Jeff , I notice plenty of times you jump on my post to debate some of the things I say, which is cool, thats the point of this board. Sometimes you agree,(very rarely ), but I don't have a problem with that. Here is one that you have to agree with me on, even crispee and behad have to give it up on this one. How can we possibly continue going through this season and not have Eddie Griffin starting? I was one of the few people that thought they should just throw him into the fire. Basketball is one of the most instinctive sports and normally it doesn't take players long to get into the flow, especially talented players like Eddie. I never thought he was a nfl qb, in which he has to watch and learn from the sidelines. Even early on, when he struggled, I still thought it was best to let him just play. Now he's getting into a groove , getting more playing time and producing. I'm still not happy. It is no way, other than being loyal to older players, that Eddie shouldn't be starting over someone. I don't care if its thomas or Williams, but he should be starting getting major minutes. Minutes like 35+ from the beginning. Just think how he could change the pace and tempo of the game at the outset. His production speaks for itself. The team picks up the defensive intesity, rebound the ball better and everything when he's in the game. Why can't we have that in the beginning when we come out flat. I know he's getting some minutes, but this guy is ready to explode into the stardom. All we need is for Rudy to just accept it and put walt on the bench.
Lee, I totally agree with you. Intially I had said he was getting the minutes and then I said look at the center position and then the SF position. I think it is ridiculous that Eddie is not starting and as I have said earlier, there is no justification for starting Walt. The only thing Walt could possibly be started for is his 3pt shooting and right now EG is money from there. More importantly however Eddie makes the team run by his own running and his rebounding and defense. Rudy is too damn stubborn. It is now clear to me that the chemistry is just fine between KT and EG. Why would Rudy pass on the opportunity to have the rebounding and defense of Cato, EG and KT? Of course Lee, Rudy may be playing Walt based on the money he is earning, which would be really unfortunate. How could EG play only 27 minutes?
It baffles me. I know Thomas is not a 3, but he's quicker than Rice and Walt. I think whats holding the plan back, is Rudy like playing the 3 guard lineup, which i don't like. Why does Steve and Cat have to play so many minutes? I mean I know Steve is the best player on the team, but maybe if you gave him some rest, then his to's might come down too. Torres has proven in his limited time that he can hold it down at the 2 for backup minutes, but Rudy first sub is normally Moochie and move Steve to off guard which i think is hindering him to becoming a pg somewhat. I know this about Griffins paying time, the kid is just amazing and is produceing with calmness and effortless seams. Walt just needs to be moved or go to the bench. Now here comes the "Mo Malone" Taylor supporters about to say they can't wait to see Eddie and Taylor together. What a joke.
The discussion gets kind of sloppy if we introduce labels. It is best that we say that KT and EG should be our starting forwards. Both guys can play both positions. Regarding the 3 guard rotation, I think it is being overused and should be more as an ace in the pocket. Last night was the kind of game where we should have had Tmo and or Torres getting valuable minutes to get into the flow. I know Rudy went with Tmo in the Utah game but he certainly missed an opportunity here. Steve had a migrane, rest the man! I believe he gave too much respect to Denver, as we were having was defensive problems; and most of that could have been because EG did not play in the 3rd Q, a travesty if I ever saw one. If EG had played the 3Q we may have had a 25 point lead, allowing any combination of Collier, Tmo and Torres to get some playing time. Afterall, we are heading east. Lee, why is it a joke on the Taylor? Explain that one.
Thoughout the entire 93-94 season (with the excepton of 5 games early in the season), Sam Cassell was clearly the better point guard over Kenny Smith, yet Smith was the starter. At one point, Smith was injured and Scottie Brooks got the starting assignment over Cassell. However, Cassell finished all the games. It was just something Rudy saw, bringing Cassell in against the other teams bench, that helped drive that team to the championship. Maybe Rudy sees the same type of chemisty here. Rudy is loyal to a fault. If we starting winning more and more with this rotation, it will be even harder for Griffin to crack the starting lineup. I believe that is Walt continues to stink it up, we'll see Oscar take over the starting 3 before Griffin will.
Behad, it is an interesting analogy. Probably a big difference here is that the team in not yet a world beater and starting EG is probably our best chance to be a world beater.
LBG, have always concurred on this point. Recall my thread "Please explain it to me like I'm a 4 year old" about Griffin not only not starting, but not even getting meaningful minutes early on. It's SOOO obvious that this kid has it, not only in his basketball skills, but in his instincts and court awareness. His production/minute is incredible...and with very few turnovers (unusual for rookie, not to mention one year out of HS). I know Rudy has his ways, but I think they have actually held up EG's development to date, not to mention a spot on the All Rookie team at All Star game. To watch Walt bumble and not guard anyone for full quarters at a time with EG on the bench is maddening. Doesn't matter whether you call him a 3,4 or 5, he deserves to start, and NOW!
Rock whats funny is that no matter what Thomas and Griffin do, people think Taylor is going to bring this incredible gift to this team. Thomas is putting up the same points, more rebs, yet Taylor is a better player because of his " deadly 15ft" shot. Griffin can go out and make his presence felt on both ends, yet people are saying he will be on the bench with the return of Taylor. Thats why I always say Mo Malone Taylor because thats who some people think he is. I don't have the exact stats, but his numbers are similar to Walts in his first 3 or 4 yrs. You may ask what does that have to do with it. I think they are parallel of each other. Very talented skilled players that can't or won't do what it takes to turn the corner. Thats how I viewed Walt and thats how I see Taylor. Griffin is another Thomas injury, which i hope doesn't happens, of grabbing that spot by the horns and locking it down for yrs to come. Could he and Taylor play together? I guess considering Garnett plays the 3,Van Horn plays the 3, and their are other teams that play the combo forwards. How effective they can do it depends on how Taylor comes back from a serious injury and if Rudy really will play them together. If Griffin is going to play along side another forward,mostly a 4, it would be nice to get him some practice now.
