Kudos to vlaurelio for unintentionally pointing me to the link in another thread. This is a great opinion piece from Keith Olbermann, and I couldn't agree more. We're waiting for that apology, Mr. Bush. Bush owes us an apology The President of the United States owes this country an apology. It will not be offered, of course. He does not realize its necessity. There are now none around him who would tell him or could. The last of them, it appears, was the very man whose letter provoked the President into the conduct, for which the apology is essential. An apology is this President's only hope of regaining the slightest measure of confidence, of what has been, for nearly two years, a clear majority of his people. Not "confidence" in his policies nor in his designs nor even in something as narrowly focused as which vision of torture shall prevail -- his, or that of the man who has sent him into apoplexy, Colin Powell. In a larger sense, the President needs to regain our confidence, that he has some basic understanding of what this country represents -- of what it must maintain if we are to defeat not only terrorists, but if we are also to defeat what is ever more increasingly apparent, as an attempt to re-define the way we live here, and what we mean, when we say the word "freedom." Because it is evident now that, if not its architect, this President intends to be the contractor, for this narrowing of the definition of freedom. The President revealed this last Friday, as he fairly spat through his teeth, words of unrestrained fury directed at the man who was once the very symbol of his administration, who was once an ambassador from this administration to its critics, as he had once been an ambassador from the military to its critics. The former Secretary of State, Mr. Powell, had written, simply and candidly and without anger, that "the world is beginning to doubt the moral basis of our fight against terrorism." This President's response included not merely what is apparently the Presidential equivalent of threatening to hold one's breath, but within it contained one particularly chilling phrase. "Mr. President, former Secretary of State Colin Powell says the world is beginning to doubt the moral basis of our fight against terrorism," he was asked by a reporter. "If a former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and former secretary of state feels this way, don't you think that Americans and the rest of the world are beginning to wonder whether you're following a flawed strategy?" “If there's any comparison between the compassion and decency of the American people and the terrorist tactics of extremists, it's flawed logic,” Bush said. “It's just -- I simply can't accept that. It's unacceptable to think that there's any kind of comparison between the behavior of the United States of America and the action of Islamic extremists who kill innocent women and children to achieve an objective. Of course it's acceptable to think that there's "any kind of comparison." And in this particular debate, it is not only acceptable, it is obviously necessary, even if Mr. Powell never made the comparison in his letter. Some will think that our actions at Abu Ghraib, or in Guantanamo, or in secret prisons in Eastern Europe, are all too comparable to the actions of the extremists. Some will think that there is no similarity, or, if there is one, it is to the slightest and most unavoidable of degrees. What all of us will agree on, is that we have the right -- we have the duty -- to think about the comparison. And, most importantly, that the other guy, whose opinion about this we cannot fathom, has exactly the same right as we do: to think -- and say -- what his mind and his heart and his conscience tell him, is right. All of us agree about that. Except, it seems, this President. With increasing rage, he and his administration have begun to tell us, we are not permitted to disagree with them, that we cannot be right, that Colin Powell cannot be right. And then there was that one, most awful phrase. In four simple words last Friday, the President brought into sharp focus what has been only vaguely clear these past five-and-a-half years - the way the terrain at night is perceptible only during an angry flash of lightning, and then, a second later, all again is dark. “It's unacceptable to think," he said. It is never unacceptable to think. And when a President says thinking is unacceptable, even on one topic, even in the heat of the moment, even in the turning of a phrase extracted from its context, he takes us toward a new and fearful path -- one heretofore the realm of science fiction authors and apocalyptic visionaries. That flash of lightning freezes at the distant horizon, and we can just make out a world in which authority can actually suggest it has become unacceptable to think. Thus the lightning flash reveals