While Francis has put up some pretty good offensive numbers throughout his career, he's still perceived as a disappointment as a point guard. His hands are too small to effectively hang onto the ball, which has contributed to one of the lowest assist to turnover ratios (1.705:1) for a starting PG in the history of the NBA. Now, this is not meant to be a dog Francis post, I'm just stating some facts to set up the original question. What if Francis had accepted the role Vancouver/Memphis wanted him to fill as their starting SG with Mike Bibby as the PG? Well, first off, Houston would've never been able to trade for him, which means we would've missed the chance to see some of the amazing athletic moves he made in his early days. We also would not have had to endure some of the frustrations of seeing him become a ball hog & dribbling the clock away. But, here's where I think it would've gotten interesting. Francis has always been a SG in a PG's body. There's nothing wrong with that. After all, it's worked out pretty well for another PG/SG by the name of Iverson. Francis was always able to create his on shots, drive it to the hole while drawing the foul, & shoot from outside. That, in my opinion, is the makings of one hell of a SG. He wasn't a bad rebounder & was pretty good at getting steals as well. Bibby, on the other hand, has been a much more effective PG throughout his career than Francis has been. He's got better vision on the floor & hangs onto the ball much better. His shooting skills have always been there, but in recent years he's been shooting much more. Without digging into it, I'm going to assume that he was forced to pick up the slack caused by other players not doing their part. But, I don't know for sure about that. The bottom line is, Bibby was a pass first/shoot second PG while Francis was a shoot first/pass second PG. In my opinion, if Francis had accepted the SG role, I believe that Bibby would've fed him the ball often & that Francis would've averaged in the high 20's to low 30's per game for his entire career. I believe he had the talent to do that, but his ego wouldn't allow him to relinquish control of the ball to someone else. Averaging close to 30ppg would've made him a lock for the Hall of Fame. However, with only 1 playoff appearance (03/04 - 5 games) in his 9 years, I doubt he'll even get a sniff of the Hall of Fame now. Overall, I'm of the opinion that Francis's career has been a huge disappointment & waste, considering all the hype he received coming out of the draft & his incredible athleticism. Any thoughts or opinions? What do you think would've been different?
I always thought Franchise's biggest weakness wasn't his turnovers or BBIQ, it was the fact that he couldn't catch and shoot. He always had to take a dribble which prevents people from setting him up. He always had to create his own shot.
Francis in his prime = best player on a poor to slightly above average team. He was never going to lead a good team anywhere because he just isn't that good. Very few players are good enough to be the best on a great team while many can look good and put up numbers on teams with no other real talent. Unfortunately, his skill set requires him to dominate the ball and create his own shot making him unable to be a lesser player on a great team. It's a sad sort of situation that speaks to how unbalanced most NBA players are today. You give them a situation (playing second fiddle to a better player) that should make the game easier for them and they are ineffective. I see the same with Tmac although I still believe he might be good enough to be the best on a great team. Tmac's numbers are not as good with Yao on the court. He doesn't shoot a better percentage or grab more rebounds or play better defense despite having the game made "easier" for him because of the attention Yao demands. It is not from not wanting to be the second banana it is just that if these guys are not dominating the ball they don't know how to be effective.
Steve Francis known as 'Franchise' was a very entertaining player, till we selected Yao Ming. It then became evident that he was not a playmaker/ pass first Pointy Guard and was on the short side to be a great shooting Guard. Steve had and still does have many fans who remember his many remarkable drive and dunks at the basket.
I think you make some excellent points here. I just hope that coming back from his injury, that Steve can take control of the game with the second unit and be a point producer for us to give that punch we need off the bench. His driving with Battier's and Barry's spot of three point shooting would be deadly in the second unit, not to mention Landry and Deke/Dorsey cleaning up the boards. ( Just considering the complete second unit, although more than likely a starter could still be in there with them.)
Francis is and will always be one of my favorite players. You have a great point with him playing along side Bibby. "The Franchise" did some amazing things on the court , and yes it was a awesome to get a chance to see this kid light it up. I'm still rooting for him and admittedly, I was unhappy when he got traded. ...and IMO I had much more fun "not" seeing Stevie get out of the first round, than I have "not" seeing you no who "not' get out of the first round. Now we have both, so hopeful "this" Rockets team is gonna make some noise.
Playing alongside Bibby wouldn't have helped because of the lack of being able to catch and shoot. I think Steve had a very similar game to Dwayne Wade - only a little more fragile. Unfortunately, by the time the hand-check rule was instituted, he had lost his confidence, mojo, and some of his athletic ability. Btw, Steve wasn't a decent rebounder - he was a great rebounder for his position and size. However, even if he got the love from the refs that Dwayne Wade got, his clutch time decision making was Chris Webber-like. So yeah - Steve got about as much out of his career as you could expect. He got to the all-star game, got a max contract, got love from Houston because of his huge amount of heart, and got traded in one of the more lopsided trades in history.
