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Anyone who wants Morey to get fired is a *insert a more appropriate word*

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by omgTHEpotential, Nov 27, 2015.

  1. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    Oh, come on. Generally we all use playoff team examples to illustrate something, if not title winning teams; otherwise the argument is "So, what, they have never won." The point is title teams go through a gauntlet of HOFers, so mentioning the Spurs is very valid. It is clear that Duncan, Parker and Ginobody could have ran a motion offense, but they didn't. Why?

    Sorry you can't accept the fact that Motion Offenses are not a silver bullet. They are not necessarily the best offense for both bad teams and good teams.

    Flaws of Motion
    • ]A major flaw of Motion Offense is the defense can dictate who takes the shot per possession; that is, you can slack off the weak link to force the motion to pass to them in a predictable manner.
    • A second major flaw is it will cause more busted plays if everyone isn't on the same page; eg., players cut to the same spot.
    • A third major flaw is motion offenses can move any player anywhere on the offensive side, such that transition defensive assignments become less predictable, too.
    Attack offenses are noted for not having those problems as frequently.

    Advantages of Attack Offense
    • Attack offenses tend to have better transition defense, because offensive movement is more restricted, whereby coaches like JVG leverage that to position releasers ahead of any transition offense.
    • Attack offenses can field more defensive specialists, as evident in the wave of 3 and D wing players we see in the NBA now.
    • Attack offenses keep control in the hands of the offense to dictate who takes the shot.
    • Attack offenses force double teams in a predictable manner making it easier for role players to know exactly when and where to cut as a counter attack...requiring less BBall IQ.
    • There are a plethora of plays for defensive teams with less offensive IQ to run whereby it is very difficult to double someone without giving up a lob/layup.

    Most top defensive teams in the history of the NBA ran attack offenses
    Wade won a Title with a predictable attack offense.
    Rudy T got the most wins out of Francis/Mobley with predictability throw down the opponents throats.
    McHale got the most out of the Rockets last year via predictability
    Clippers are predictable, relying on the creativity of Paul and Griffin ISOs

    I'm a firm believer none of those teams would be as successful running less predictable read and react offense.
     
    #101 heypartner, Nov 28, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2015
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  2. larsv8

    larsv8 Contributing Member

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    Doesn't matter what offense you run if you can't hit shots.
     
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  3. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    Exactly this. A good system leads to open shots, if you can't hit the open shots, no system can help you.
     
  4. J Hard

    J Hard Member

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    Anyone who still has blind loyalty to this guy and gets sensitive are blimd sheep.

    I make decisions off performance, history and projection, and the prospects arent as good as our accomplishments during the Morey era.

    Hes swung for the fences, made some good moves but has had more blunders. Id rather a SA type gm whose not trying to be a superstar and not trying to be the behind the scenes coach. Its an asenine unproven philosophy.
     
  5. aelliott

    aelliott Contributing Member

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    I'm not sure that the rate of fouling a jump shooter from midrange is all that different than the rate of fouling a jump shooter at the arc. Would be an interesting comparision but I don't know anyplace that those stats are available.
     
  6. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    Hence why Rubio sucks!! :grin:

    Back to topic. Agree about shooting, despite defensive teams that have succeeded greatly with only average eFG%s. Saying no talk of systems matter without shooting is a wee bit too simplistic for my taste. And besides, coaches don't really think that way. They still have to pick a system best suited for the team. They don't give up.

    Thus, it is still interesting to discuss system.

    One system can still produce more Wins than another. And if you want to focus more on trades and what we need in personnel: One system will be easier to find and obtain the missing pieces for than another.
     
  7. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    Well instead of "shooting" you can substitute the word "execution". If you are getting the shots or the layups the system intends for you to get and you are merely missing them the problem is execution, not system. No system can work without proper execution.

    For the sake of conversation, if an offensive system led to a wide open layup attempt on every single possession it would be a REALLY amazing system, but you wouldn't win a single game if your guys weren't making those wide open layups.

    The same could be applied to passing. The system could set you up with an easy pass that would lead to a dunk, but if you don't make that easy pass, or you find a way to screw it up, then it fails.

    I think that's what is going on with the Rockets. They are simply screwing things up over and over again either by missing wide open shots, failing to make the correct pass, failing to make a proper pass, failing to catch the pass, failing to make the layup, or failing to even run the system at all. It's how you take a very talented team and make them look like the worst team in the NBA.
     
