Kent is tearing it up

oh, for ****s sake.

 

I wish we had kept Kent too. I never understood the attitude at the time that it was no big deal that we let him go.. he was our leading rbi guy, and was probably worth the money we had on his option for one more year

 

Wasn't that the last straw for Hunsiker?

Hunsicker wanted to resign Kent but Uncle Drayton veto that notion. We are missing his bat in the line up.

 

I think you hit the nail on the head. Not signing Kent to keep Biggio on the field I think drove Hunsinker over the edge. You can say what you want about Burke or keeping Biggio, but Kent has out performed his contract every year as an Astro. If you are going to be the sensible spending team, you keep your best values. Didn't the guy lead this team in RBI last season, and you don't want to pay him $8million to keep Biggio on the field. Further proof that Drayton wants to sell tickets more than win.


I didn't write anything in the threads when they decided not to resign, but you guys who don't think he was worth the money are dead wrong.

 

Sorry, but none of you know what pushed Gerry to walk away.

Kent was given a fair offer and he turned it down. He is a good offensive player and the Astros are missing his bat. Oh freaking well. What do any of you say about what Biggio is providing at 2nd this season? He certainly is producing and playing at least as well defensively as Kent does. Get over it.

 

Stros are gonna suck this year but Tavarez and Scott and Burke are at least getting some play. I figure Berkman will move back to 1B when Bags retires.

 

It's TAVERAS



Sorry, but so many are butchering his name. He is not at AA anymore. At least give him the respect of spelling his name correctly, Mataeo.

 

"Lighten up, Francis"

 

Kent was a guy that I would have loved to see come back.... but he wanted more than the 1 year $7 million w/ an option year based on some easily meant incentives (plate appearences).... and he got it from the Dodgers.

Additionally, you guys are acting like its a no-brainer to choose another 2 years of a 38 year old Kent over Biggio... we're talking about a guy who is an Astro-lifer, has accomodated and switched positions for the club, and who has sacrificed his body over the long-haul big-time.... it was clearly a tough-ass decision.

Finally, you guys are clueless to why Gerry really quit. There's no way you can go as far as to say that he left because of the Kent situation. The ONE guy who I know Gerry wanted in this lineup over the last 3 years was Jason Lane... and he was suggesting to not re-sign Biggio to do that... but Drayton resigned him.

EDIT: Looks like Redding still can't figure it out in the best of pitcher's parks in Dodgers stadium... he gives up 5 ER on 3 HR in 5 innings so far.... hell, even Suckworth had a better day than that.

 

nick.. didn't we already have an option on him though???

I thought we had a 1 year option for 9 million that we could have exercised. Sure it would have been 9 million stead of 7 million, but it would have made us only have to give him 1 more year.

 

I gotta say I agree. . . on the misspelling of Taveras. How hard is it to spell this name? TA-VER-AS, it's so simple. It's not like people are demanding you know how to spell Mientkiewicz.

 

It's not half as bad as the fact that I saw people spell Clemens name. Clements.. many times last year!

 

Since when was it a "one or the other" situation? I didn't know we added a stud leftfielder to force Biggio elsewhere thus having the luxury of not re-signing Kent. Drayton is a penny pinching snake who cuts corners in the name of winning for the sake of the bottom line. Get out of town snake.

 

Maybe it was Biggio then... I have a feeling that he DID NOT want to end up playing LF again.

I'm not going to debate your opinion on Drayton. He does care about the bottom line... but you do have to realize that ALL teams not named the Yankees do that.

Show me another mid-market team, and I will tell you guys they've had to part w/ for payroll reasons... in some cases, really good players who went on to do much better than Kent is going to do for the Dodgers.

 

St. Louis

My "opinion" on Drayton is fact. We are not just talking about a run-of-the-mill, mid-market team with a mid-market owner here with the Astros. We are talking about a mid-market team with the weathiest owner in baseball at it's side, and a team that generates revenues to place them in the upper third in the league. The problem is: that we have a swindling snake of an owner; one that has consistantly lied about losing money, and in previous years failed to open the books to back it up. The events that transpired this offseason are nearly ironclad in showing the motives of the penny pinching snake.

