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fwiw: Harden actually is equally efficient to Durant, so far.

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by heypartner, May 1, 2019.

  1. heypartner

    heypartner Member

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    Is Durant actually what's beating us?
    • Durant is reported to be putting up AMAZING numbers, and
    • Harden is supposed to be sucking, but actually,
    • They are in a statistical tie for efficiency and overall scoring

    • If they put up equal efficiency numbers, can we find a way to win? Because they are.
    now the ongoing rebounding issue, and those Game 2 TOs...'nother story.

    Is Durant really putting up more efficient numbers -- by far?

    This table looks in wildly in favor of Durant, because we are trained to only look at FG% and 3P% and not consider volume of 2s v 3s.
    • Durant has only made 2 more shots than Harden on same FGAs, but Harden has put up much more 3s.
    • Pretty amazing they have identical points and FGAs. That makes the comparison easier.

    PlayerFGFGA3P3PAFTFTATOVPFPTSFG%3P%FT%MPPTS
    Kevin Durant20474920259764.426.444.80043.632.0
    James Harden1847723212310764.383.304.91336.532.0
    ==============================================================
    • Now this table is a statistical tie. eFG% is like one shot apart.
    • You simply can't argue this math, otherwise.
    • You take away Durant's Two Technical Foul shots v Harden's 0 attempts, and the ORtg is probably even identical.

    PlayerTS%eFG%AST%TOV%ORtgDRtgGmSc
    James Harden.560.45731.114.910511319.5
    Kevin Durant.552.46813.313.410711218.7

     
    #1 heypartner, May 1, 2019
    Last edited: May 1, 2019
    luckyman76, bilaal14, LUK3 and 28 others like this.
  2. LosPollosHermanos

    Supporting Member

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  3. James.B.H

    James.B.H Member

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    Exactly. Harden played two mediocre games at his standard, but Durant wasn't that great either, that was not our problem.

    I have been saying this throughout the playoffs, Chris Paul's inability to lead our second squad, which is supposed to be deep and better than the opponent's, to even hold the score, is a much bigger problem than Harden's "inefficiency". Our offensive rating when Harden is off court and Paul is on court is miserable.
     
  4. Bo6

    Bo6 Member

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    eye test.....

    no pun intended
     
  5. basketballholic

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    Our starting 5 is who is getting roasted against the Hampton 5.
     
  6. basketballholic

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    My observation is that Durant, although still dominant, had not been real good in these playoffs. His shot selection is Westbrook level atrocious. Way too many forced long 2's and contested 3's. But when he's playing with the best shooting backcourt of all time and beside one of the greatest defenders ever AND he's a seven footer that can shoot over the top of everybody it doesn't really matter.
     
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  7. LosPollosHermanos

    Supporting Member

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    This is the problem with the rockets mentality , who told you that those twos are a bad shot? He is adding points to the score board and consistently in a dominant fashion. He is getting rings. Those shots you think are bad have been incorporated in every NBA champions blueprint. The rockets reliance on a high variance shot and the keys in the Hands of the officials has 0 finals appearances. Instead of arrogance, this organization needs to be humbled and look forward on how to improve. We have too many idiots like you that don’t have a fundamental grasp on stats. As someone that I publishes papers using statistics frequently I can attest to the fact that the majority of people on this site don’t understand how/why they’re crunching numbers and why context is key.
     
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  8. jordnnnn

    jordnnnn Member

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    They don’t make an eye roll gif big enough for what was just posted.
     
  9. rocks123

    rocks123 Member

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    its really the rebounding and TOs thats killing us. i mean even GSWs score aint that great.They are a team that can score 120+ even in a loss. they are also abysmal and playing below expectation. but were the one losing because we departed from our identity. WE ARE SUPPOSED TO BE A VOLUME SHOOTING TEAM. and yet GSW hoisted more shot than us. thats unacceptable.
     
  10. heypartner

    heypartner Member

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    fwiw:

    Game 1
    Starters v H5 = -3
    Others v H5 = +5
    ------------------------
    Rockets +2 vs H5

    Game 2
    Starters v H5 = -7 (largely due to a 5-10 start of game due to horrific TOs = -5 1Q)
    Others v H5 = -6
    ------------------------
    Rockets -13 v H5

    Since they are playing perfectly 24 minutes (half game) each game, so far, I suppose you can double those outcomes for a per/game thingie.
     
    #10 heypartner, May 1, 2019
    Last edited: May 1, 2019
  11. heypartner

    heypartner Member

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    -.-
     
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  12. riko

    riko Member

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    Hardens issue in this series especially in game one was the threes. He stopped jacking them up in game 2 and walla his percentage improved. He also attacked the basket more in the last quarter which was impressive given he was operating with one good eye.

    There is absolutely no one on this planet that can stop Harden when he attacks the rim. He was punishing Klay and Iggy in the last quarter. It is infuriating that he has that weapon in his vast arsenal but he sometimes falls in love with the three to much
     
    #12 riko, May 1, 2019
    Last edited: May 1, 2019
  13. rockets11206

    rockets11206 Member

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    as you said, the issue is the midget that we are paying 40 million dollars who is being outplayed by similar aged Andre Igoudala. Cp has to be superstar Cp for us to win this series and that's just obvious. As of now he is playing like a role player and is probably our 3rd best player just due to Capela's complete lackluster performance. Despite it all we still had the opportunity to win both games, but to push this series to 6 he will have to become chris paul of last year, or maybe i'm just delusional thinking something that we've been all waiting for.
     
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  14. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

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    HP, tell Matt Moore



     
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  15. Mathloom

    Mathloom Shameless Optimist

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    On Harden vs Durant, that's an interesting comparison but I have to say Durant chose when and how to get his, and it was exactly when his team needed it. I'd give him the slight edge so far in the series.

    All we need is for Paul to take care of the ball a bit more/better, and Capela to secure it more/better. We would be at least 1-1 with just that happening.

    Our guys didn't play like champions to be honest. The moment was too big for them. Harden and Paul have not displayed what it takes for superstars on an underdog to overthrow a dynasty. It's asking for a lot, but we have always known that's what it would take. Their average play was never going to be enough.
     
  16. heypartner

    heypartner Member

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    I mean, dude. They have both scored 64 points on exact same amount of shots, and exact same FTAs (KD 2 more due to Techs). Harden in 14 less minutes.

    Why does "He is adding points to the score board" count for KD but not JH...when they are identical at both the most simplistic stats measure (FGs, FTs, PTs) and the TS%/eFG%/ORtg measure, too.
     
  17. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Member

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    In this series, I'm struck by the thing about Durant that I'm always struck by when I watch him play -- as great as he's been, he should be dominating more than he does. He's tall, he's long, he's athletic, he's surprisingly nimble for his size, he has a great jumper that goes out to the arc, he can play inside, he can defend. But he seems to disappear for minutes at a time. His usage this season is 29%. Harden's is 40.5%. Granted Harden leads all players by a country mile, but Durant is #20 with a lot of other big guys in front of him.
     
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  18. Handles

    Handles Member

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    deleted. Misread. Thought FGA was 2PA.
     
  19. ROXTXIA

    ROXTXIA Member

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    OP, I don't think there is anyone here you need to convince.

    Maybe send this in a letter or email to Brian Windbag at BSPN.
     
  20. napalm06

    napalm06 Huge Flopping Fan

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    What's killing us is team fundamentals like missed box outs, lazy lob turnovers, and covering back door cuts. Not James "bloody eyes" Harden.
     
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