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Jeremy Lin's upside

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by meh, Jul 20, 2012.

  1. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    In that period, he was already suffering from chronic knee pain. His productivity was greatly diminished. He was playing 'under control' and turning the ball over less because he couldn't explode off the dribble and attack the paint the way he wanted to.

    He was certainly gaining more experience, but he was also complaining of knee pain and sitting out periodically.

    But then again, I tend to think that mastery often involves short bursts of improvement followed by long plateaus of consistency.

    We'll see in the upcoming season. I think his offseason prep is as good as any other player in the league, so I expect him to be significantly improved over last season.


     
  2. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    No comment!
     
  3. Arthurprescott2

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    I agree with that he played surprisingly well with Melo as it went on. That said, there was a losing streak in there (6 games straight?).
     
  4. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    I'd like to see them. What is the knicks record when both are on the floor and play 30+ min. each?

    "Playing well" is a relative term. Carmelo and Amare are stating that they are expecting to win a championship.
     
  5. CXbby

    CXbby Contributing Member

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    Like you said, those type of expectations are unlikely to be met for any player, I am just pointing out the inconsistent expectations for players with similar production compared to Lin with similar sample size.

    As far as DMo goes, if he averages 25 and 10 in his first 5 starts in the NBA, you can bet the McHale comparisons will be there.
     
  6. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    It was a work in progress. I recall Carmelo throwing a fit at times when he didn't get the ball when he wanted it. I also recall Lin throwing a fit after the knicks bigs failed to secure a defensive rebound.

    I think Lin and the knicks could have won a lot of games together, but ultimately, that's not what Carmelo wanted: he does NOT want a co-starring role on broadway.
     
  7. roxxy

    roxxy Member

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    Yes there was. Multiple factors contributed to that just like multiple factors contributed to his initial success. Team playing stiffer competition. Melo and Amare coming back changing the offensive dynamic. Melo and Amare coming back not playing any defense. Power struggle between Melo and the coach and what system should be run. Lin also going against better competition as well.
     
  8. roxxy

    roxxy Member

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    Injury may have played some factor. But something you are ignoring is the new coach. Woodson, slowed the pace down a little. Put the ball more in Melo's hands. Decreased the number of pnr's that the team ran as well if I remember correctly. All of this contributed to less turnovers by Lin, him playing in a more controlled offensive structure. Ie. Melo and Amare were the first and second offensive option and Lin was number three. Under Dantoni it was a free for all in terms of who could score the ball.
     
  9. roxxy

    roxxy Member

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    Arthur: You didn't answer my question. I agree that it is a reasonable statement to feel that Lin's sample size does not make it a plausible possibility that he could become a HOF guard. At the same time, do you feel the same about Kryie and Rubio about there similarly small sample size and there subsequent unlikelihood of becoming HOF guards?
     
  10. redlawn

    redlawn Member

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    Lin or no Lin, Knicks' problems start with their stars

     
  11. Sigmund

    Sigmund Member

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    What you don't realize that there is a lot of average and above average players in this league who would produce just as Lin, if you put them in system he played.

    That's why I was never really impressed by what Lin did. And yet, he was still volume scorer and turnover machine. He was put in high pick&roll and was given a green light to do whatever he wants.

    Tyson Chandler and Shumpert was beasting on defense, even JR Smith finally used his athleticism to play defense. You combine that with easy schedule and you are on winning streak.
     
  12. Arthurprescott2

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    Yea of course those are all valid points. But that said, he had just as many obstacles in the first 8 games albeit different ones. I guess what I'm saying is his first 8 created expectations that he would overcome all. Thus the subsequent let-down when he couldn't immediately absorb Melo into the flow of the offense. Not saying it was rational. Emotional reaction of a fan.
     
  13. Sigmund

    Sigmund Member

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    You can discuss that on Knicks forum, if you are still their fan.
     
  14. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    Well, that was the reason for Carmelo's push to get rid of Dantoni: his desire to reassert his position as the first option in a half court set.

    This leads to a new political terrain: did Woodson prioritize half court iso's as a matter of philosophical principle or due to political necessity (give melo the ball or get run by Carmelo's camp), or a bit of both? Obviously Lin's role was going to be diminished with Carmelo's return.

    One thing we know: the fans weren't happy about it: there was plenty of criticism and anticipation of Carmelo mucking up and slowing down the offense and of yes, being selfish.
     
  15. Arthurprescott2

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    Of course. I love watching Irving and Rubio but I've never said and I would never say that either are HOF-caliber until they have at least five seasons of excellence under their belt.
     
  16. kuku

    kuku Contributing Member

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    It's not a misconception at all. Here's the article:
    http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/sto...new-york-knicks-locker-room-according-sources
     
  17. roxxy

    roxxy Member

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    I am not so sure if it was that per se. Even though they did play well together I think it came down to mentality. Lin is more of a spread the wealth kind of pg. He does not want to rely on just one or two people, he wants to move the ball, get everyone involved and make everyone better. The Knicks on the other hand, they have two players Melo and Amare who are max players and thus they need to be the focal point of the team. Lin would defer because he is a team player. But the person they picked up Felton (I never watched him as a Knick) but a friend of mine describes him as the type of pg who will give the ball to Amare and Melo and let them be the max players. In a situation where both Novak and Melo were demanding the ball. If Melo had a man guarding him but he still demanded the ball and Novak was wide open, Lin would give the ball to Novak all the time. Felton on the other hand would give the ball to Melo. This I think played a factor.
     
  18. Arthurprescott2

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    More specifically to your point - NO, I don't think Irving or Rubio are HOF-upside players.
     
  19. Sigmund

    Sigmund Member

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    So? They went 18-6 with Lin out and Melo averaged 30 points on 49% shooting. They are going to be third seed, if they continue to play like they did in April.
     
  20. imarealballer

    imarealballer Member

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    That's Jeremy's challenge: 'how can he remain optimally productive without putting himself at unnecessary risk of injury?' He was crashing the paint at every opportunity and was far from receiving star calls.

    I think in most people's minds again fair or not, the 'problem' was not of Lin incorporating Melo (Lin was perceived as being cooperative in that and all regards) but of Melo's willingness or not to share the ball with Lin.
     

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