 

Awesome... I'm glad you chose St. Louis... since I lived there for 4 years, I do actually know what goes on there... and you will be SHOCKED that they are just as much a mid-market team as anybody else around.

First of all, w/ Drayton, he may have the most net-worth, but none of that was from baseball. He probably doesn't lose money anymore, but by playing for 10 years in one of the worst baseball stadiums, along w/ one of the worst television contracts... its understandable that it took him awhile to come around on the payroll. I'm not vouching for the Drayton before MMP was opened... that guy had some major talent that could have won earlier than they did... but I haven't found much to complain about the last 3 years, starting with the Kent signing.

Now for St. Louis... first, lets look at how they arrived at their current team:

1. David Eckstein - Couldn't afford to pay Edgar Renteria what he wanted, so they settled for somebody who makes less, is worse, and will never be confused for anything other than an average MLB shortstop. I'd even take our light-hitting SS over him just for defensive purposes.

2. Larry Walker - I'll admit... this was a good trade for them. I liken it to us picking up Kent for our two years with him. Management saw that they had a shot at him last year, and since they were only like 30 games up on the division, they decided that "yea, this could be our year." That wasn't the case, however, the previous year where management refused to allow some of the discussed trades because of payroll issues.

3. Albert Pujols - fell into their lap when a fluke injury allowed Bobby Bonilia to make the team. He's homegrown... equilavent to our system producing Lance, with the exception that we spent a first round pick on Lance. St. Louis never knew what they were getting in Pujols, until he showed up... hmm, playing the kids... where have I heard complaints about that before.

4. Scott Rolen - the trade looks lop-sided now, but at the time, Bud Smith was a lights out pitcher who had thrown 3 no-hitters in the minor leauges, and one at the major league level... and Placido Polanco was a great player for them (and for Philly), and he was one of LaRussa's favorites. Rolen fell in love with St. Louis, and told Boras to make it happen (he ended up getting far less than he would have had he spoken to the Yankees or Red Sox... it never happened, because he loved St. Louis). Too bad our mid-season trade pickup didn't do the same for us.... is it Drayton's fault that he never fell in love with Houston? He only probably raised his contract value by $20 million by trading for him, and giving him a chance to shine on the big stage of the playoffs for his team.

6. Jim Edmonds - Another steal of a trade... Edmonds was an average-above average CF for Anaheim, who the Cardinals got for KENT BOTTENFIELD and Adam Kennedy. Once again, they weren't expecting this sort of production from him.

5. Mark Mulder - Again... this is a trade situation first of all. Secondly, its one that could end up being lopsided in the A's favor. Daric Barton is one of the BEST catching prospects out there. Kiko Calero is one of the BEST middle relief pitchers out there. And Danny Haren is one of the BEST young pitchers from the minors. Mulder could be washed up, since he's been awful in his last SIXTEEN starts... but then again, he could become a cy young candidate again. Who knows.

Now that you see the above players, who pretty much fell into their laps, lets see the ones who they've let go due to payroll issues:
1. Steve Kline - lefty reliever, gets people out, looks like he was unhappy in the end to go but he made his decision... just like Beltran did.

2. J.D. Drew - You think they'd rather have Larry Walker for the next two years, over JD for the next 10? They ended up getting Jason Marquis and Adam Wainwright for him... and those guys will be decent, but the Braves normally don't let good pitching go unless they know something. BTW... this was strictly a payroll move since Drew was going to be a FA. They tried to pass it off as a "he's always injured" thing, but there were plenty of Cardinals fans who were PISSED that they got rid of JD, and he actually had a good year.

3. Woody Williams - I know you're probably laughing about this, but Cardinals fans actually wanted to keep this guy. He revitilized his career there, and in the end, he had a pretty decent playoff showing (game 5). Now, they have to settle for an off-and-on Matt Morris and Jeff Suppan.

4. Edgar Renteria - already mentioned above.



So, in the end, Houston and St. Louis are pretty damn similiar. Since the Cardinals have drawn 3 million fans every year since 2000, the revenue streams are about even. Also, they had a slight edge on television/radio payroll that was only recently trumped by the new tv deal we got. Finally, they got Rolen and Edmonds to stay because of how great they loved playing in St. Louis, not because they broke the bank for them... and the last BIG NAME FA they signed was Tino Martinez. We've actually been more successful in both the FA signing department (Kent, Pettite), as well as the minor league system department (Oswalt, Lidge, Lane).

