Francis controled the early tempo and scored and dished at will. He had five assists in the first few minutes. The whole defense was gearing up on containing him...then the arrival of Rudys Moochie. Francis is finished. The ball never touches his hands. Steve Francis never brought the ball up one time when Moochies was in the game. For 24 minutes Moochie controled the game with his decisons. if his isolation herky-jekiness fails while the shot-clock winds down he'll pass. Francis played an astounding 47 minutes last night while taking 15 shots. Mocchie Norris plays half that time(24min) and takes only 4 shots less(11). How many other starting point guards are forced to completely concede to their backups while on the court at the same time with them? What does this say to Francis and the rest of the team? ------------------ [This message has been edited by ROCKETBOOSTER (edited December 09, 2000).]
Francis 3, you do not understand me. I've giving up on our big-men. The only real hope we have left against serious competition is if Steve Francis pulls a Isiah Thomas on a Chris Webber. All defenses must stay on their toes trying to contend with Steve Francis not Moochie Norris. It works out better like that in the long run. ------------------
rocketbooster: Oh, c'mon, you know what I'm talking about. When Mooch comes in, he's coming as the PG. Steve (or Cat) moves over to SG. Anderson (if he's there) moves to SF. Steve's natural place is at SG - as a scorer. I'm not saying that he can't run the point - he can, pretty well. The assists point to that. Make no mistake, I think Steve's a great PG. But when Mooch takes point and Steve moves to SG, that's when Steve can score 30+ and not have to worry about distributing the ball. You know that. ------------------
I think ROCKETBOOSTER's point is that Steve is not a scoring threat when Mooch comes in becaues Steve does not have the ball and Moochie really isn't passing the rock. Mochie just isolates and Stevie is left standing around watching him try to break down the D. Maybe it would be different if Moochie spent more time running plays designed to get Steve the ball instead of isolating. ------------------
But when Moochie takes point and Steve moves to shooting guard thats when Steve can score 30+ and not have to worry about distrubuting the ball. Hows that? Moochie must pass the ball to Steve or even Cuttino first for that to happen. Instead Moochies rely's on his one-on-one isolations that don't command double teams which allow defenses to sigh. I have no problem with having Moochie coming in and giving Steve a 8-10 minute breather. But handing him the controls for 24 minutes is unjustifiable. Moochie, actaully takes away from Francis and Mobleys productivity. Anderson alongside Francis and Mobley is much more effective. ------------------ [This message has been edited by ROCKETBOOSTER (edited December 09, 2000).]
Uuuhh... (gears start to turn) Yes, I think I'm starting to understand the problem: when Mooch comes in, he doesn't pass it to Steve enough. Right? Come to think of it, you're right. Mooch does spend alot of time isolating. I guess I'm looking at the ideal - the way it's supposed to happen - instead of reality. Well, let's dump the guy then... All this tells me is that they need more practice. Mooch should look at passing to Steve more. Although in all fairness, they aren't on the court together as much as it might seem (Mooch is Steve's relief, after all) - he's more likely to assist to Cat or a forward. ------------------
i think Mooch is a quality backup but I would have to agree that from what I've seen if the rockets go small ball they should have a lineup of francis/mobley/anderson opposed to moochie/francis/mobley ------------------ www.truebballfansite.homestead.com
"francis/mobley/anderson" is the ideal situation. If Shandon doesn't show up, though, "moochie/francis/mobley" is probably a better idea. We have options either way... ------------------
treeman, you need some some oil. Moochie doesn't need to pass the ball to Francis- HE-SHOULDNT-HAVE-THE-DAMN-BAll!!-in the first place. ------------------
That's kinda unavoidable if he's playing point, isn't it? Please, spell it out for me. What am I missing? ------------------
Any of ya'all critcal of Moochie's game must have either just started watching the Rockets last night or have a some unexplainable fixation to point blame after every loss. Moochie's numbers were almost identical to the Dallas game. I didn't hear any whining then. Why now? Moochie's numbers have dropped off in the last couple of games, but his TO/assist ratio was triple Steve's about 2 games ago (before all the injuries to our bigger players forced Steve to play more SG). I'll take 14 points on 5 of 11 in 24 minutes ANY game from my backup point guard. ------------------ GATER [This message has been edited by GATER (edited December 09, 2000).]