  8. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    Hey, now! 2nd worst team. Unless you mean, worst non-tanking team.
     
  9. oakdogg

    oakdogg Contributing Member

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    Have GM's always made coaching decisions? I must be slow. Back in the day, I thought owners hired coaches as well as GM's. GM's handled personnel. Didn't think they meddled with coaching so much?
     
  10. puppytigers

    puppytigers Member

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    The statistics that have been brought up so far do not go into the heart of the issue being discussed, which is whether the offense could improve by reducing contested 3PAs and converting them into open long 2PAs.

    The key statistic to consider is therefore:

    % accuracy of contested 3PAs * 1.5 vs % accuracy of open long 2PAs


    Replacing the former with the accuracy of Rockets' 3PAs results in an upward bias, since contested 3PAs have lower accuracy than 3PAs as a whole. Replacing the latter with the accuracy of long 2PAs as a whole results in a downward bias, since long 2PAs as a whole have lower accuracy than open long 2PAs.
     
  11. JeffB

    JeffB Contributing Member
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    This is a great discussion....

    We may also want to factor in offensive rebounding so we consider if missing more shots leads to more transition scoring opportunities for the opposing team. Is it worth the decrease in offensive efficiency to hit a closer shot at a higher rate (be less efficient) while helping limit defensive transition scoring opportunities?

    It would just be making the obvious point that the fact the Rockets are missing so much means they have to be more effective on defense and probably play more transition D, things they also suck at.

    Maybe my question sucks, but just asking. :grin:
     
  12. calurker

    calurker Contributing Member

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    If Morey were YOUR boss, constantly eyeing "upgrades" at your position, would you work your ass off for him? Come on now, be honest.

    And now add coach to that? What self-respecting, decent coach will be willing to come here and be a puppet, only to be thrown under the bus when the winds change?

    This mess is Morey's creation, and he needs to own it and fix it, or he needs to be gone. I have doubts he can fix it now that it's an emotional issue, because he's shown time and again that he's a savant out of tune with the human element (i.e. an economist :D).
     
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  13. JeffB

    JeffB Contributing Member
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    Fair point on the players. The players in the last admitted to playing distractedly until the trade deadline passed. Morey's constant dealing, and moreso his constant talking about dealing in the media, put the guys on edge as the deadline in creeped up.

    But Les Alexander fired the coach. Not Morey. Morey wanted to keep McHale. This is Les Alexander's creation and Morey is his tool -- and ultimately also responsible. Heck, even the constant trade and upgrade thing was a result of demands Les made. Morey wanted to take the lumps in a losing season and draft back to the top. Les demanded no losing. So that left trades and free agency to get talent.

    Les is the boss.
     
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  14. calurker

    calurker Contributing Member

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    Ah, good ol' Les. Traders don't build, they trade. You never rebuild because you never build anything in the first place. He inherited the team that somebody else built, won a couple championships (though perhaps with some credit for the second via a big trade), and started his trading ways, Barkley, Pippen, Francis, T-Mac, Harden, Howard...but with 0 to show for it. Anyway, I digress.
     
  15. langal

    langal Contributing Member

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    Morey really wanted Carmelo
     
  16. cheke64

    cheke64 Member

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    Les had to step up. I guarantee you this team would've lost with Mchale against sixers.

    Cyberx said Les met his end of the deal now somebody needs to pay up. This is a message to Morey
     
  17. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Contributing Member
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    Why are complaints about Morey not keeping players and not allowing mid-range shots coming in the year that he kept practically everyone and we started shooting mid-range shots? Of course there's room to criticize everybody because the team is a mess now but a lot of these Morey criticisms are way out of date.
     
  18. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    Does this hypothetical mean I'm an NBA basketball player or NBA coach? If so, yes, I'd work my ass off, because I want to play a game for a living.
     
  19. calurker

    calurker Contributing Member

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    Ah, the old "if only xyz, I'd never complain again" routine. Well guess what, you still would, because everything is relative, and we process information through perceived differences in our immediate surroundings, and other teams' players do not live with the same morbid fear of the trade deadline as the Rockets'.
     
  20. calurker

    calurker Contributing Member

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    Because once you have that reputation, for better or worse, it sticks with you (or takes years to wash off). When's the last time Morey stood by his men?
     

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