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Hawking: Black Holes don't have event horizon

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by Ottomaton, Jul 16, 2004.

  1. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    Link

    Hawking Flips on Black Hole Theory
    By Discovery News
    July 16, 2004 — It may be time to shift thinking on black holes, for decades believed to be sucking maws in space from which even light cannot escape. Noted physicist Stephen Hawking, who has long argued just that, now says he was wrong: black holes may ultimately allow something to get free.

    According to New Scientist magazine, Hawking will present his latest theory to a conference next week.
    His about face might solve one of the longest-standing quandaries in quantum physics, called the black hole information paradox, the magazine said in its most recent issue.

    In 1976, Hawking said that a black hole starts radiating energy, losing mass as soon as it forms — so-called Hawking radiation. Once the black hole evaporates, he said, it's gone. But the theory doesn't account for the laws of quantum physics, which state that so-called information can never be completely destroyed. As an explanation, Hawking said the intense gravitational fields of black holes bend the laws to their wills.

    Now, Hawking is saying that black holes don't eat everything, according to New Scientist. They emit radiation for a long time before eventually opening up and allowing some information out.

    Gary Gibbons, a colleague of Hawkings' at Cambridge College, attended the lecture at which Hawkings revealed his new theory. He told New Scientist that unlike the decades-old black hole model, in the new model there is no clearly-defined event horizon that hides the information contained in black holes.

    The physics community is eager to see the math behind Hawkings' new theory.

    "It's possible that what he presented in the seminar is a solution," Gibbons said. "But I think you have to say the jury is still out."
     
  2. MadMax

    MadMax Member

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    if what he's saying is true, then i still...don't...care.

    :)
     
  3. nyquil82

    nyquil82 Member

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    I never realized that Hawking was such a mo taylor fan....
     
  4. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    Luddite! :p
     
  5. MadMax

    MadMax Member

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    i readily admit i have no idea what that means!
     
  6. TraJ

    TraJ Member

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    I wouldn't apply it until he comes out with a Service Pack.
     
  7. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    additional story from space.com

    LONDON (AP) -- After almost 30 years of arguing that a black hole swallows up everything that falls into it, astrophysicist Stephen Hawking backpedaled Thursday. In doing so, he lost one of the most famous bets in recent scientific history.

    The world-famous author of a "Brief History of Time" said he and other scientists had gotten it wrong _ the galactic traps may in fact allow information to escape.

    "I've been thinking about this problem for the last 30 years, and I think I now have the answer to it," Hawking told the British Broadcasting Corp.'s "Newsnight" program.

    "A black hole only appears to form but later opens up and releases information about what fell inside. So we can be sure of the past and predict the future."

    The findings, which Hawking is due to present at the 17th International Conference on General Relativity and Gravitation in Dublin, Ireland, on July 21, could help solve the "black hole information paradox," which is a crucial puzzle of modern physics.

    Exactly what happens in a black hole -- a region in space where matter is compressed to such an extent that not even light can escape from its immense gravitational pull -- has long puzzled scientists.

    Black holes occur when a massive star burns up its nuclear fuel and gravity forces it to collapse in on itself, and the enormous weight of the star's outer layers implodes its core. The crushing force of gravity prohibits nearly all light from escaping and nothing inside can be glimpsed from the outside.

    The star virtually disappears from the universe into a point of infinite density, a place where the laws of general relativity that govern space and time break down.

    Hawking has devoted most of his life to studying these questions.

    Initially, cosmologists believed the holes were like a cosmic vacuum cleaner, sucking up everything in their path.

    Hawking revolutionized the study of the holes when he demonstrated in 1976 that, under the strange rules of quantum physics, once black holes form they start to "evaporate" away, radiating energy and losing mass in the process.

    Under this theory, black holes are not totally "black" because the vacuum of the imploding star lets out very tiny amounts of matter and energy in the form of photons, neutrinos and other subparticles.

    By conjuring up this so-called "Hawking radiation," the Cambridge mathematician, who is paralyzed by amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, also created one of the biggest conundrums in physics.

    These particles, he said, contained no information about what has been occurring inside the black hole, or how it formed. Under his theory, once the black hole evaporates, all the information within would be lost.

    But now, according to his latest revision, Hawking argues that eventually some of the information about the black hole can be determined from what it emits.

    The information has important philosophical and practical consequences.

    "We can never be sure of the past or predict the future precisely," he said. "A lot of people wanted to believe that information escaped from black holes but they didn't know how it could get out."

    Hawking did not elaborate on the BBC program how the information could be extracted from the black hole.

    Curt Cutler, from the Albert Einstein Institute in Golm, Germany, which is chairing the meeting in Dublin, told New Scientist magazine that Hawking asked at the last minute for permission to address the conference.

    "He sent a note saying `I have solved the black hole information paradox and I want to talk about it,"' Cutler said.

    If Hawking succeeds in making his case, he will lose a bet that he and theoretical physicist Kip Thorne of the California Institute of Technology made with John Preskill, also of Caltech.

    The terms of the bet were that "information swallowed by a black hole is forever hidden and can never be revealed."
     
  8. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    Try Wikipedia
     
  9. Surfguy

    Surfguy Member

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    Does this mean in the movie "The Black Hole" when they fly into the black hole and come out the other end...that this is now actually possible? :D

    My mind is too weak to understand the implications of such a finding. :p

    So, some info does get out. If the Earth is ever consumed by a black hole, then we can feel safe that something of Earth will eventually get out. LOL.

    Boy, the implications of this boggles the mind. THIS WILL CHANGE THE WORLD AS WE KNOW IT! Hmm...back to whatever I was doing before this news. :rolleyes:
     
  10. MadMax

    MadMax Member

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    ok..but i still don't get it.

    i do like that i learned what a luddite is, though! :)
     
  11. mateo

    mateo Member

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    So much for capturing a black hole, using it to power my spacecraft, and then traveling to the edge of the expanding universe to discover that beyond what has been created is actually HELL.
     
  12. caphorns

    caphorns Member

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    I thought a black hole occured after you passed the ball to either Steve or Cat on the fast break? I really have to rethink this now. Damn you Hawking! Damn you!
     
  13. PhiSlammaJamma

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    I am going to note my theory here once again, that black holes are nothing more than polymerases, which destroy genetic material for the purposes of recombining it on the other side. Thankyou Stephen Hawking. I am way ahead of my time ;).

    In my theory, the only way to fly into a black hole and come out the other side safely would be if you had the correct chemical structure or attached yourself to something that did, If not, you would be destroyed by the blackhole or polymerase as I like to call it.
     
  14. outlaw

    outlaw Member

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    "Larry Flint is right!"
     
  15. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    In your face, space coyote.
     
  16. Oski2005

    Oski2005 Member

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    Hawking is such a flip flopper. . .
     
  17. Dr of Dunk

    Dr of Dunk Clutch Crew

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    Great articles Otto. This is a hell of a discovery (if accepted by the scientific community).
     
  18. mbiker

    mbiker Member

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    The information that Stephen Hawking is giving us is going in one ear and out the other. Wait …..Now I get it.
     
  19. MR. MEOWGI

    MR. MEOWGI Contributing Member

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    What a dumbass. :rolleyes:
     
  20. Fatty FatBastard

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    According to the Screenplay "Black Hole 2, The Purging", Maximillion gets out, Old Bob does not.
     

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