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Jalen Greens 3rd Year Analysis Vs Current SGs

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by BigMaloe, Dec 1, 2023.

  1. roslolian

    roslolian Member

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    Thanks for this. To me it really does show that the whole star players all blow up by year 3 is a myth.

    Rockets still have 2 more years before they need to extend him and by then we should have a clearer picture on what Green's trajectory is gonna be.
     
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  2. Will

    Will Clutch Crew
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    I'm going to be patient with Green this year, not based on his stats but because I think this is first year of being properly coached. I want to give Udoka time to get in his head and instill more aggression and discipline.

    Can this young man maintain focus, make better use of his athleticism at both ends of the court, and round out his game? It's a mental thing. If Udoka can make it happen, great. If not, I assume Udoka will tell Stone, and that'll be that.
     
  3. xtruroyaltyx

    xtruroyaltyx Member

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    No.
     
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  4. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    Again, he is being a professional for longer than his NBA Career, it is his responsibility to get much better than that......

    Making it about coaching, I do not know, would sound too convenient.
     
  5. Tuckmose

    Tuckmose Member

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    Kind of?

    Harden won 6MOTY while leading the NBA in TS% in year 3.

    Kevin Durant dropped 30 a game.

    Curry was injured for most of his year 3 so I won't consider that, but the games he played were quite pedestrian.

    Tatum put up 23 a game on 40% 3 point shooting.

    Derrick Rose won MVP.

    Chris Paul should have won MVP.


    I'd say expecting a 3rd year breakout is reasonable for true superstars, but for lesser stars, year 4-5 is where they really hit their stride.

    Fortunately for Rockets Fans, Alperen may have taken that year 3 superstar leap.
     
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  6. roslolian

    roslolian Member

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    Whats wrong with being a "lesser star"? Does anybody go to Booker and tell him he sucks because he is only a multi time all star instead of a generational talent?

    A star is a star. If you get a star with your 2nd pick that's already a win. Would it be better if you got a generational prospect? No ****. Generational means once every decade, not every draft will have a talent like that available.

    As for your comment about guys like KD breaking out by yr 3, the people criticizing Green aren't saying he isn't a generational talent, they are saying he is a bust because he hasn't broken out by yr 3. So yeah my previous post is still right.
     
  7. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    Are we still going with the delusion that Jalen is going to be a star one day?
     
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  8. DatRocketFan

    DatRocketFan Member

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    I just find it funny that the anti green fans like to use cherry pick stats to sht on green and when someone finally goes out of their way and time to write a very fair post on greens outlook, u have stupid comments like the one above.

    Weirdos root for green to fail just to boost their ego of being right
     
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  9. dmoneybangbang

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    They don't do you any justice....

    Well what did any of those players in year 3 do well? Where did any optimism come from any of those players....That's kinda the point.....
     
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  10. duluth111222

    duluth111222 Member

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    Yeah I know LOL. I was just poking fun of DumbDumb.
     
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  11. BigMaloe

    BigMaloe Member

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    I do agree that working on his mid range would help him a ton, because when he gets stopped before the rim he doesnt have a counter. This is something i do believe him and Ime are working on, albeit im seeing more passing focus atm. Prolly a good thing since his mid-range shot isnt very good. If he could find the open man after collapsing the D thats just as good as the midrange, for now.

    he ball hand is average I do agree. Im not sure if he will ever have a tight handle but id like improvement.

    his passing has come a long way. hes getting more assists sure, but his hockey assists are way up. hes finding the open man more often that not to keep the offense fluid.

    his rebounding is fine for a guard, id like him to box out more defensively tho. he has a tendency to stare and get beat.

    his defense is good. not average, not just better under udoka, its good. sure he has lapses but everyone does. this team was #1 on defense for a reason. obviously its on the team concepts and players around him, but just like sengun, hes been a positive contributor to the defense. he does get sloppy and its still a work in progress, but his rotations have been really good. his biggest weakness i would say is fighting through screens where he just doesnt have the body strength yet.

    your last statement doesnt really deserve a response.
     
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  12. dmoneybangbang

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    Yawn..... Classic "clap clap do better"... just a lazy argument.
     
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  13. Rochut

    Rochut Member

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    Getting an all-star from a #2 pick has to be considered at least a decent outcome - for reference:

    2019 Ja Morant, Murray State – Memphis Grizzlies
    2018 Marvin Bagley, Duke – Sacramento Kings
    2017 Lonzo Ball, UCLA – Los Angeles Lakers
    2016 Brandon Ingram, Duke – Los Angeles Lakers
    2015 D’Angelo Russell, Ohio State – Los Angeles Lakers
    2014 Jabari Parker, Duke – Milwaukee Bucks
    2013 Victor Oladipo, Indiana – Orlando Magic
    2012 Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, Kentucky – Charlotte Bobcats
    2011 Derrick Williams, Arizona – Minnesota Timberwolves
    2010 Evan Turner, Ohio State – Philadelphia 76ers

    2000’s

    2009 Hasheem Thabeet, Connecticut – Memphis Grizzlies
    2008 Michael Beasley, Kansas State – Miami HEAT
    2007 Kevin Durant, Texas – Seattle Supersonics
    2006 LaMarcus Aldridge, Texas – Chicago Bulls (Draft rights traded to Portland Trail Blazers)
    2005 Marvin Williams, North Carolina – Atlanta Hawks
    2004 Emeka Okafor, Connecticut – Charlotte Bobcats
    2003 Darko Milicic, Serbia & Montenegro – Detroit Pistons
    2002 Jay Williams, Duke – Chicago Bulls
    2001 Tyson Chandler, Dominguez HS (Calif.) – L.A. Clippers (Draft rights traded to Chicago Bulls)
    2000 Stromile Swift, LSU – Vancouver Grizzlies

