Commentary: Young stars don't impress Heat vets By Chris Perkins Palm Beach Post Staff Writer Sunday, November 06, 2005 MIAMI — Center Alonzo Mourning and guard Gary Payton undeniably are the go-to guys for the Heat. Not on the court, because those days are gone for Miami's resident graybeards. But off the court, when it comes to basketball issues, Mourning, 35, and Payton, 37, are money. You can include 33-year-old center Shaquille O'Neal in that group, too, but to a lesser extent. He's not always as outspoken as his fellow old-heads. Anyway, on this day, the topic was the young stars of the NBA, the so-called "Next Generation." And it's unanimous. Mourning, Payton and O'Neal are unimpressed. There's almost no one playing today whom the future Hall of Famers enjoy watching. "I come from the era where you get your numbers and you make everybody look good," O'Neal said. "Now these guys are just worried about their numbers, their fame and their commercials and all that. Guys that do all that And-1 (stuff). I'm not impressed. I won't let my sons watch it. At all." If you think this is just another episode of old guys reminiscing about the old days, you're wrong. They simply prefer players with complete games. Mention players such as Cleveland's LeBron James, Phoenix's Amare Stoudemire and Miami's Dwyane Wade, and Mourning literally laughs. "Those guys, come on, man," he said, partly amused, partly offended. "They still have a long way to go. They've had a couple of good seasons. Longevity. That's when you earn respect in this league. When you do it for long periods of time." It's not that Payton, Mourning and O'Neal don't respect today's players. They play alongside Wade, who many believe is the most talented youngster in the game, and acknowledge his skills. They just don't think many of today's players measure up to their contemporaries. "I've seen the Michael Jordans, the Larry Birds, Dominique Wilkins, Magic Johnson — they put on shows," Payton said. "The young guys have a lot of talent. There's a lot of them that can put the ball up and score and stuff like that, but it was different with those type guys because they did everything. "Jordan did everything, Magic, Bird. You've got some of these young guys out here that are one-dimensional. There's only about three or four that can do everything. LeBron is one. Dwyane is starting to put that in his game. But the rest of them, the Tracy McGradys, they're the scorers." It's strange that the NBA has arrived at such a spot. None of the other major sports does a better job of keeping today's stars in touch with yesterday's stars. At All-Star Weekend and the NBA Finals, it's common to find the greats from the past visiting with wide-eyed young players, handing down knowledge and passing on secrets. But maybe the young guys aren't taking the words to heart. O'Neal said he likes to watch James, Wade, Philadelphia's Allen Iverson, Minnesota's Kevin Garnett and San Antonio's Tim Duncan, who O'Neal refers to as "Mr. Duncan." On the other hand, Duncan and O'Neal are the only players Mourning enjoys watching. "I've played against the best, some of the top 10 players ever to play this game," Mourning said. "I don't think any of the players in this league right now can compare to any of the players I've had experience playing against." As Mourning speaks, you get the feeling there's more going on here than just a generation gap. He seems to be speaking partly out of pride, partly out of defiance and partly out of old age. Perhaps O'Neal, Payton and Mourning all look in the mirror and see the inevitable end of their careers. And as the phrase says: "Objects in mirror might be closer than they appear." Still, for the most part, they don't like what they see with the NBA's next generation. "You've got a bunch of damn scorers," Mourning said with disgust. "Which is fine, but show me something else. Show me what I haven't seen. I've seen all that." -------------- GP must not have been paying any attention to us at all last year, which doesn't surprise me (what NBA player has time to watch other teams?), but then why make a comment like that?
to GP and AM: jealousy will get you nowhere. and i thought shaq and mcgrady were cool. doesn't look to me like wade is putting a complete game together. they are just taking up for their boy. mcgrady has much more of a complete game than wade.
GP/Mourning: In my day, we used to dribble five miles uphill in the snow, both ways in order to get up and down the court.
GP is such an ass. Never liked him. I wish he would retire and get out of the news already. Stop riding teams in hopes of a ring...loser.