Steve Francis, was a good rebounder, because he positioned himself for rebounds instead of getting into position to play the Point Guard Position. Thus there would be a delay in getting the ball down the court and the fact that Steve was a dribbler more so than a passer, when the ball arrived often it was too late to pass but just enough time for Steve to take his shot or go to the basket himself. All the Dribbling of the so called Point Guards of this era caused the coining of the title 'Dribblemania'.
Yetti I agree about the rebounding issue slowing the tempo, but a bit of the blame should be attributed to Rudy for the roster that he put around Francis.
Yup, exactly. I've always said Francis in his prime was essentially a slightly poor man's version of Wade. What Francis lacked in basketball IQ, discipline and those "take over a game" intangibles Wade lacked in a 3-point and durability. Wade is obviously a better player given his NBA elite status and resume but I think a lot of people take for granted how good Francis used to be. The best part is he's a complete wild card on this squad. We're already very good without him. Who knows how good we could become with his seemingly refined and more disciplined play? I just hope he wants it as bad as we all hope he wants it.
I think he would have been pretty much the same. The question is how good would he have been if he had learned the intricacies of the game better and how to make good decisions?
i'm not so sure bibby was necessarily pass first/shoot second, though i probably don't know enough to say for sure. you may be right on that. but yes, stevie was an elite scorer and on the rockets team he joined upon getting drafted, if i were him i woulda taken the most shots of that team too. i think a lot of people forget just how good he was in his prime though. against kobe bryant in the infamous "Yao vs Shaq I" game, he abused Kobe multiple times. And it's not like kobe wasn't a good defender then; he was still referred to as one of the best one on one defenders in the league at the time but stevie was blowing by him every single time and drawing fouls on shaq (also pretty much in his prime at the time?). francis' ability to get to the hole was so top notch that though he was never a spectacular passer, he still averaged around 5-6 assists a game throughout his career. i do however believe his passing is a tad bit underrated sometimes. in the few games he played in last year, he wow'd me with some of the passes he made. somehow, he and scola worked well together. don't get me wrong though ... there were plenty of holes in stevie's game. he did always have the tendency to always dribble into his shot. sometimes his decision making late in games was shaky. but at the same time, he stepped his game up in the playoffs like a true allstar does. In hindsight, it's hard to say what Francis could have been. After witnessing just how good he was, a part of me thinks that he could have really been something special. he wasn't going to be able to play lock down d (he himself admits that he's not put into the game for his defense), but what he could have been was that little pg that was reckless, fearless, and kept coming ala iverson. if the rockets can make use of francis' strengths this season, pair that with what we already know we have in tmac and yao, and if artest brings that toughness on both sides of the court that we hope for, and if (there's a lot of ifs) our core stays healthy, i'm thinking championship. I mean ... it's agreed that our pg position is possibly the weakest spot on our team (not dissing skip but just stating the facts in comparison to the other 4 positions). So if our pg can make the star pgs of other teams play d, then I think we got a good shot. And if we even get some of that francis that was abusing any defender that tried to stay in front of him, i don't see much of a weakness in our team this year. I mean think about it ... we pretty much can take teams like the hornets in every spot except the pg and sparingly the pf spots ... but if we have a pg that goes back at cp3, then ... man, who can stop us? this is a francis thread, but i'm hoping rafer also steps up his game and continues to improve his finishing around the rim. he was doing surprisingly well in midseason with that but suddenly returned back to normal it seems. But ya ... C'mon Stevie! It'd make a beautiful story to have you win a ring with us ... not to mention shut up the doubters that think you're nothing.
Isiah Thomas-Like [the player not the coach] Rocket River soon . . .the haters will come . . they cannot help themselves
With a better PG, Francis would benefited even if he can't catch and shoot because of fast-break opportunities. However, all the problems with his decisionmaking and lack of clutch-ness would still apply. He also didn't have a post game. Furthermore, as a SG, his lack of height on defense would have been exploited.
NO offense but..... Isiah like???? You're either crazy or have never seen Isiah Thomas play. Zeke was a pass first point guard who averaged 9.3 assists per game and could score @ will when required. Basically when you watch Chris Paul now - thats essentially what Isiah was. Just where do you see the similarities between Steve Francis (late 90s) to Chris Paul??? Even at his best, the Franchise was never going to develop "vision" other then the tunnel vision to the hole.