not merely a President we have already seen, the one who believes he has a monopoly on current truth. It now shows us a President who has decided that of all our commanders-in-chief, ever, he alone has had the knowledge necessary to alter and re-shape our inalienable rights. This is a frightening, and a dangerous, delusion, Mr. President. If Mr. Powell's letter -- cautionary, concerned, predominantly supportive -- can induce from you such wrath and such intolerance, what would you say were this statement to be shouted to you by a reporter, or written to you by a colleague? "Governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government.” Those incendiary thoughts came, of course, from a prior holder of your job, Mr. Bush. They were the words of Thomas Jefferson. He put them in the Declaration of Independence. Mr. Bush, what would you say to something that anti-thetical to the status quo just now? Would you call it "unacceptable" for Jefferson to think such things, or to write them? Between your confidence in your infallibility, sir, and your demonizing of dissent, and now these rages better suited to a thwarted three-year old, you have left the unnerving sense of a White House coming unglued - a chilling suspicion that perhaps we have not seen the peak of the anger; that we can no longer forecast what next will be said to, or about, anyone who disagrees. Or what will next be done to them. On this newscast last Friday night, Constitiutional law Professor Jonathan Turley of George Washington University, suggested that at some point in the near future some of the "detainees" transferred from secret CIA cells to Guantanamo, will finally get to tell the Red Cross that they have indeed been tortured. Thus the debate over the Geneva Conventions, might not be about further interrogations of detainees, but about those already conducted, and the possible liability of the administration, for them. That, certainly, could explain Mr. Bush's fury. That, at this point, is speculative. But at least it provides an alternative possibility as to why the President's words were at such variance from the entire history of this country. For, there needs to be some other explanation, Mr. Bush, than that you truly believe we should live in a United States of America in which a thought is unacceptable. There needs to be a delegation of responsible leaders -- Republicans or otherwise -- who can sit you down as Barry Goldwater and Hugh Scott once sat Richard Nixon down - and explain the reality of the situation you have created. There needs to be an apology from the President of the United States. And more than one. But, Mr. Bush, the others -- for warnings unheeded five years ago, for war unjustified four years ago, for battle unprepared three years ago -- they are not weighted with the urgency and necessity of this one. We must know that, to you, thought with which you disagree -- and even voice with which you disagree and even action with which you disagree -- are still sacrosanct to you. The philosopher Voltaire once insisted to another author, "I detest what you write, but I would give my life to make it possible for you to continue to write." Since the nation's birth, Mr. Bush, we have misquoted and even embellished that statement, but we have served ourselves well, by subscribing to its essence. Oddly, there are other words of Voltaire's that are more pertinent still, just now. "Think for yourselves," he wrote, "and let others enjoy the privilege to do so, too." Apologize, sir, for even hinting at an America where a few have that privilege to think and the rest of us get yelled at by the President. Anything else, Mr. Bush, is truly unacceptable. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6210240/ Keep D&D Civil.
“If there's any comparison between the compassion and decency of the American people and the terrorist tactics of extremists, it's flawed logic,” Bush said. “It's just -- I simply can't accept that. It's unacceptable to think that there's any kind of comparison between the behavior of the United States of America and the action of Islamic extremists who kill innocent women and children to achieve an objective. Of course it's acceptable to think that there's "any kind of comparison." -- there's the nub of the issue, and as long as you, keith, and the rest of the reacto-libs insist on making such comparisons, you will continue to wander in the elctoral wilderness.
This article is 100% accurate to ignore the motivations behind the enemies actions is not only unacceptable, it is downright stupid. DD
....and that is the example of a totally closed off mind for whom reality is too disturbing and discomforting and thus dismissed. The inability of GWB and his cheering section to comprehend that others around the world don't/won't necessarily feel this way is why the Bush Doctrine crashed and burned, literally.
