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Could Novak be our PF of the future?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by crash5179, Jul 4, 2006.

  1. JeopardE

    JeopardE Contributing Member

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    And how many top 10 picks have we had since JVG started coaching the Rockets?
     
  2. thunderkyss

    thunderkyss Member

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    You see, what I never liked about this inside outside game crap, is that your jumpshooter has to be hitting, or you'll be giving up the long rebounds....

    If his shot isn't there, we need a guy who can put it on the floor, and make his way to the basket..... requiring the defender to get help, and opening someone up under the basket.

    Novak may be that guy....... he might not beat Ron Artest or Bruce Bowen on the dribble, but he's got to be able to beat the so-so defenders, like Walker, Battier, Haslip... which is yet to be seen..... but if he can make guys like that a liability on there team, then we'll be in good shape.
     
  3. lazybum234

    lazybum234 Member

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    I'm actually really encouraged with the Novak-Chambers comparison, but my main concern is that the league is somewhat different from in the 80's and when Chambers was having his day. I mean sure Magic's Showtime could remind one of the Mavs and Suns of today, but I guess my overall impression is that players are overall more athletic. So while Chambers might have been able to get it done with clutch shooting and good team defense, maybe it won't be enough for Mr. Novak.

    Hopefully i'm wrong and Novak will be part of the solution for years to come...
     
  4. enbehay

    enbehay Member

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    Rudy Gay.

    The Rockets generally try to avoid being a lottery team. However, when we are, we generally make good choices (Lucas, Hakeem, Ming, Horry, etc.) although we have gone nutzo (Roderick Rhodes comes to mind) on occasion. And who can forget Eddie Griffin.

    But you are avoiding my question about JVG's track record on rookies. I can't see where he has EVER made a rookie into a starter. He has a rep for working only with veterans (old ones at that).

    I made a mistake earlier -- JVG wasn't the Knicks head coach when Ewing was drafted. However, your precious Phil Jackson played Kobe Bryant (#13 IIRC) immediately and Dwayne Wade (#5) stepped up right away. Don't forget the Carmelo Anthony's etc etc. ad nauseum.
     
  5. m_cable

    m_cable Contributing Member

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    Novak weighed in at the pre-draft combine at 216 lbs. Two Hundred Sixteen pounds. Even Bullard and Padgett played at 230-240. If those guys have 15-25 lbs on Novak then I really don't want to see him in action against any starting caliber PF's in the league.

    I'm sure he's been working out and filling up on protein shakes and such in order to bulk up for the draft. Well it looks like it hasn't been that successful. A lot of guys just struggle putting on weight. I bet he's one of them. And his frame doesn't look big enough to handle much more weight anyway.
     
  6. enbehay

    enbehay Member

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    I understand your point. However, think about this. Swift weighed 220. Some posters think Shane Battier will be the PF (at 220 lbs). Howard plays at 230 lbs.

    We may be looking at a new "twin-SF" offense if JVG could think offensively rather than defensively.
     
  7. m_cable

    m_cable Contributing Member

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    Like I said, you've got to have length and athleticism to compensate for being a bit light in the shorts. Stromile has that, and as for Battier, we'll see how he does at PF.

    But not only is Novak a bit undersized in terms of weight, but he's got a very short wingspan. One of the worst wingspans in the draft class considering his height. So he'll play smaller than his listed height.

    Add it all together, and I don't have any confidence that Novak will play any more than spot minutes at the PF spot.

    Like I said, his best chance to succeed will be at SF. The post up guys won't be as hard to defend as PF's, and the off the dribble guys shouldn't be as quick as SG's. Doesn't mean he will be able to defend the position, but it's probably his best shot.
     
  8. JeopardE

    JeopardE Contributing Member

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    Rudy Gay hasn't seen an NBA basketball court yet. The Rockets want to win now. You can go into that argument if you wish but that's beside the point. If you want to talk about Gay then you can consider that JVG said he would have played him (but of course you don't believe him because he's JVG).

    Walter McCarty? Maybe he doesn't get a lot of good rookies because he had never missed the playoffs until last season?

    My precious? When did I give you the impression that I liked Phil? And
    #1. Kobe wasn't drafted by the Lakers
    #2. Phil wasn't head coach of the Lakers when Kobe was drafted. In fact, by the time PJ joined the Lakers, Kobe was already a 3-year veteran.
    #3. Dwayne Wade was a #5 draft pick in one of the greatest draft classes ever (2003). You just made my point. Or you want to begin to list all the superstars in the class of '03?

    You can reach all you want, but it's no use. Like I said, no coach in his right mind would give a rookie heavy minutes over a veteran unless there was a major talent advantage there. More often than not, the only teams where you find rookies starting are bottom-of-the-order teams like Toronto and Portland. And even then, they'll usually wait a year if they have a veteran they can play instead. Stop trying to paint this as some sort of JVG flaw, when all it is is common basketbal sense.
     
  9. krosfyah

    krosfyah Contributing Member

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    What this trade might tell us is that Swift didn't actually have much trade value.

    He is a proven underachevier. He had the opportunity and he couldn't even seperate himself from the likes of Juwan Howard. Why would a team want his long term contract for a mediocre bench warmer?
     
  10. mbiker

    mbiker Member

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    I would rather see Novak as a tall small forward and move TMac to the shooting guard spot. Novak will have a hard time rebounding in the NBA.
     
  11. Gutter Snipe

    Gutter Snipe Contributing Member

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    I'm so tired of people saying this. If you think that a super-athletic rookie with a questionable motor and questionable bball IQ would have been just as good for a win-now scenario as the the best +/- points guy, you just don't understand how the game works. It's not a question of comparing stats - it's their impact on the court.