I think the most likely spot for Eddie to grab is the center spot. He played nearly ALL of his minutes (23 out of 27 minutes) at that slot last night, and he has shown he can thrive there offensively and defensively. Cato has played injury free this year. Considering the amount of injuries we've had, and how often he usually is injured, this is incredible. Walt is no longer getting minutes at the 4 like last year. Eddie nor KT has shown the ability to be a perimeter defender. That's why they don't play the 3/4 together, but the 4/5. (over 2/3 of Eddie's minutes came w/KT in the game, they play well together.) IMO, Eddie is being prepped for the starting center slot this year. The Rockets seem to be planning to take a look at him there. What they don't want to do, is ruin Cato's confidence. As silly as it seems, he has a fragile ego, and must be handled with care. Cato will have to play his way out.
I see Ratliff just got activated, i wish it was someway we could make a deal for him and get Cato out of town. Cato,Thomas,and Collier for Ratliff would be great. i doubt it would happen, but its would be a way to get rid of a large salary in Cato. Griffin and Ratliff at the 4,5 would allow our guards to pressur more and play the lanes more.
You're doing what I normally do and what crispee has caught me on a number of times. Who are these "people" you talk about? Well, let's just assume that I am one of them, cause I am excited to see a healthy Mo Taylor come back. I've never said anything about an incredible gift. I did notice, though, that at this point of the year last season, that team was better (not just recordwise, but overall better, assuming both teams are healthy). And Hakeem wasnt playing well at all yet. Why, because Taylor brought with him an offensive flow to the game that KT hasn't shown me yet - although Griffin is obviously a superior player to both of them. It was that flow, and Mo's quick starts, that consistently got the Rockets off to quick starts. Even in last night's game, we only had 19 points at the end of the first quarter and were winning by one. Last year, Taylor usually had 12 himself by the end of the first quarter. Granted he wouldnt do much the rest of the game, but I believe his overall talent was slightly higher, he would have brought an even bigger game this year being in as good a shape as he was when he got injured, and we would have seen a consistent 15 points, 6-7 boards out of him within the flow and rythm of the offense. You say in this thread yourself: I know you were talking baout Griffin. I think Griffin is hands down the best frontcourt player we have and should be starting. But why bring Mo into the argument, especially when it invalidates (is that a word?) your original point?
JayZ, Its many names, but I'm just talking about the ones in general that can't see Taylor for what he is. A mediocre power forward. When we played well, it was because Hakeem started playing well and everyone else kind of fell in line. This time last yr, we weren't playing like we were during that 16game stretch. I only brought Taylor up, before someone pulled his name out their ass. Yeah, he'll score 12 points early, i guess, so sticking with his avg, he'll hit 1 point the rest of the game? I just really like what Griffin brings to this team as far as his calm demenor and skills on the court. i don't have anything against Thomas or Taylor, I just think Griffin is the better player now and in the future. I'm no Ms Cleo, but looking at the games when he gets 30mins, they're pretty good.
Great then lets start Mooche and bring Steve off of the bench. That way steve could finish the games and everyone will be happy...right?
That's exactly why I like Mo. He gets his points in the flow of the game. KT demands the ball and won't pass out. Mo is perfect for Steve/Cat's penetrating games. Plus MoT brings added bulk that brings some intangibles against big teams. KT is nice when things go stale and we need some instance offense...sounds like a perfect bench player to me.
Have you guys considered that Rudy might be concerned with EG hitting the rookie wall? 82 games is a big jump from one year of college (30 games) & high school (20 games). That would explain why he's keeping the minutes down. If Rudy had played EG 30-40 minutes a game from the beginning, then it would be very likely that EG would've hit the wall by the time the playoffs got here & would be useless to the team. Rudy knows what he's doing. What's the big deal with EG starting anyway? He's getting starter minutes, or real close to it, & the team is showing signs of getting it's rotation down. As for Walt starting, it's all about respect. While I believe that Torres would be more effective at the SF position than Walt, I respect Rudy for being loyal to the veterans & you can bet your last dollar that the rookies have taken note of that as well. Crispee alluded to the fact that the rookies, that are hungry for more PT, realize that the only way they are going to unseat the veterans is by pushing them really hard. I also believe that they are very much aware that once they get the starting position, it's their's to lose.
I didn't make any of that up, or try to project my opinion as actual truths. I just stated an situation comparable to the EG situation. Why make fun of that? Too much hatin on this board.
Sorry for the delay in response. Been working all day. I don't think it is necessary to start EG if he continues to get the minutes he is getting. It isn't uncommon for Rudy to do that as others have pointed out with Sam Cassell, etc. I don't think the Rockets would bench Walt anyway for Griffin. Rudy has yet to play EG, KT and Cato at the same time. EG is either getting Cato or KT's minutes. I'm not personally convinced that KT would be ideally suited for the SF mainly because it takes away from his first step. The main reason he is so effective is because he is nearly always quicker than bigger power forwards meaning he can get to the basket by facing up, which is his favorite thing to do. In certain circumstances, it could work, but I don't think I'd want to see KT out there guarding Rashard Lewis or Lamar Odom. I just don't think that would make for a good matchup for the Rockets.
Jeff: I just posted in Woofer's thread why I think KT is our best SF prospect. You make some good points in your post, and I'm curious to know who you would rather see guarding Lewis or Odom? Thanks
Though this is not addressed to me, I think Tmo could guard Lewis or Odom better than any other Rocket. A funny statistic: If Tmo had played 48 mins in the last game, he would have had 0 pts., 36 rebs.