    1990’s

    1999 Steve Francis, Maryland – Vancouver Grizzlies
    1998 Mike Bibby, Arizona – Vancouver Grizzlies
    1997 Keith Van Horn, Utah – Philadelphia 76ers (Draft rights traded to New Jersey Nets)
    1996 Marcus Camby, Massachusetts – Toronto Raptors
    1995 Antonio McDyess, Alabama – L.A. Clippers (Draft rights traded to Denver Nuggets)
    1994 Jason Kidd, California – Dallas Mavericks
    1993 Shawn Bradley, Brigham Young – Philadelphia 76ers
    1992 Alonzo Mourning, Georgetown – Charlotte Hornets
    1991 Kenny Anderson, Georgia Tech – New Jersey Nets
    1990 Gary Payton, Oregon State – Seattle Supersonics

    1980’s

    1989 Danny Ferry, Duke – L.A. Clippers
    1988 Rik Smits, Marist – Indiana Pacers
    1987 Armon Gilliam, UNLV – Phoenix Suns
    1986 Len Bias, Maryland – Boston Celtics
    1985 Wayman Tisdale, Oklahoma – Indiana Pacers
    1984 Sam Bowie, Kentucky – Portland Trail Blazers
    1983 Steve Stipanovich, Missouri – Indiana Pacers
    1982 Terry Cummings, DePaul – San Diego Clippers
    1981 Isiah Thomas, Indiana – Detroit Pistons
    1980 Darrell Griffith, Louisville – Utah Jazz

    1970’s

    1979 David Greenwood, UCLA – Chicago Bulls
    1978 Phil Ford, North Carolina – Kansas City Kings
    1977 Otis Birdsong, Houston – Kansas City
    1976 Scott May, Indiana – Chicago Bulls
    1975 David Meyers, UCLA – L.A. Lakers
    1974 Marvin Barnes, Providence – Philadelphia 76ers
    1973 Jim Brewer, Minnesota – Cleveland Cavaliers
    1972 Bob McAdoo, North Carolina – Buffalo Braves
    1971 Sidney Wicks, UCLA – Portland Trail Blazers
    1970 Rudy Tomjanovich, Michigan – San Diego Rockets
     
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  14. BigMaloe

    BigMaloe Member

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    LOVE this post. great stuff.

    Seeing Green boosting his RA% this year closer to the elite guys is promising. Obviously the actual shooting percentages being lower is something i think we all see and feel. but i think the ability to get there outweighs the success while there, FOR NOW. obviously its something he still needs to work on and believe, like you mentioned, strength is the key. he is very finesse and that doesnt lead to easy buckets, but rather hard buckets.

    I would like to see him be more aggressive and drive to the hole, i just think defenses have figured him out and block the rim path, leading to his bad midrange game. If he can figure out that next step and be aggressive, his FT% should also increase, which in turn his ts% would increase.

    this are all encouraging signs and comparisons, obviously he needs to put it together, and maybe he wont. but hes comparable to the top guys, and even if he falls short of their production and skill, he seems to be on trajectory to be whats a fringe all-star or better, imo.
     
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  15. BigMaloe

    BigMaloe Member

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    I agree with your last statement.

    I think, because year 3 isnt over and he still has time to prove me wrong, that there is a shot he becomes a superstar level player, albeit very small. I just dont see it tho. IMO he wont be a top 5 guy, but if he could be a top 20 guy, or top 10 guy that would be great.

    He has time to "make that jump" this year but more likely his path is of all-stardom. Which is perfectly great for a #2 pick. Everyone wants the superstar, but they dont grow on trees.
     
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  16. Stephen_A

    Stephen_A Member

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    Dame, Kyrie, and SGA all shot around 39% mid range in their year 3. Jalen shot 39.9% last year. This season just started and there’s a lot of games left to assess him. All 3 of those aforementioned guys shoot well over 42% mid range since their year 3. Again it’s about progression and growth. Baffling how many people think superstars grow overnight or just become amazing players in a short amount of time.
     
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  17. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    Fine, but it is as lazy as coming into the league with bad fundamentals.....

    Udoka is doing overtime work.....

     
    #77 daywalker02, Dec 2, 2023
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2023
  18. Puppet Master

    Puppet Master Member

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    It would be stupid to trade Green right now but the criticism is fair

    It's more than numbers to me. It's the eye test. He shrinks in the 4th quarter when games are close. He actually runs away from the ball way too much.

    He has a horrible knack of committing momentum shifting turnovers.

    His IQ is questionable when driving to the basket. How many times must he get his shot blocked before he realizes to have a counter offensive move?

    He takes way too long to decide what to do when he gets the ball. He needs to make his decisions quickly and use his speed. Problem is his handle isn't great and he tends to leave the ball behind which forces him to pick up his dribble

    Now, making the numbers relevant, it shows he's capable and I have confidence he will eventually put it all together

    His defense has also improved this season.

    New coach, new system, new teammates, be patient.
     
  19. roslolian

    roslolian Member

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    He already beat your Corey Brewer allegation that's for sure.
     
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  20. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    Corey underwhelmed.....came into the league with above average expectations.....
     

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