade itself? Do you mean like strategy, mixing and matching player types? Such as, how a trade for a Webber would effect the team on the court, and how they'd play as a unit, rather than just acquiring him and creating a paper team? ------------------ Rockets fans wanted at hoopsboards.com Draft Chat, NBA Chat, Team Chat, and more!
bingo! not to say creating a team on paper isn't fun. I just enjoy talking about what you would do with that team, a lot more.
Heypartner, I'm not sure if this is the kind of discussion you want. Tell me after if this what you like to discuss. What I think this team's biggest need is a PF who can shoot inside/outside and compliment our guards. Basically a Moiso. Here's what the effect I'll think will happen when we do a 3 guard lineup(Francis, Cat, Shandon, Moiso, Cato). Main Effect: Becuase Moiso strength is his outside jumper, the pick and roll will be very effective. Francis can utilize this very well. Francis can use the high screen, either pass it to Moiso who's rolling away, shoot if no one is helping, or lob it cato, if the center helps. Other Small effects: During Mobley ISOs, with Moiso and Cato playing the same time, Cato can benefit by staying underneath the basket for putbacks/Dunks as Moiso will draw his big man out into the perimeter. Not to mention, those of you wanting a post up threat, Moiso can provide a left hand fadeaway bank shot. Not the most dominating, but Moiso can work the matchups well if guarded by a smaller defender. The intriguing thing is Moiso can move over to center(sparingly) and a 2 PF lineup. Moiso can draw the center out with his perimeter game. Not to mention, Moiso has the athleticism to move over to SF also. Thus providing us counters against Big SFs lineup. Well I tried to analyze Moiso's effect on the team if he's drafted. Heypartner, is this what you were asking for? ------------------ Check out the new and improved Draftsource.net
Ok fair enough HP The Stromile Swift effect although very unlikely we will get him Immediate Effect- gives rockets a big PF who can block shots and guard opponents PF very well. gives the rockets a good low post scoring option something they lacked. francis can post him up and they can have a give and go or just let swift opperate in the middle. on the fast break it gives the franchise an excellent player to throw alley oops to. another effect is that when francis penetrates he can pass it out to swift for the open J. some drawbacks- he is still very raw and not polished. trading for him will hurt us in chemistry because we will likely have to give up cato, drew, kenny T etc. he also needs to bulk up or will get killed on the boards. some intangibles- he loves the rockets and wants to play here some other pluses- he could possibly play some 3, and is a true PF at 6'10 WITH NO SHOES ON. ------------------ --TEX