Yes it is acceptable to think that there's any kind of comparison. He isn't saying they are the same. It is part of living in a free society, which most Democrats seem to value. Torture is torture and is wrong no matter who does it. The fact that the U.S. has done it, and Saddam's fools have done it means at least on that point we can compare. I think the U.S. still comes out favorably in that comparison, but it certainly isn't wrong to think about the comparison.
sam, since the feelings of "others around the world" is of such over-arching importance to you, i'm assuming you support giving geneva protections to those currently help at guantanamo and elsewhere in the bush-junta gulag. i assume you feel this way because it would afford similar protections to our troops, were they captured by "enemy combatants." i would appreciate it if you could cite some past examples to support your case, for instance, how many US prisoners of war have been captured by current (at time of their capture) geneva signatories, and how did their signatures on said accords affect the captured prisoners expereinces? thanks in advance...
As much as I detest it I agree I have found that Americans favor CERTAINTY The Republicans are CERTAIN . .they are SURE they are RIGHT! They say so with out a thought or even a doubt that they are wrong If they are shown to be wrong. . the say . My Bad. .but I'm right about everything else Americans like folx who are CERTAIN even if they are wrong Someone shows Doubt . .the idea that someone else's ideas could be right To Various Americans this shows Uncertainty and weakness This is why the President is President .. . IMO An 'Open Mind' is seens as Flopping and lack of backbone Rocket River
Ok, let's look at Jessica Lynch and the others who were captured with her. The reporter from the Christian Science Monitor, the Italian journalist who's bodyguard was shot, etc. There are plenty of examples where prisoners by enemy combatants weren't tortured, or tried without being able to see the evidence presented against them.
This is right on the mark, and that's a serious problem for Bush. His administration cannot admit that they made any mistakes at all in the decisions to go to Iraq, and their complete failure in the Iraq occupation and reconstruction. Ignore all evidence to the contrary, and just say things like "stay the course", and you are seen as in control.
ANYONE WHO BUYS INTO THIS FEARMONGERING NEEDS TO ENLIST AND GO FIGHT.....IMO if you seriously feel threatened it is an act of cowardice not to fight...no matter how old you are. SEND A POOR KID and go protect your way of life....THAT IS AMERICAN! Also standing up for those kids when they and you were lied to is AMERICAN! I can't believe that conservatives in this country were upset at Clinton for his lie and not the BUSH lie....talk about partisanship and UNAMERICAN! Bass, what torture do you prefer the terrorists to perform on your child? Seriously if you support torture, and these individuals in their hearts they are fighting to protect their freedom of religion, and they capture your son, what method would you prefer they use on him? This is a harsh perspective but its easier to support something like torture when you don't have to do it or aren't the victim. THE APOLOGY WILL NEVER COME.....BUT CAN YOU IMAGINE THE SECRET SERVICE PROTECTION THIS MAN IS GOING TO NEED THE REST OF HIS LIFE......HE'S GOING TO LIVE A SAD EXISTENCE. I can also guarantee that Powell will get the last say once GW is out of office. So he's due some karma. Chalabi supplied the bd evidence, a friend of the Bush family, the Bush adm. wanted to make Chalabi pres. of Iraq, the evidence was flawed, and now the FBI is investigating Chalabi for being a spy for Iran, and that Iran gave Chalabi the false evidence.....now Iran either is the scapegoat for this war or Iran played Bush like the cowboy clown he is. YOU WANT APOLOGY FROM BUSH....I never believed him in the first place. ME...I WANT AN APOLOGY from Americans who supported the war and tried to ostracize different opinions, an UNAMERICAN and UNPATRIOTIC thing to do, and to make things worse to put our troops in the middle of the debate. AMERICA is divided between those who search for enlightenment and those with blind faith....WHO DO YOU THINK SEES A CLEAR FUTURE FOR AMERICA?
Yeah basso, it's funny that you mock it, I tend to think that international reaction is a pretty f-cking impotant component of foreign policy by definition, as much as you may differ in that regard. But anyway, you're saying that no captive american has ever been treated in accord with the Geneva convention ever, at any point in time? That fact thtat there are many living POWs (lining up against you on this issue) illustrates that you're wrong in that suggestion.