i used to goto this pretty cool church every sunday a few years ago, but my family stopped going because a lot of people wanted the preacher to leave and there was a lot of hostility in the air. now at the church that my family goes to they asked the preacher to leave and the youth director came out and told everyone that he had a past with "p*rn" because the preacher that was forced to leave spilled all the information about the youth directors past so he could take him down with him. anyway so much craziness at all the churches ive been to. i thought church was supposed to be different. is it just the churches i goto that have so much drama?
While in a small town at my Aunt's, a Catholic priest shortened mass to 30 minutes so we'd beat the methodists to the only fancy restaurant in town on Mother's Day.
I don't think it's just your church. I find it strange how much of that goes on too, though. I don't have much tolerance for that kind of conduct from the leadership of a church, but they are humans too, fully capable of stumbling, falling, backsliding, or perhaps even not really being Christian. If you're uncomfortable with that church, don't be afraid to look for another, I tried quite a few before I found one I was comfortable with, but if it's just one or two individuals, maybe it's worth sticking it out.
This is a very sensitive subject, but I'll try and put my two cents in without stepping on too many toes. In my opinion, most church's have stopped being about God. They have become places where people get together to feel better about the wrongs that they do by harping on the wrongs that others do. Now please understand, I am not making a blanket statement here. I realize there are some very good places of worship around, but I think more people need to realize that there are some places claming to be places of worship that are nothing more than social clubs. I live in a VERY small town named Spurger. Couldn't be more than 1000 people. Yet we have at least 15 churches. We have 5 Pentacostal churches alone! Whats my point? If it was really about worship, really about praising their Lord why so many? Because it's not about worship, it's not about praising the Lord. Please understand, I am not writing this to offend anyone. These are just my opinions about the subject, nothing more...nothing less.
I agree completely, but I'll add that there are some good ones out there. I don't know what the break down would be, but if you don't feel comfortable with the one you're in, don't be afraid to look around. Even within the good ones there are different styles and emphasises that may work better for you.
Joe Joe: That's hilarious, mainly because I remember stuff just like that. The church I went to as a kid would let out early on Sunday's in the fall so everyone could get home in time to see football games (Oilers or Cowboys). If the preacher ran long, he would get angry scowls from the crowd and sometimes would even say something like, "I know you all want to get out of here to see the game..." Crazy.
I feel like I'm a christian person but I have very little faith in churchs of today.It seems to me like so many of them,all they care about is money.I know there are good ones but it is far to easy for con men to get into the business of religion...most of those on tv seem that way,nothing but con men. Last time I attended church,on a regular basis,was about 5 years ago.I just go for easter and christmas now.Anyway one of the preachers started going into this this deal about how GOD HIMSELF woke him from out of bed last night and told him everyone needed to give more money..not an angel or a vision but God ...anyway he went on and on and I could tell all these people were eating it up.All I could think about was the brand new lincoln town car the guy drove up in Anyway I never went back.
Churches, like schools, should be neighborhood entities. Too many monolithic churches reek of power not grace.
DM, what denomination are the churches you attended? I ask because I think it makes a difference in the political life within the church. Different denominations have different ways to structure their governance. Churches that are very democratic (like Baptist churches) give a lot of power to congregants which would make the question of whether a minister should stay or go very relevant to the church body. At the other end, very hierarchical churches (like the Roman Catholic) have ministers/priests appointed and congregants have little say in the matter. I imagine (though don't know) that there is less scandal over these things because there's little point in discussing them. At the same time, trouble can become a bigger deal because the hierarchy is less likely to respond to early signs of trouble. Republican churches (like the Presbyterian denominations) democratically elect their officials, but still have a top-down structure (like the US govt). I imagine this is the most stable form because positions are determined in a very orderly fashion but can still be somewhat responsive to the will of the congregation.
Check out this church in Northwest Houston on Veterans Memorial inside BELTWAY 8.... The Worship Center... This church is AWESOME - it's a non-denominational church everyone from past catholics to southern baptists to pentecosts go to this church... Coming from a dull boring catholic church this church brings life and excitement into the WORD... I rarely went to church for most of my life and now after my first visit last year I look forward to sundays! I promise you will enjoy it. They have a breakdance crew, christian rappers, christian disco, christian punk and alternative rock and this church has followers from all aspects of the globe... Its a multi-cultural church - if your looking for some direction in your life and faith - this is it. I have never cried in church before - and this past Sunday was my first... I'm not saying that your going to go and cry - I'm saying this church will make you FEEL SO GOOD. When you leave this church you will feel like a totally different person - you know things will be alright - you know GOD has a purpose for everything he does... MAN I CAN'T WAIT FOR SUNDAY!
Also - for the people who get mad when they see thier pastors or church leaders driving up in a Lincoln or live in a nice home.... WHAT DO YOU EXPECT??? Do you want them to drive up in a Ford Escort and live in the projects? Don't let that get in the way of you going to a church - go because your heart says to - go because you want god... God has blessed the church leaders for leading his people - God will deal with those who use the followers for money and greed - and god knows what your intentions were. So is it fair to say you a rare church visitor drove up in a lexus while your pastor (who has devoted his life to god and his teachings) drove up in a escort?
glad to hear you had a good experience with God and that you're so excited about your relationship with Him right now!! that's awesome!!
