I can understand the confusion - I wasn't as precise as I should have been with my language - so let me clarify If Jabari becomes a top 5 3pt shooter, he can achieve the most optimistic points per game suggested by some of his most ardent supporters. If that happens, he more than likely better than the 5th best starter. But if he remains an average 3pt shooter, a decent rebounder and a solid perimeter defender but with all the deficiencies that I've listed (and argued are not something that time or coaching will significantly improve), he's the 5th best starter on an average team.
Being 6'10 and doing all those things bolded means Jabari will have a long career and make near max. Just look at Tobias Harris. He did horrible but still got paid 25M a year. 6'10 spacers are always in high demand, every championship team wants a guy like that. Then you add the fact he is solid at rebounding and defending and can play either 4 or 5 he is basically Al Horford. Nobody called Horford elite at anything but ever since he developed his 3 he has been a max player. Jabari is a rare archetype and much coveted around the league calling him 5th best starter on an average team is just plain wrong.
Thanks for the good faith response without resorting to insults or pseudo-psychological profiling. I agree that his most glaring weakness is his overall game feel - many of my examples of his deficiencies are symptoms of that. Specifically, he is incredibly slow to react to plays as they happen - it's why he's so utterly shitty at things as simple as rotating to the ideal spot for kick out passes or cutting to the basket. He's better on defense but even there, I still see someone who's repeating the textbook in his head while he guards his man. I don't see that same stiffness with Amen, who's already a far superior defender due his anticipation and read skills. Can something like that be improved? Sure - but to what degree and how quickly is the question. If Jabari had shown more glimpses of game feel (i.e. he's just been inconsistent), then I'd be more hopeful. But I just haven't seen it, and his history (again, a guy who's played ball his whole life under the watch of a former pro) means that there's probably less room for improvement vs someone who is relatively new to the game. As a side note, we could make this same criticism about Amen's shot - he's been playing organized ball most of his life and yet his jumper is horrific. Is it realistic to expect him to improve it much when he's already had so much opportunity to do so? The same goes for many of his other deficiencies. You and I clearly have different opinions on his dribbling - I did not seen him do anything more advanced than short unguarded dribble drives. Unfortunately, many of his dribble drives came off a faked 3pt shot after a kick-out, with Jabari often passing up a wide open shot and dribbling into a congested paint (another example of his poor game feel). I also did not see him hit many shots with a hand in his face - almost all were unguarded and often times he was blocked when guarded on shots inside the 3pt line (by shorter players no less). Let me be clear - none of these deficiencies on their own is enough to limit his ceiling. It's the entire collection of deficiencies that make me doubt his potential for growth. We have time to see what happens with him, but ultimately, I don't think there are any surprises for him to spring. That's why I think his best value to the Rockets is as a trade piece.
That's exactly who I'm looking at - paying someone like Jabari a near max would be just as damaging to our team as it was for Philly to pay a big chunk of their salary cap to Tobias. As far as being a rare archetype, that's really irrelevant. I've been over why Jabari the human has played so underwhelmingly compared to his archetype - no need to repeat myself.
Same man....same. It's possible to have differing opinions of a player and not take it as a personal attack or resort to personal attacks. Getting rarer to see that here. I think we both think the same things, just differ on whether or not we think Jabari can correct these things. As I read your response it got me thinking that at times Jabari can be like Cam....and to a lesser degree Jalen. Of the 3, Jalen has probably the most IQ as it pertains to a "Plan B" when his initial idea falls apart. Take Reed, Sengun and Amen who seem to be doing calculus equations while dribbling in the paint or at the top of the key. They have Plan A, Plan B, and Plan C already in their minds. Jabari only has Plan A. And when it falls apart, he resorts to a hurried and often times, bad, pass that either gets his teammate in trouble or stolen. The reason for that is that he just doesn't think a few steps ahead. This is a concern and I do agree with you that players usually have this innate ability....or they dont. This is my same concern with Cam. He struggles when his initial attempt is stopped and instead of going to his Plan B, he just forces it because there never was another option in his mind to begin with. To Jalen's credit, he has the ability to at least have an alternate plan to his drives. Why playmaking is such a premium in these types of players and why everyone is fawning over Reed Sheppard at the moment. I just buy his skillset, his size, his release point and his demeanor. I think he wants to be great and it's enough to give him the benefit of the doubt. He's not as natural at it as he (or a lot of us) thought and it's turning out to be much more work than originally anticipated. We will see. I'm not expecting a huge dribble package this year. What I am expecting: - 38% from 3 (40% preferred) and 48% from the field, 80% from the FT line. - Much better team defense - More physicality defensively, aggressive POA defense and better screens - More decisive shooting - Better passes Like honestly that's it from me. I dont even care that much about his dribble drives yet. The above would really help this team compete with the bid guns in the west.
Amen does most of his playmaking either in the short roll or open transition. When it's slowed down in the half court and he has to concentrate dribbling against multiple set defenses, he has to concentrate to much on keeping his handle to think of "plan A, B and C" at the moment. That is a genuine current flaw in his game at age 21. Maybe that won't be a flaw in a couple of seasons. But that you say here is simply not true. As of now Amen is a smart quick decision maker when he's not concentrating on maintaining a live dribble against set half court defenses. Reed shows promise as a true PG but we need to see NBA game action. Sengun is Sengun. He's currently the best player on the team in decision making with the ball in his hands against set defenses.
I agree with this 100%, and would add that one wrinkle to this is physical tools. A player who is particularly fast, strong or bouncy can sometimes overcome poor decision making by overwhelming defenses. Think Vince Carter in the 2000 Olympics - an average athlete isn't scoring on Fredric Weiss who was in great position to stop a layup. But Vince was obviously not an average or even just an above average athlete, and thus we had the now famous teabag dunk. Both Jalen and Cam have some physical advantages for their position (speed and bounciness for Jalen and strength for Cam), but Jabari doesn't (granted, he's tall, but he's not overwhelmingly taller than others at his position). So any success he has will require him making the right decision and he has a, extremely long way to go on this.
Jabari has a tremendous skill set, great work ethic, and the size and shooting touch to excel. He just turned 21 and much of what I have seen as weaknesses is more about confidence than innate ability. He does get a “deer in the headlight” kind of demeanor too often, but hopefully age and experience is going to lessen that this year. We have two years with Jabari to figure out if he is worth a lot of money. By the time his is 23, I expect he will be imposing his will on a lot more people.
Jabari is only 21 while Harris was 26 when Detroit signed him to that deal. Big difference between the 2. Its crazy you think you already know the limit of Jabari when he just played as a 20 yr old, esp in when in his first year he shot 30% from and his 2nd he shot 36% from 3.
I hope Jabari wants to be the best 3pt shooter on the team. If he's a real competitor he won't let a rookie like Sheppard step on the floor and show him up.
He clearly wants to be KD for sure. After the Rockets drafted him, I thought he should try to model his game after Klay. But he has been going the Durant route. So hopefully he can be some poor-man's version of Durant, even if I'm not too optimistic.
He's too rigid to be anything close to Durant. Just like you can't just practice and be Michael Jordan or Lebron James, you can't just practice and be Durant. Poor man's Durant is a best case scenario.
He still looks more like a bigger Rashard Lewis and Reggie Miller type.....Durant handles are not attainable.
omfg he’s not Klay, He’s not Middleton, He’s not even inthe same universe as Durant. This is getting embarrassing. Dude is Robert Horry and that’s not a bad thing, especially Houston Robert Horry.
He’s not even as fluent in movement as Rashard Lewis. With or without the ball, dude is as stiff as it gets. and that’s okay. He can still be a top Contributor on a very good team