    People have been trying unsuccessfully to pry Battier away from Memphis forever for a reason - he improves your defense at his position, he improves your spacing with his shooting percentage, and he makes smart plays. By the way, it's very difficult to find a person who is good defensively while being a good shooter without overpaying.

    The Rockets need to win now. How anybody can be upset about a draft where you got a solid starter (defense, good shooting percentage, good bball IQ) instantly in the 8th spot in a weak draft is beyond me.
     
  12. Oldschool Fan

    Oldschool Fan Member

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    There is no way shape or form that Novak will ever be Tom Chambers. Tom Chambers was a really good athlete. The guy had an incredible vertical leap for a guy his size. He took a ball on the fast break and dunked on Mark Jackson from the Knicks where his knees were on Jackson's shoulders!

    There is no comparison in athleticism. Novak is a good shooter and that is the extent of it. He is a second round pick, Chambers was a lottery pick. Chambers could take you off the dribble or shoot from the outside. He averaged 18.1 pts, 6.1rbs and 2.1asts over 16 years. His best year he had 27.2 pts, 7.0 rebs, and 2.3 asts.

    I Novak is the second coming of Bullard we should be happy. I sincerely hope he is not our starting power forward of the future or we are in real trouble.
     
  13. enbehay

    enbehay Member

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    I like Battier as a player, but after five years in the league his only upside is down. IMO we paid too dearly for him. I just feel Battier is not as good as Rudy Gay would be right away. Only time will tell who is right. And I pray I am wrong.

    Krosfyah -- I certainly am not a GM, but I can't help but thinking we could have gotten a raw player, a future draft pick -- something -- for Swift. Instead we got nothing. Watch Memphis trade him to New Jersey or Atlanta or somewhere for another piece to their puzzle.

    JeopardE -- I stand corrected on the Kobe Bryant error. But I would hope you get my broader point.
     
  14. Homey the Clown

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    Lets hope he turns out to be far better than Bullard ever was. :cool:
     
  15. ucansee2020

    ucansee2020 Contributing Member

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    You need to lay off your fascination on Rudy Gay. He hasn't set his foot on a NBA court, and you're already claiming he's gonna be better than Battier next year? IMO, Gay will be a bust in this league if he's as unmotivated as he was during his college career.
     
  16. krosfyah

    krosfyah Contributing Member

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    It'll be interesting to watch how this trade works out for each team.

    On the surface, it seems like Swift had some value but maybe it turns out he didn't. I'm sure the Rockets shopped Swift last year but we unable to move him for anything decent. I'll guess that Swift continues to languish on Memphis's bench.

    As long as Rudy Gay doesn't turn into Dwayne Wade, I'd bet this trade looks better and better as time passes. ...we'll see.
     
  17. A_3PO

    A_3PO Member

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    Hey, I'm tired of YOUR negativity more than JVG's. Tell us all since you know JVG's track record so well and can read his mind: What rookies has he sat on the bench when they should have gotten more playing time? In other words, back up your accusation with facts, if you can. Try using Google or NBA.com if you can't think of any.

    crash5179, on the subject of the thread, my "ideal" PF next to Yao would be someone like Shawn Marion. Marion's strengths fit Yao perfectly. Outside shot, doesn't take up space down low, good rebounder & garbage player, decent defender, extremely athletic, hustles and he gets out on the break. Yao's mass gives us the luxury of playing smaller at the 4. My pipedream was Rudy Gay developing into that kind of player. I realize it would have taken a few years (if ever) for him to get that good.

    As many have already said, Novak ain't gonna be Tom Chambers. But he can easily be better than the statue known as Matt Bullard. Like I said in another thread, if he can shoot well enough to make defenses adjust to him (like they did to Bull), he will be a solid rotation player for the next few years.
     
  18. crash5179

    crash5179 Contributing Member

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    Defensively Novak has the advantage being able to play in a zone defense which Chambers never had. I watched Tom Chambers tourch the Rockets many times. Chambers never seemed to me that he was all that athletic, but he was such a good shooter that everything with him started from the outside and his first step was just good enough that he was able to keep defenders off balance.

    I think Novak can do all of that plus in a zone defense he has the luxury of playing an area as opposed to a man. In any case I don't think he would have that much of a problem supplying as much defense as Howard.
     
  19. crash5179

    crash5179 Contributing Member

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    enbehay,

    I think JVG's biggest problem with rookies has always been mental mistakes. Those are the ones that really drive him nuts. Players that have been in the league and perticularly those that have played for him are just less likely to make the kinds of mistakes that drive jvg nuts.

    Having said all of that Novak by many accounts has a very high basketball IQ. He is a coach's son and hopefully will not make all the little mistakes that drive JVG crazy. Now I know that is asking a lot and Novak may be just as prone to rookie mistakes as anyone...only time will tell.
     
  20. crash5179

    crash5179 Contributing Member

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    I watched Tom Chambers many times and he never struck me as an athletic freek. Not even close. Chambers was an average to good athlete IMO. The thing that stands out the most in his stats is that he never averaged more than 7 boards in any single year.

    I'm not saying that Novak will ever be Chambers but he does seem to be cut out of the same mold to an extent. They are almost identical in size and weight while their strengths are both shooting and good IQ.

    The difference between the two is that Champers parlayed his strengths into an impresive NBA career. Novak is just starting his and Novak will never be the number one option on his team offensively.
     

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