My Hometown is pittiful, all of the Churches began starting earlier, so they could get out sooner to make it to the best restraunts, and when that didnt work, they just started cutting things short. I am very glad now to be out of that small town atmosphere and into a Church where most people attend becasuse they want to, and are not upset when the sermon lasts 5 minutes longer than normal. For the first time in my life, I actually enjoy attending church, and I am not thinking about the chicken fried steak I'm gonna get afterwards. I wish more churches were like that.
I've gotten into discussions with my g/f about what percentage a pastor should take out of the church. Her dad is a pastor and he is more humble than the rest. She see's nothing wrong with a pastor pulling up in a lincoln while everyone else is driving 5 year old cars. When I attended church, the pastors grandson would pull up in a new car every two years. He was somewhat humble in what he drove. His son would always have a new car. A pastor should be humble. If its his true will to serve God, then he will only take the LEAST possible for himself and his family, leaving the rest to spread the word of God.
I agree Space Ghost. The presumption of selfish motivation to teach the Word exists when you see pastors living the lavish lifestyle. Look at someone like Billy Graham. This man drove the same pickup truck for 17 years and lived in the same house for 30. Talk about unpretentious! He has kept himself away from the appearance of impropriety, which many other pastors have not done. I don't begrudge anyone from driving nice cars, living large, etc.... but, as a man of God, you are supposed to have a CALLING on your life. Its unlike any other job. With that comes many sacrifices, but many joys as well. I have not been to church regularly the last several years. This thread makes me think maybe I should go... As an aside to HecticG81, I know the church you are talking about off of Veterans Memorial. Its close to Blue Bell subdivision. An old friend's cousin is the pastor there. Maybe thats one I should check out.
Yes - I have never been so excited about god in my life! This church is the reason. I tried inviting all my catholic friends telling them to experience something new and exciting, they just say they aren't use to people dancing and singing... Here is a couple of songs that brings me inspiration everytime I hear them - these are also the types of songs the church performs... I recommend you downloading the following songs... Shout to the Lord - WOW WORSHIP I Can Only Imagine - MercyME Again - they perform a variety of types of music... This type is called worship..
King David danced and sang and clapped for the Lord. There is nothing more worthy of celebration than the resurrection, in my mind! It's not my favorite style of worship, but I wouldn't mind it every once in a while...and if it's how you connect with the Spirit, than keep at it!! We have a jazz service at our church a few times a year...I totally dig that!!
thanks Hectik, I'll check those songs out.....I make so many excuses about why I haven't been going on Sundays, but I know I need to start going.
I can definitely relate to this thread. Tomorrow will be the first Sunday at another church (an episcopal one in my hometown). The rector (priest) at my old one fired the music director, who also happens to be my Godfather & someone who I have known all my life. He also was the person that got me started in going to the episcopal church. Needless to say, there were many people who were upset with his dismissal besides me. Here's a letter that I received via email from this one lady who has been a member of this church along with her husband for over 40 years. It's a great letter...one of the best that I have ever read: Dear Senior Warden: In the best interest of the wonderful people who elected you to the vestry, it is my opinion that you should resign. You were elected by these persons to represent them but you no longer represent us. You represent only the rector. As I told you, you are the parish's warden not the rector's, regardless of what he might have told you. You have told several people that you were unaware there was a problem. How can you continue to tell them this when I have emailed you on several occasions in the past weeks pleading for your help. All I got was I am the rector's warden. Let me say also don't bother to send me a long letter like the one you sent "Manny Ramirez". "Manny" is an adult and does not need anyone to tell him what to do. He has a mind of his own. Now about the music director, there is no person in our church that has done more for the young people than him. The fact that he took two young people to another episcopal church for confirmation is the rector's fault not the music director's. I had much rather a young person of mine go to a class geared for young people than a class that contains adults, lasts for 5 months, 2 hours every Sunday. Boring, boring, boring. We should be encouraging the youth not turning them off. The music director taking these 2 young people to this other episcopal church was a wonderful thing to do. These kids would probably not been able to last the 5 months nor would they have retained much of what was said. It is my understanding that the rector frowns on questions. As far as the choir goes, our church had a choir that was the envy of churches all over the state. The choir has always supported whatever the Priest wanted to do within reason. But we are only human and when a trumpet is all that is refused then who is being petty? But as my husband and I learned early on, if you don't agree with everything the rector says then you become an outcast as far as he is concerned. He can't fire us. The church is not the choir's livelihood. We do have other commitments. We have two people in the choir that total have almost 100 years of service. If not for dedication we could not say that. We have sung many, many times when we outnumbered the congregation. The music director and his reputation have brought many people into our church. I support the music director totally. This brings me to another point. Anything that my husband and I know we know from the person first hand. Since we have a priest and senior warden that do not see what is going on, or refuse to see, these people have come to us. And rest assured there are plenty of them. Since the rector could not get the "List" from my husband he decided to send the letter. In your words, "BAD MOVE". People that knew nothing now know a lot. Yes, we have contacted the Bishop's office. That is our right. I tried with you and failed and I know that the rector would not give me the time of day so what was our recourse? The rector will not run me off from our church. This is not his church. My husband and I will not rest until this rector is gone from our church. It is obvious that he will not change so the only alternative is for him to leave. Our problems can be resolved then and only then. Instead of having someone who has set personal preferences that do not allow for growth, our church will then have a Priest who thinks of the welfare of people rather than his own ego. Name withheld for privacy reasons Call me crazy, but I have a feeling that things are going to get much worse. Just pray that this situation gets resolved and that my music director gets re-instated.
