I was watching Larry King Live, and a lady calling in proclaiming she was baptisit is a mormon community asked why the christians muslims jews and catholics have in common. I am not trying to cause a huge heated debate but aren't Catholics christian? Btw, I am not Christian so I don't want to sound like an ignorant Christian.
Sometimes when people (maybe only in America?) say "Christian," they are really referring to Protestant Christians, excluding Catholics. But yes, Catholics are Christians, in the proper sense of the word "Christian."
"she was baptisit is a mormon community: What did she mean here? From my philosophy class in college about fifteen years ago: Christians, Muslims and Jews are monotheistic superstitions, I mean religions, oops, and share many of the same characters or figures such as Abraham (everyone uses him as their patriarch, even though he eats non kosher), David, Moses, and Allah/Eloh/God. The later religions incorporate figures from the earlier religions as well. Jesus is in Islam tradition but not as a deity or making a sacrifice of his life for all people, "merely" a prophet.
My father's side of the family is devout southern baptist while my mother's side of the family is casual catholic. It was interesting to see both sides of the religious debate between protestants and catholics. In the end I determined that although both were utter bs, I'll give catholics the nod for being more tolerant and having a better sense of humor about religion. Never in the first 15 years of my life that i actually bothered attending a catholic mass did I hear a priest or pretty much anyone else ever talk negatively about other versions of christianity. When I went to the baptist services on weekends that we visited that side of the family I heard a lot of bashing on anyone who wasn't a baptist. The usual crap about not seeing the light, have you been saved by jesus, you're going to hell if you don't listen to us scare tactics.
By way of clarification, the 12 Apostles of Jesus Christ were the first Catholics. Not until Martin Luther left the church were there any other Christian denominations.
I saw a pamphlet about this quite some time ago. I didn't read it, but my roommate in college explained it to me. The argument is that Catholics didn't exist until something like 700 AD, but that the Baptist line goes back all the way to Jesus. It didn't really make a lot of sense. That's a different approach to the Catholic vs. Baptist argument, in trying to say that the Catholic Church is an offshoot of the Baptists, not the other way around. That's not really the typical argument though, it's just one I have seen. <a href="http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0071/0071_01.asp">Jack T. Chick has some pamphlets on this</a>. There are a number of arguments, but the most significant argument that Catholics are not Christians comes from the difference of belief of salvation through faith in God alone (Baptist, other Protestant) and salvation through faith and works, not either one alone (Catholic, some Protestant). Other arguments are about the Pope and Confession, but the biggest one is the salvation argument. I really don't want to get into an argument about this, but I can provide some background. The Catholic legacy is the Popes. The very first Pope was St. Peter. After Peter was put to death, his successor was St. Linus, then St. Anacletus and so on. Each were part of the same organization that exists now as the Catholic Church. Now, the Church has undergone quite a number of changes over its history, and it would be possible to say that it was not Catholic until a certain point after Peter, and that the aforementioned organization is flawed as of <u>(insert time here)</u>, when it became known as "Catholic". Then, one could argue that when the Catholic part arose, it was a departure from "Christianity" (depending on how you define Christianity).
Well, in my book, a Christian is a believer or follower of Christ. What is a follower of Christ? Well, by definition a follower of Christ would believe what he said, and he said that you would have to confess your sins, ask for forgiveness, and believe in him. This is not what the Catholic church has historically taught. However, any Catholic who did the above would be a Christian, so I would definitely argue that some Catholics are Christians. I have also heard that there are some born-again Catholic churches that have broken away from the confessions to a priest, etc., but maintain other Catholic traditions because some people are more comfortable worshipping in that style.
I'm not very qualified to answer that in detail, but basically the Catholic church inserted priests as the interface between God/Jesus and the common person. In the practice of confession, you tell the priest what you did wrong, he listens and assigns you some things to do (like reciting the Lord's Prayer 10 times), and you feel better. This has extended from the Middle Ages when people bought indulgences (small holy articles) from the church for forgiveness of sins. In either case, you are attempting to earn your forgiveness and salvation, when the Bible clearly states that "it is not by works, but by faith that you are saved." From a purely secular point of view, it is interesting to note that both of these systems meet people's emotional and psychological needs. In the confession system, the priest acts as a mandatory counselor for the community. The other thing I object to is the semi-deification of ordinary (but good) people such as the mother of Jesus and the Apostle Peter into saints to the extent that some people will pray to them. The Pope is another example. I don't see any mention of the Pope or saints in the Bible, so I believe that they are an invention of the Catholic church.
Some Catholics are Christians...Some Baptists are Christians...Some Non-Denominationals are Christians...etc. Romans 10:9 "and if you shalt confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised him from the dead, you will be saved." The difference between most "Christians" and Christians is - do you believe in your heart or in your head?
Um...what about the Great Schism of 1054 that divided the church into Catholic and Orthodox? That was over 400 years before Martin Luther was born.
Heretic: I just wanted to point out that Southern Baptists are not representative of Protestants on the whole -- many Protestant denominations tend to be far more tolerant than Southern Baptists and even Catholicism