GP, lol, one of the players who will remain in mediocracy after their career ends, No one will remember you GP, you will be an average point gaurd who couldnt do anything to help bring a title to you your team.... Even if Tmac dont win a title ever, hell atleast be remembered for this and he got a move dedicated to him in video games forever T-Mac's All-Star Game Backboard Toss Click the C-stick to throw the ball off the backboard in an All-Star game then tap B.
payton's an idiot...neways i think the article edited shaq's list of players he likes to watch, he used to say he liked to watch tmac.........but since payton dissed tmac, they probably left him off shaq's list to make more sense
These guys are the same generation as the players they're dissing. The game has not changed that much in the last 10 years. They just sound like old grumpy fools. Shaq is so full of it too. I saw him on Stephan A. Smith's show the other day talking about how his kids must have leaned how to play hoops from watching "And-1, Tracy McGrady..." because he has not taught them anything. Here he says he won't allow his kids to watch And-1 But you do have to agree that there is alot of self-serving in the NBA.
Well, they are not all wrong... as they use MJ, Bird and Magic as reference for a 'complete' player.... the standard is very high.
these guys are just stuck in the past. they are bitter about not winning any championships. longevity is great but who cares that u last 25 years in the league yet win not ONE single championship. If u go that long playing and not acheive the ultimate goal then the incomplete player must be you. YOU obviously arent the complete player, or atleast good enough to help the team win a championship. GP and Zo are just being stupid and talking out of their old asses. " i remember when a basketball cost us a nickel! " mourning exclaimed
payton and mourning look like complete douche bag idiots in this article. funny he mentions t-mac as just a scorer when he's probably the most complete player in the game, or atleast up there with anyone else.
I guess that's why McGrady has a career average of about 4 or 5 assists per game, because he's a scorer. Considering Payton's reputation you would think he would shut his mouth. Iverson is unselfish but McGrady is a selfish scorer!? Idiots.
The way I see it, regular season stats are almost completely irrelevant when it comes to comparing who were the best of the best. T-mac has the complete package but hasn't won a series (yet). When he starts to win championships then we can begin to compare him to the all-time greats. But until that, he is just another talented and productive player, just as Zo and GP once were, who hasn't win a thing in this league. Dwayne Wade, on the other hand, has basicly carried his team deep in the playoffs twice already in his short career. If not for his injury last playoffs, who knows what could have happened. He has earned some respect by winning games when it counts. T-mac is well aware of all of this and I think this is his main motivation to play. He doesn't care about scoring titles, who has the most commercials on tv, who dunks best etc. He could have kept playing on mediocre teams, racking points and regular season awards. But instead he chose us. He just wants to win. Period. And that's why he came here, to show to all his doubters that he truly is something special and not just another talented baller who never wins.
I don't know if T-Mac is in Jordan's league. I do know, however, that GP is nowhere near either of them.
They also used Dominique Wilkins as an example of a complete player. I checked the definition for one dimensional player in the dictionary and found a picture of Dominique. Kenny Smith was a defensive stopper compared to Dominique. T-Mac is a true 5 tool player (to borrow a phrase from baseball) in today's game. He does it all...period. As I recall Shaq was knocked quite a bit when he first came into the league as being a one trick pony of sorts on offensive, not able to score from outside 5 feet. He has never been a defensive juggernaut and someone of his skill should have at least learned to shoot a free throw by now. What is really funny about all of this is that I have always considered the 90's (Shaq, GP and Mournings generation) to be the very most boring group of players of all time. The 80's which gave up Magic, Bird, Jordan and Dream was the golden era of basket ball while the only thing worth paying attention to in the 90's were MJ and Dream (two players drafted in the golden era), everything else was slow it down defensive boring ass basketball. It wasn't until players like KG, T-Mac, Lebron and Wade started coming of age that the game has started to regain some semblance of the sport it use to be. We will never see an era like the 80's again in basketball but I certainly think the sport is more fun to watch now than it was in the slow it down 90's.
This article is funny. Payton is such a loser, just hanging on to try to win a ring. It is so pathetic. And like someone else mentioned, these guys mention Dominique Wilkins as one of the greats - a player who is NOT even in the top 50 greatest players of all-time and embodied the one-dimensional type player. Hell, McGrady reminds me a lot of Dominique except TMac has a more complete game. Yet, he doesn't excite assholes like Payton and Mourning but Nique did. I am afraid that until McGrady can lead a team out of the first round of the playoffs, we are always going to hear stupid talk like this.
Let me get this straight: McGrady is not a complete player? LOL! If he isn't, then no one is in the whole damn league. Instead of hating, he should cite examples/proof to back up his claim, which is destroyed when you examine the evidence. Loser riding the coattails of Shaq once more, since it didn't work in Miami. Would like to hear McGrady comment about this.