Why have they been more successful? (or just as succesful, if you count our good years in the late 90's, while they were having bad years). A couple of trades that worked out better than they possibly could have imagined in Edmonds and Rolen. A bunch of #2 starters who pitched above their heads last year like Suppan and Carpenter. And finally, a freak of nature in Albert Pujols.

 

Originally posted by Nick
Awesome... I'm glad you chose St. Louis... since I lived there for 4 years, I do actually know what goes on there... and you will be SHOCKED that they are just as much a mid-market team as anybody else around.

If they are "just as much a mid-market team" as the Astros and their revenues a nearly equal then why the huge differential in payroll? One reason: ownership.

First of all, w/ Drayton, he may have the most net-worth, but none of that was from baseball. He probably doesn't lose money anymore, but by playing for 10 years in one of the worst baseball stadiums, along w/ one of the worst television contracts... its understandable that it took him awhile to come around on the payroll. I'm not vouching for the Drayton before MMP was opened... that guy had some major talent that could have won earlier than they did... but I haven't found much to complain about the last 3 years, starting with the Kent signing.

As far as Drayton's net worth is concered, yes, a chunk of that is from baseball, and the Astros to be specific. If you do not have any questions, or problems rather, with this past offseason, then you are clearly turning a blind eye to reality.

Now for St. Louis... first, lets look at how they arrived at their current team:

1. David Eckstein - Couldn't afford to pay Edgar Renteria what he wanted, so they settled for somebody who makes less, is worse, and will never be confused for anything other than an average MLB shortstop. I'd even take our light-hitting SS over him just for defensive purposes.

No questioning that. But I would take Eckstein over our NON-Hitting SS, defense aside, eight days a week.

4. Scott Rolen - the trade looks lop-sided now, but at the time, Bud Smith was a lights out pitcher who had thrown 3 no-hitters in the minor leauges, and one at the major league level... and Placido Polanco was a great player for them (and for Philly), and he was one of LaRussa's favorites. Rolen fell in love with St. Louis, and told Boras to make it happen (he ended up getting far less than he would have had he spoken to the Yankees or Red Sox... it never happened, because he loved St. Louis). Too bad our mid-season trade pickup didn't do the same for us.... is it Drayton's fault that he never fell in love with Houston? He only probably raised his contract value by $20 million by trading for him, and giving him a chance to shine on the big stage of the playoffs for his team.

The Phillies were in a position as to where they had to trade Rolen or he was going to walk at season's end with no compensation in return. Bud Smith was disappointing the season in which he was traded, but he's a lefty and had promise. What is Drayton's fault is that he didn't meet the asking price for Beltran to begin with, nor did agree to the inclusion of a no-trade clause. Drayton is a swindling rat who has every reason to withhold information. Because he is a liar.

6. Jim Edmonds - Another steal of a trade... Edmonds was an average-above average CF for Anaheim, who the Cardinals got for KENT BOTTENFIELD and Adam Kennedy. Once again, they weren't expecting this sort of production from him.

"Average-above average CF" is laughable. Edmonds has been a Gold Glove caliber CF since his coming into the league. He was an All-Star in his first full season in which he hit .290 33 HR and 107 RBI. Over the next three years with the Angels he never hit below .290 and never had less than 25 home runs, so to say "they weren't expecting this sort of production from him" is equally as laughable as saying your above remarks regarding the player of the same name. Also, they may have got these players through trades, but they've also inked them to deals.

 

In retrospect, I would have liked to bring back Kent for one or two more years to make one final run at the World Series while Roger is here.

But last year's team struggled to manufacture runs, which absolutely killed us in the playoffs. Not to mention our defense (aside from Beltran) was nothing to brag about. We need to focus on situational hitting this year. I'd like to see us move runners up, get down good sac bunts, and steal bases. Combine that with good defense and great pitching, and we could end up doing pretty well this year.