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Just for Princess: Lynching and developing a better sense of humor about race

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by Elvis Costello, Feb 7, 2002.

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  1. Elvis Costello

    Elvis Costello Member

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    Princess, after it has repeatedly pointed out that black Americans were disenfranchised through the poll tax and other Jim Crow laws through the 1960's you still refuse to admit how utterly wrong you are about this question. But, you asked (as if I were making this **** up!) about the prevalence of lynching black Americans in the South. I will give you a number of sources. I hope you follow along.

    My wife is a teaching assitant at the University of Houston for the required American History since 1865 course. I will first quote the textbook they are using this semester.

    From "A Concise History of America and its People," volume two since 1865/by James Kirby Martin (univ. of Houston)/ Randy Roberts (Perdue univ.)/Steven Mintz (univ. Houston)/Linda McMurray (North Carolina State Univ.)/James Jones (univ. Houston)/Sam Hayes (Univ. of Texas at Arlington)

    For example


    "Lynching increasingly became a tool for controlling both black votes and actions. Under the pretext of 'maintaining law and order' vigilante mobs hanged, mutilated and burned African Americans in increasing order. During the decade of the 1890's an average of two to three black southerners were lynched each week." (page 519).

    Princess, if we do some very basic math, that is over a thousand lynchings of black people in that decade alone. This is a conservative estimate, by the way. But, I know that this evidence will not impress you..here is some more.


    From
    Arthur Raper, Southern Commission on the Study of Lynching (1933)



    http://www.journale.com/withoutsanctuary/main.html Southern Commission on the Study of Lynching (1933)


    3,724 people were lynched in the United States from 1889 through to 1930. Over four-fifths of these were Negroes, less than one-sixth of whom were accused of rape. Practically all of the lynchers were native whites. The fact that a number of the victims were tortured, mutilated, dragged, or burned suggests the presence of sadistic tendencies among the lynchers. Of the tens of thousands of lynchers and onlookers, only 49 were indicted and only 4 have been sentenced."


    This is referenced by this webpage: http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAlynching.htm

    In your search for truth, Princess, I hope you will note that these lynchings are not some figment of black people's imaginations , or out of the misty past. I again refer to James Byrd, a man not 75 miles away from Houston who was murdered in 1998 because he was black. His head got pulled off after they tied him to a truck and dragged him a few miles. Because he was a black guy in the wrong place at the wrong time. See also the case of Michael Donald who was lynched by the KKK in Alabama in 1981.

    Finally, take a look at the reality of lynchings. Check out this webpage of photographs and postcards of lynchings in America. I am sure you have a good explanation for the "true intentions" of the people who murdered these people, right Princess? This webpage is based on a book of photographs and postcards of the lynching black people in the American South. Look at these pictures and then tell me how black people should have a better sense of humor about your insensitivity.

    http://www.journale.com/withoutsanctuary/main.html
     
    #1 Elvis Costello, Feb 7, 2002
  2. haven

    haven Member

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    *wow*

    *is glad he isn't princess, right now*

    Of course, she and I are both fortunate not to be blacks in the deep south during an age when lynching was a form of political control.
     
    #2 haven, Feb 7, 2002
  3. rockHEAD

    rockHEAD Member

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    [​IMG]
     
    #3 rockHEAD, Feb 7, 2002
  4. BrianKagy

    BrianKagy Member

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    Princess thinks lynchings are funny?
     
    #4 BrianKagy, Feb 7, 2002
  5. Princess

    Princess Member

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    No, Princess does not think these are funny. I think the numbers have been exaggerated. And I am sticking by what my professors have told me.
     
    #5 Princess, Feb 7, 2002
  6. rimbaud

    rimbaud Member
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    Damn, Elvis, didn't see this before I posted about this in the original thread. b*stard! :)

    PS - at least I included pictures to "laugh" at.
     
    #6 rimbaud, Feb 7, 2002
  7. Kam

    Kam Member

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    Man, y'all taking one litle piece of poop, and making it one large pile of poop.
     