Francis needs complete control of the offense at all times, even when Moochies in. For 24 minutes last night Moochie ran the offense while Francis ran it for about 23. If thats unavoidable then...T-I-M-B-E-R! When Moochies in the game anytime other than giving Steve a breather on the bench the offense should be run through Francis. [This message has been edited by ROCKETBOOSTER (edited December 09, 2000).]
Judge Gater-- I don't think anyone is blaming Mooch for anything. It is completely valid to critique an offensive flow that neutralizes your number one threat. In my OPINION, Booster's observation is a timely one given the amount of criticism Francis is attracting for not being more aggressive on offense. If you can't see this then maybe YOU haven't been watching any games. "I'll take 14 points on 5 of 11 in 24 minutes ANY game from my backup point guard. " That's right. In a BACKUP role. Not in lieu of your starter for most of the 4th quarter. ------------------
I've always maintained that Moochie was a steal. Ever since the first time I saw him play in a Rox uni, I knew this guy fit our game to a T. He's fast, a good ballhandler, he can steal, he can pass... He's an excellent PG. He works his ass off. Lately I've noticed he has a nice floater, too. Really, rocketbooster, what am I missing here? I've already admitted you're right that he should pass to Steve more. I'll go a step further and admit he shouldn't get as much time as he has been getting lately - IF Anderson is playing well (but only if). He's a good backup PG (not great, but good), and when he and Steve are in together - theoretically - that should allow Steve to score more (or Cuttino). What else is there? ------------------
I agree with ROCKETBOOSTER to a certain extent. I love havin Mooch as our backup PG, and he is capable of scoring and dishing really well. Mooch SHOULD have the ball in his hands a lot, and COULD be a capable starter. BUT, Francis was having his way early on. If a player is dominating like Francis was doing last night early on, then you should still continue to give him the ball. And that did not happen. When Mooch came in, they should have kept on going to Francis. This is reminiscent of a few games ago when Taylor was on fire in the beginning, but we stopped going to him later on, and instead played Kenny T.(who was playin much worse than Mo) the entire 4th quarter. ------------------ da ability to focus attention on important things is a defining characteristic of intelligence - alaskanSnowman [This message has been edited by alaskansnowman (edited December 09, 2000).]
"Francis needs complete control of the offense at all times" Who the hell EVER has control of the offense at all times? There are 5 players out there, not 1. Every single play works off opportunity, to an extent. Might I remind you that Steve tried earlier to "control" the offense before the last Denver game, and it was a pretty dismal failure. Sometimes we need Steve to score, and not play general. When that happens, let Mooch play general so Steve can score. When both Steve and Cuttino are free to score - that's probably nearly half our points right there. Let them alternate on PG like they're supposed to. And let Steve move to SG when he should. ------------------
tremman - i'll say no more after this until more games are played. When Francis and Moochie are in the game at the same time Francis should have the option of giving the ball to Moochie not Norris having the option to giving the ball to Francis. If I can hold down on the Michelobs through tonights game I'll chart down how many times Francis and Norris each bring the ball across the half-court line. Then I'll record the efficiency rate through each posession -Whether there was a score or an a assist. ------------------ [This message has been edited by ROCKETBOOSTER (edited December 09, 2000).]
also... "When Moochies in the game anytime other than giving Steve a breather on the bench the offense should be run through Francis" After a while the opposing team is going to start double-teaming Steve. When that happens we have a really hard time running anything through him. And when your PG can't get a pass off because he's surrounded or gets all his passing lanes covered, you're screwed. Bring in Mooch, and they have to either shift their defense away from Steve or leave Moochie open (you alluded to this earlier) - which is how he scores. It either takes pressure off Steve (or someone else) and forces them to go 1 on 1 all around, or it leaves Moochie open to score. ------------------
"i'll say no more after this until more games are played..." OK. I can live with that. Actually, I look forward to the results. I expect Glove to tire them both out... But let the numbers speak ------------------
JeffB - respectfully disagree. In this thread and several others, rocketbooster has been painting a picture of Moochie Norris being a ballhog and depriving Steve Francis of shots. It's just not true and you can not find one piece of statistical evidence to support this. The "Moochie as ballhog" argument is totally based on the Kings game. This is a game where injury and illness reduced the Rockets to NO inside presence and the 2-13 3pt% (including 0-4 from Steve) reduced the Rockets to NO outside game. Steve was only shooting 40% and being played well by the Kings defense. IMHO, using the Kings game as an evaluation of Moochie's season is totally inaccurate. ------------------ GATER
