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How good would would Harden and Rockets be if he had the mentality and leadership of MJ?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by hikanoo49, May 17, 2020.

  1. lnchan

    lnchan LeonardTX26
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    Tim Duncan turned out fine without being an ***hole.
     
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  2. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    I'm sure inside the locker room and practice he was demanding. You don't win 4 rings by being laid back and not ambitious.
     
  3. meh

    meh Contributing Member

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    I personally prefer Harden gets Pippen and Rodman/Grant rather than some leadership improvements. The problem with Harden seems to be that he can't keep up his usage in the playoffs without faltering. He was amazing in the playoffs on OKC when he was the spark plug off the bench but faltered against Miami when they began to key on him. He faltered in the playoffs with us when Dwight wasn't playing up to par or when CP3 stopped playing like CP3 due to injuries or whatever issues. He's not good enough to be a solo act the way Hakeem was in 94. Honestly the parallel I would draw is to Robinson and the Spurs. Really good seasons but never quite make it through in the playoffs against superior competition. Robinson didn't get his championship until Duncan. And the same may be true of Harden where he needs someone who at least share his load.
     
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  4. napalm06

    napalm06 Fertitta-McNair School of Management
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    We had this in CP3 (which everyone claimed to hate for it) and we were up 3-2 on the best dynasty in 25 years in the conference finals, shimmying on Creampuff Curry and talking smack with Donkey Green.

    We had it in Patrick Beverley when we were getting punked by mid-seeded teams.

    We have it in Westbrook now, but with a completely different skillset, and we're floundering between 3-7 in the West.

    Could it be that having an uber type A personality isn't all you need to be successful?
     
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  5. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    This is my number one issue with Harden's training mentality. He seems to only work on his step back iso dribbling game.

    Jordan had signature moves such as his turnaround fadaway but the dude was a addict in being fundamentally sound on offense and defense.
     
  6. tinman

    tinman Contributing Member
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    I believe the Spurs got the bad end of the media as well

    ESPN usually uses the term boring when describing their runs but that wasn’t true

    this is because LeBron or Kobe didn’t win
     
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  7. BallSoHarden

    BallSoHarden Member

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    I don't think anything is wrong with his work ethic or leadership. The guy does not say a whole lot to the media, he is not very active on social media (deactivated IG), he does not have Nike marketing behind him pushing narratives behind the scenes, I can understand how people who do not watch a ton of sports or NBA can maybe buy into the stereotypes of Harden, the fact is that various types of leaders have won. The marketing engine of shoe companies and the media pushing their documentaries AFTER the fact try to convince the common man that reason X is why this individual was successful, yet there are plenty of individuals who have won by being completely different. There are many factors that go into winning, many of those are outside of an individual players control. By this logic, someone like Kevin Garnett would have won more than just one championship. I have not seen a leader as intense as this guy on the court.

    I will say this, the one thing that I do find in common with the Warriors and Bulls super teams, as well as many others including Lebron's Heat team, is that the teams were possible due to some financial anomaly. Either a historic and sudden rise in the salary cap, or a player taking a significant pay cut vs. their market value. This seems to be the case with nearly every championship team, we have not had that happen. It is the same reason that some super teams were very short lived compared to the Bulls, because that financial anomaly in those instances were short lived.
     
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  8. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    He's pretty active in posting his iso dribbling practice sessions actually. It's the one thing he posts plenty of during the off-season. He's also in a lot of pick up tournaments during the off-season such as in UCLA last off-season and you can see that he only works on the same move set always. It's always iso straight line drive for a lob, lay up or fta or iso step back with a series of through the leg dribble moves. You never see him do different things like practicing running off ball to get open or running curls.
     
  9. snowconeman22

    snowconeman22 Member

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    I’m sure this has been said already , but the hornets have had Jordan’s guidance and leadership and look where it’s gotten them .

    great players sometimes make for the worst coaches / management because they were able to dominate and see the floor in ways most players just aren’t capable of .

    MJ has competitiveness for sure . Would it rub off and be good ? Could it cause conflict and damage ?
     
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  10. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    Doesnt he just piss you off chowd?
     
  11. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    Your simplistic take is acutely ignorant.

    Michael Jordan led the league in scoring 10 times. Early in his career (first 5 years or so) MJ dominated the ball like no other.

    You do realize that Jordan never led NBA in assists like Harden has nor does Jordan have nearly as many triple doubles.

    Your narrative is fake, your eye test is not just myopic but completely blind.
     
  12. napalm06

    napalm06 Fertitta-McNair School of Management
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    Actually I want to drill in on a point I made earlier; Westbrook is said and portrayed to have the Jordan mentality, except he has never won crap. Are the Westbrook fans here trying to say that he in fact isn't very skilled? Or that the Jordan mentality isn't all it takes to win? Did Tim Duncan have that? Did Dirk Nowitski have that? Kevin Durant? It can't be both ways, haha.

    (Btw I am on the 'Harden has mental flaws' wagon. He is much more Tracy Mcgrady than Chris Paul.)
     
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  13. francis 4 prez

    francis 4 prez Contributing Member

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    exactly. lateral quickness might be harden's biggest physical liability. he does not go left/right quickly.

    and exactly again. one reason harden looks so fast on offense is because he has unbelievable handles. same with curry and kyrie. when you have amazing handles, it's almost as if you are running with a football and asking someone to stay in front of you. when you are trying to keep track of the ball, you are much slower. if lebron handled like harden, he'd be unfair (and does anyone accuse him of being too lazy to learn excellent handles?).
     
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  14. Easy

    Easy Very Calm
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    Yeah, LeBron is probably the best all around player of all time. He is not the top guy at any part of his game. There are better scorers, better passers, better rebounders, better defenders, stronger players, faster players, etc. But the total package has no weakness.
     
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  15. apollo33

    apollo33 Member

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    I don't think there's a faster/stronger/leaper combo than Lebron ever. Maybe Wilt but I never saw him play.

    He's probably like 9.5 out of 10 for all 3 categories.
     
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  16. SamFisher

    SamFisher Virtuous

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    If Harden played against the toilet-bowl quality 90's defenses like Jordan did, we'd be talking about MJ like we do Mitch Richmond today, as in not at all.
     
  17. larsv8

    larsv8 Contributing Member

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    Yea um, Harden with Jordan's circumstance is winning multiple titles as well. lol
     
  18. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    You forget Shawn Kemp?
     
  19. TracywtFacy

    TracywtFacy Member

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  20. tycoonchip

    tycoonchip Tilman has Aids!
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    **** that. He needs a take from the Dream!
     

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