    #7 Kam, Feb 7, 2002
  8. dylan

    dylan Member

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    Princess, just one little note. I know when I was a young college student (as opposed to my current elderly status of 24) I held all of my professors in great regard. They knew so much that I couldn't see at all how they could ever be wrong about anything. It wasn't too much later that I caught one of my profs at a mistake.

    Yes, professors tend to be intelligent people. Yes they generally know a great deal about their subject of interest. But they are still people and have their own motives and agendas. It's easy to say "My prof told me so it must be true" but just remember that nobody is correct all the time...
     
    #8 dylan, Feb 7, 2002
  9. Princess

    Princess Member

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    Thank you for the advice dylan. I do appreciate it.

    And all this isn't coming just from one professor. This is coming from a professor on Women's Voting who's had numerous books published. This is coming from my US Constitution Honors class. This is coming from Human Situation professors (who I find extremely liberal). This is coming from a distinguised faculty member of the University and distinguised citizen. And most of these people are Democrats (which I am clearly not). So I do take what they say very seriously but I don't blindly believe everything they say. I have learned things I never even knew about that I find very interesting.

    It is a collective effort. I'm still in the learning process though!
     
    #9 Princess, Feb 7, 2002
  10. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    So you don't take them very seriously unless you agree with what they are saying.
     
    #10 Rocketman95, Feb 7, 2002
  11. TheFreak

    TheFreak Member

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    Any reason why this warranted a new thread? Your intention was either to make Princess look bad, make yourself look good, or both. Which is it?
     
    #11 TheFreak, Feb 7, 2002
  12. DiSeAsEd MoNkEy

    DiSeAsEd MoNkEy Member

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    does she really need help? =)
     
    #12 DiSeAsEd MoNkEy, Feb 7, 2002
  13. Nomar

    Nomar Member

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    Uh-oh, I smell a chick fight. Actually I can see one starting to form, but thats not the point...
     
    #13 Nomar, Feb 7, 2002
  14. Elvis Costello

    Elvis Costello Member

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    No, I thought the subject was important enough to warrant its own thread. Kind of like when you start a thread about your favorite Poison, or Winger song, right? Thanks for getting to the bottom of this, though.
     
    #14 Elvis Costello, Feb 7, 2002
  15. BrianKagy

    BrianKagy Member

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    This coming from someone who sneers at the Drudge Report and FOXNews.
     
    #15 BrianKagy, Feb 7, 2002
  16. Princess

    Princess Member

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    No, that's not true. Everything that the opposition to my view has been saying, I believed at one time too. And I still do, but I have found other credited opinions and facts that I have actually seen in real life.

    You all are asking me to open myself up and listen to you. But I have opened myself up. I have listened to you all or I would not still be here. But I do have my opinions, all of which you do not know. I know no one's out to get anyone. I'm just opinionated.

    I'm very upset about a lot of things. My life has been turned upside down in the last few months. That's the only thing I want anyone to understand.

    I don't mind this thread, even if it was designed to make me look bad (and I have done a pretty good job of that myself). I have no objections to any more information on the subject. In fact, I welcome it. I just felt that arguing and throwing names back and forth is not the best way to get someone else to see your side (and that goes for me and everyone else, I think).

    Happy postings!
     
    #16 Princess, Feb 7, 2002
  17. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    I don't use those sources to back me up when it's convienent either.

    Nice try.
     
    #17 Rocketman95, Feb 7, 2002
  18. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    Sorry Princess, I misread your post.
     
    #18 Rocketman95, Feb 7, 2002
  19. Gascon

    Gascon Member

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    I agree.


    The subject was broached. This is grandstanding.

    If you wanted to have a personal debate, her e-mail is easily obtained in her profile.
     
    #19 Gascon, Feb 7, 2002
  20. BrianKagy

    BrianKagy Member

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    Right, you dismiss them out of hand, which is sort of the point. You don't agree with what you perceive as their partisan slant, so you won't accept their position as credible, which is what you're accusing Princess of-- taking sources seriously only when they confirm your beliefs.

    I could add "nice try" or something similarly dismissive here, but that's not really what I'm trying to accomplish.
     
    #20 BrianKagy, Feb 7, 2002
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